Dailies are starting to burn me out ..

60 Night Elf Druid
3905
This reminds me of Vanilla raids, where there was no limit to the stacking effects of potions. "Oh sure if you want to go all-out and be hardcore you can farm endlessly for herbs to make potions for every buff for every player in the raid, every time they die, but only the really hardcore players will do that. Everybody else will just raid normally."

And of course the result was that everybody felt compelled to have every potion every raid. If you haven't beaten boss X yet, why try to do it with fewer buffs? And the farming for these potions proved to be yet another barrier to entry to raiding. Eventually Blizzard got rid of the old potion system and limited it to a "more reasonable number of potions" per raid, one guardian, one battle.
100 Orc Warlock
15080
On a related note, why are the Klaxxi ilvl 463 weapons only purchasable at exalted. I mean what is the point? By the time many people reach exalted they will already have an equivalent or better weapon.
90 Worgen Mage
7765
10/12/2012 11:14 AMPosted by Bashiok
For a hardcore progression raider, I don't think it's unreasonable that additional time and requirements are needed to be a hardcore progression raider.


And if someone dies from playing too long without a break as has happened in the past you know that this is going to be quoted and further vilify the game we all play.
90 Night Elf Druid
8330
10/12/2012 10:53 AMPosted by Bashiok
But we think that's a decision each player can make for themselves.


I'm not doing dailies yet, but I'm interested in this shift in position (at least what seems to be a shift in position, but perhaps I'm missing or not thinking about some related issues).

When lockouts on 10/25 raiding happened it seemed to suggest that Blizzard thought that people could not make a decision for themselves whether or not doing both 10/25 was too much -- so, it was imposed on them that they could not do both each week.

Before that lock we could do a guild 10 and then a two or three guild 25 with "friend" guilds (normal, not LFR since there was no LFR) -- that was fun when we wanted to do it.

Will there be some consistency in such policy about people taking responsibility for their own game play and allow more flexibility for those who want to raid more or do other things more (or less)? Perhaps unlocking the 10/25 raiding choice for those who want to do it?
90 Blood Elf Paladin
10110
I hear what you are saying Bashiok but people who are raiders often feel the pressure to level every faction asap. With the removal of head enchants it seems like there's no focus on one faction at a time. Everyone is on golden lotus dailies and it's been creating "traffic jams" in any questing area. Not to mention the fact that dailies rest if you didn't complete them so everyone everyday will be in the same areas.

Valor and justice have caps and focus, honor and conquest have caps and focus, and even raids are gated. Something in the dailies should be "gated."

Your cookie jar comparison is accurate but people (IMO) have very little self control, especially when it comes to addictions. Maybe Mom and Dad telling us one or two is enough wouldn't be so bad.
90 Pandaren Monk
11530
10/12/2012 11:14 AMPosted by Bashiok
The problem here Bashiok is that for your hardcore progression raiders, unlocking all the valor gear feels like a requirement, not a thing we can do when we feel like it. Between that and trying to maximize tillers so I can have mats for 300 stat food (which again, a lot of guilds are requiring from their raiders), WoW is monopolizing all of my gaming time. I get that you guys want to make sure the casual players don't get bored, but in the process of doing so you've basically forced the hardcore progression raiders to -have- to play all the time.


For a hardcore progression raider, I don't think it's unreasonable that additional time and requirements are needed to be a hardcore progression raider.


Can we at least get something done with the months worth of lesser tokens I have rather than them cluttering my bags?
1 Orc Warrior
0
10/12/2012 11:14 AMPosted by Bashiok
The problem here Bashiok is that for your hardcore progression raiders, unlocking all the valor gear feels like a requirement, not a thing we can do when we feel like it. Between that and trying to maximize tillers so I can have mats for 300 stat food (which again, a lot of guilds are requiring from their raiders), WoW is monopolizing all of my gaming time. I get that you guys want to make sure the casual players don't get bored, but in the process of doing so you've basically forced the hardcore progression raiders to -have- to play all the time.


For a hardcore progression raider, I don't think it's unreasonable that additional time and requirements are needed to be a hardcore progression raider.


So you're basically implementing a system where hardcore players are rewarded for grinding every day... and if a normal raider just wants to gear up, they're stuck even farther behind in progression due to nonsensical rep grinds?

His statement doesn't only apply to hardcore players -- but to anyone who wishes to raid the 5.0 content. I'm in a fairly average guild and right now we're *hoping* we can start raiding on a regular basis again within 2 months. We had a solid group of 10 at the end of Cata... and now it's fading away as people are burning out and seeing that they'll have to do endless grinds just so they can resume normal raiding.
90 Worgen Warlock
11160
10/12/2012 11:14 AMPosted by Bashiok
The problem here Bashiok is that for your hardcore progression raiders, unlocking all the valor gear feels like a requirement, not a thing we can do when we feel like it. Between that and trying to maximize tillers so I can have mats for 300 stat food (which again, a lot of guilds are requiring from their raiders), WoW is monopolizing all of my gaming time. I get that you guys want to make sure the casual players don't get bored, but in the process of doing so you've basically forced the hardcore progression raiders to -have- to play all the time.


For a hardcore progression raider, I don't think it's unreasonable that additional time and requirements are needed to be a hardcore progression raider.


I agree, but is forcing daily completion fun for them? That's the question. And it's an especially important one, because while the hardcore raiding population is far from being the majority of the playerbase, they are a significant chunk.

Everyone has stuff they don't want to do but have to do in order to enjoy something both in this life, and this game. But we're all here in World of Warcraft to have a good time in the end. Why add more potentially "not fun" things to the checklist? I find the dailies somewhat enjoyable, so this doesn't really apply to me. But to my friends who already quit or are considering quitting, I ask why dailies are a requirement to be competitive in PvE?
90 Pandaren Priest
12060
10/12/2012 11:23 AMPosted by Scath
On a related note, why are the Klaxxi ilvl 463 weapons only purchasable at exalted. I mean what is the point? By the time many people reach exalted they will already have an equivalent or better weapon.


Ghostcrawler said they are meant to be cool transmogs and not raiding gear. It was on his twitter
10/12/2012 11:21 AMPosted by Kalorian
I personally prefer the dailies to just sitting around in Stormwind waiting for dungeon queues to pop every 20 minutes.


I appreciate that you enjoy the dailies, and I in no way think they should be removed or downgraded. However, I do not enjoy the dailies so what am I to do? Do something I don't enjoy in a game that I pay for, or not get my enchanting/LW stuff?

I think Blizzard had it perfect with the mix of dailies and dungeon rep tabards. Were the tabards a bit too good? Probably, but now that dailies have the charms as an additional carrot I think the people that want that will keep doing them and the people that don't could use the tabard and gain rep. For those with unlimited time, YOU COULD DO BOTH!!! Get to exalted even faster if that is what you want. Set a limit on dungeon rewards, 1K per day, 2K, whatever, but give us a CHOICE.

Wasn't that a big thing Bash? Play the game how you want to play it...
90 Human Warlock
14295
10/12/2012 11:24 AMPosted by Nexxdominus
For a hardcore progression raider, I don't think it's unreasonable that additional time and requirements are needed to be a hardcore progression raider.


And if someone dies from playing too long without a break as has happened in the past you know that this is going to be quoted and further vilify the game we all play.


Do you have a parasite on your brain? What kind of thought process IS this?
90 Gnome Mage
9310
10/12/2012 11:14 AMPosted by Bashiok
For a hardcore progression raider, I don't think it's unreasonable that additional time and requirements are needed to be a hardcore progression raider.


I guess I understand the attitude of telling progression raiders "tough luck" even though requiring them to log in every single day seems a little foolish, but whatever.

Is the attitude towards casual players who cannot log in every day also "tough luck" basically meaning the only people you guys are designing the game for any more are people who can play every single day? I kind of get the feeling the answer is yes considering you took away the 7 dungeons a week, and pushed dailies hard.
100 Draenei Shaman
16730
The golden lotus dailies are daunting. Why not give us less dailies for each faction and just bump up the rep you get for each quest. 5 or 6 dailies a faction is MORE than enough.
90 Draenei Paladin
10060
People were crying about not having anything to do so now you have TONS to do!

Grats crybabies.


Yes, because they totally answered the prayers of everyone who was tired of 3 dungeons and the same 8 raid bosses for 9 months in Dragon Soul by putting in a bunch of mind-numbing daily quests.

I wasn't one of the ones complaining, I just played with alts and let my sub lapse until there was new content, as did a great many other people.

It would have been nice to have new dungeons or raids added at the end of Cataclysm. If they'd added 500 dailies, they would still have lost a million subs.

Nobody asked for dailies. Nobody had issues with tabards awarding rep. And putting in 4 billion dailies won't make people who run out of dungeon or raid content not complain when it is used up. (and yes it will STILL get used up, even if they dribble it out like they are clearly doing now)

Dailies are nothing more than a continuation of the questing time suck that is levelling. If the game consisted of nothing but levelling quests, it would not have 10 million players.
Edited by Hephaestion on 10/12/2012 11:30 AM PDT
10 Gnome Rogue
50
10/12/2012 11:11 AMPosted by Pajuh
People were crying about not having anything to do so now you have TONS to do!


Dear Blizzard,

After leaving us with zero new content for 9+ months in Cata we would really appreciate it if in MoP you would lock tons of content and rewards behind 8000 daily quests that we'll feel forced to do until our eyes bleed.

- Said by no one ever.
1 Orc Warrior
0
10/12/2012 11:28 AMPosted by Analt
Is the attitude towards casual players who cannot log in every day also "tough luck" basically meaning the only people you guys are designing the game for any more are people who can play every single day? I kind of get the feeling the answer is yes considering you took away the 7 dungeons a week, and pushed dailies hard.


It can also be reflected by implementing only Heroics at level cap. If you're at that point where you're just missing 1 or 2 slots of 463 (and I'm sure many have experienced this), you can only Q the relevant dungeon(s) once a day. You can do randoms, but unless you have infinite time I just leave if it's not the one I was hoping for -- and rarely do you get the one you need.
90 Human Warrior
9275
I hit Exalted with the Order of the Cloud Serpents or whatever. I'm revered with Klaxxi, Tillers, Anglers, and Golden Lotus. Now I'm taking a break from them. Think I'll just tend my farm for cooking mats and ride around on my Golden Cloud Serpent.
100 Draenei Shaman
17475
The problem here Bashiok is that for your hardcore progression raiders, unlocking all the valor gear feels like a requirement, not a thing we can do when we feel like it. Between that and trying to maximize tillers so I can have mats for 300 stat food (which again, a lot of guilds are requiring from their raiders), WoW is monopolizing all of my gaming time. I get that you guys want to make sure the casual players don't get bored, but in the process of doing so you've basically forced the hardcore progression raiders to -have- to play all the time.

Sounds like your guild needs a system set up for raider donations that ultimately supplies the food raiders need like most hardcore guilds do.

Besides, your guild hasn't cleared normal mode, therefore you are not hardcore. You'll survive skipping a few dailies sometimes.
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