Hunter PvP Guide (6.0)

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100 Human Hunter
9500
a. Does widow venom and serpent sting still cancel out each other ? In other words is it still one or the other ?

b. I have the freeze glyph, as I thought it went to all of the ice style traps...but still in a sticky situation, could you not trap, RF, use PS for some crazy nice damage on a single target ? 20% crit+the pvp power bonus from RF with 4 piece and PS will = big damage ? Unless of course the trinket...but then you always could readiness and re-use..hmm..

c. Did they nerf the multiple heals from using stampede glyph and spirit beasts ?


a. No, you can have both serpent sting and widow's venom on your target. I don't think they've ever cancelled eachother out...

b. This is one of those things that looks much better on paper. Lots of classes these days have more than one way to get out of CC so you can rarely count on that actually working. If you readiness and re-trap them both your scatter shot and trap will be 1/2 duration meaning your trap will have to be dropped ASAP with pinpoint precision and leaves very little room for error or lag. Not to mention a lot of the times your freeze trap target will not be your dps target and the glyph will be wasted. And there's just so many better glyph options that you're going to be better off using something else.

c. Yes they did. Spirit beast copies now only heal for 25% of the original Spirit beast's heal. So you will now get the equivalent of 2 spirit mends on you instead of the previous 5. So it's still nice, just not a "lay on hands" heal like it was before.
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100 Dwarf Hunter
8110
Ok thanks. Lol showing my age in this game, but i remember waaaay back, I guess it was not widow's venom but we had a sting that reduce healing, a lot like this, but you could only have one sting. Meh..no worries.

I have already changed up things, after my taste of arena two's.....and yeah I am already peeved about how many times you can be feared.....
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100 Human Hunter
9500
You seem to give alot of info aboout arenas, I do nothing but BGs as I dont have the time to do much more. What would you say is the stat priority for BM in BGs. For a hunter ofcoarse , forum wouldnt let me swap out chars.


I'd say for BG's you're going to want to be doing as much sustained DPS as possible on flag carriers and such (especially if they're getting healed and the fight is dragging on) so Mastery would be your go to stat for BG's as BM followed by Crit and then Haste.
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100 Human Hunter
9500
Thx for the guide, it helped me alot when trying to get my rating up for 3s ^.^


You're very welcome sir : )
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90 Human Warrior
8645
Very nice guide :)
Just a quick question (might be a silly one), does mastery for bm hunters improve the damage of pets summoned through stampede?
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90 Night Elf Hunter
15970
Yes, but that dmg increase goes before the 75% dmg reduction stampede pets get (the 4 bonus pets deal 25% of normal dmg) since for BM pets normal dmg is boosted by mastery, the dmg they would normally deal is reduced by 75%. So stampede is more powerful for BM, but then again, so is dire beast, blink strike, AMoC, and Lynx Rush.
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90 Orc Hunter
19770
I would like to put a nice little comment here.

JUST to make it clear, exhilaration is by far the most useful of the talents in that tier for PvP. Aspect of the iron hawk won't help you as a survival cooldown if you need a self heal. It's incredibly valuable for each spec, though I didn't even know there was a debate about it. Survival has absolutely no on-use or passive heal, making exhilaration a need for the spec if you're PvPing with it. Marksmanship has no large self heal, making it valuable as well. For BM, if you use stampede defensively (for spirit mend), and then exhilaration later, that's more defensive cooldowns than either survival or MM. Not to even mention, with readiness exhilaration's just that much better.

As for powershot, it is in my opinion (and quite a few others'), the most useful and overpowered ability in the game. I rarely use it outside of when rapid fire's buff is up, due to the 2 piece bonus of gaining 3.2k more pvp power when rapid fire's up, except for a knockback. Chain CC and enemy escape trinkets should be taken into consideration before powershot-ing, but the results are often comical. Glaive toss is nice, but it eats up globals and doesn't do much damage through the overall course of an arena. Barrage is in my opinion the worst of that tier due to it being able to randomly hit people other than your target even if they're very far away, or even LoS'd occasionally. This makes barrage next to worthless, because it's capable of breaking CC unintentionally.

Another point is, hunters do not have passive damage-mitigation (such as feint/elusiveness, shield wall, ect.) outside of aspect of the iron hawk which is ridiculous to even consider taking. Because of this, I think it's important to make it a point that PvP resilience is more vital to us than almost anything. If you want to be competitive in 3s or even 2s, have at least 65% PvP resilience is a must. To do this, you need to stack it. You lose out on some PvP power, but there's little of a difference to be made. I still hit for 30k arcane shots, I still hit 200k powershots, and I still hit 90k chimera shots AND take reduced damage. This is a must for competitive PvP.

Along with Marksmanship, for PvP and PvE alike you have a hard cap of 25% crit. In my opinion there isn't even a point to play the spec if you don't have that much crit, due to the way careful aim works. I also want to make it a point that hard casting aimed shot is next to useless. It scales with weapon damage immensely, however it does not scale well with PvP power at all. Not only that, but it drains you of focus more than anything else. I can't even think of a situation where hard casting aimed shot would be more useful than hard casting powershot. It is a must though, to use your free aimed shot once you have the required stacks for it.

This guide is somewhat helpful if you're new to hunters. It's something to work with give or take, but I highly suggest to not follow it intensely. I suggest for new hunters to watch and pay close attention to streams of highly rated hunters and dig around new and old forums for useful techniques, but do remember to not take everything to heart.

Just a quick question (might be a silly one), does mastery for bm hunters improve the damage of pets summoned through stampede?


Yes, which is why BM has nearly the best and most mobile burst in the game.
Edited by Kekena on 4/3/2013 5:00 AM PDT
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100 Human Hunter
9500
JUST to make it clear, exhilaration is by far the most useful of the talents in that tier for PvP. Aspect of the iron hawk won't help you as a survival cooldown if you need a self heal. It's incredibly valuable for each spec, though I didn't even know there was a debate about it. Survival has absolutely no on-use or passive heal, making exhilaration a need for the spec if you're PvPing with it. Marksmanship has no large self heal, making it valuable as well. For BM, if you use stampede defensively (for spirit mend), and then exhilaration later, that's more defensive cooldowns than either survival or MM. Not to even mention, with readiness exhilaration's just that much better.


Good point, I gave Exhilaration very high ratings, I just don't usually take it. I should probably give it another shot though.

04/03/2013 04:16 AMPosted by Kekena
As for powershot, it is in my opinion (and quite a few others'), the most useful and overpowered ability in the game. I rarely use it outside of when rapid fire's buff is up, due to the 2 piece bonus of gaining 3.2k more pvp power when rapid fire's up, except for a knockback. Chain CC and enemy escape trinkets should be taken into consideration before powershot-ing, but the results are often comical. Glaive toss is nice, but it eats up globals and doesn't do much damage through the overall course of an arena. Barrage is in my opinion the worst of that tier due to it being able to randomly hit people other than your target even if they're very far away, or even LoS'd occasionally. This makes barrage next to worthless, because it's capable of breaking CC unintentionally.


Ah thank you, I actually forgot to update that section after 5.2. I never used powershot pre-5.2 because it would fizzle too much on me but now I use it all the time and have been getting obscene numbers with it lol.

04/03/2013 04:16 AMPosted by Kekena
If you want to be competitive in 3s or even 2s, have at least 65% PvP resilience is a must. To do this, you need to stack it.


You don't need to STACK it. It's silly to fore-go the socket bonuses just to get an extra few points of resilience. My current gems are balanced between power and resil and I'm sitting at 64%. Plus, after 5.3, PvP Power will be much more desirable because EVERYONE will have 65% then.

I can't even think of a situation where hard casting aimed shot would be more useful than hard casting powershot


You're in rapid fire, have it glyphed, and need burst on the move. Even if you don't have rapid fire up. Plus powershot has a somewhat lengthy cooldown.

Definitely appreciate the feedback, thanks so much!
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90 Orc Hunter
19770
You don't need to STACK it. It's silly to fore-go the socket bonuses just to get an extra few points of resilience. My current gems are balanced between power and resil and I'm sitting at 64%. Plus, after 5.3, PvP Power will be much more desirable because EVERYONE will have 65% then.


PvP resilience may be less desirable then, but I believe that requires testing during patch 5.3.

You're in rapid fire, have it glyphed, and need burst on the move. Even if you don't have rapid fire up. Plus powershot has a somewhat lengthy cooldown.


I would much rather save my focus for a chimera shot due to it always hitting harder than aimed shot from what I've seen, and/or a serpent sting as well. Aimed shot cripples your mobility and focus, and there are much more desirable glyphs to choose from.
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100 Human Hunter
9500
I would much rather save my focus for a chimera shot due to it always hitting harder than aimed shot from what I've seen, and/or a serpent sting as well. Aimed shot cripples your mobility and focus, and there are much more desirable glyphs to choose from


Fair enough, but the only other real option while chimera is on CD is to spam arcane shots, and I like to try and get a piercing shots DoT up and if chimera doesn't crit aimed gives me that option. Then I spam arcane shots once I have a piercing shots on or something's hitting me.
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100 Human Hunter
9500
updated for 5.3 upcoming changes.
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8 Goblin Warrior
0
Is MM still getting Binding Shot and Intimidation still taking it's place?
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100 Human Hunter
9500
Is MM still getting Binding Shot and Intimidation still taking it's place?


As far as I know, yes.

We're also getting a 10% Attack power buff from Aspect of the hawk.
Edited by Qualk on 4/18/2013 3:38 PM PDT
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8 Goblin Warrior
0
04/18/2013 03:38 PMPosted by Qualk
Is MM still getting Binding Shot and Intimidation still taking it's place?


As far as I know, yes.

We're also getting a 10% Attack power buff from Aspect of the hawk.
yay!
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100 Troll Hunter
8115
First let me say, very helpful guide. Much appreciated.

I have a pet question. I just hit 90 after playing in Lich King. In WotLK the hunter Brang used a crab in PvP for the Pin ability, which holds your target in place for 4 seconds. Your guide says to use a basilisk or a crane. But the basilisk's spell makes the target invulnerable, so why is this preferred over the crab's 4 second immobilize? I'm sure there is a good reason I'm just hoping you can fill me in.

Also, this guide says to gem for PvP power over agility. Does the math just work out so this is more beneficial? In BC and WotLK it was always more beneficial to gem for +Agility over power because it gave crit as well. So I'm just a little hesitant to move away from my straight up +Agility gems.
Edited by Sltenrfricai on 4/20/2013 11:08 AM PDT
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100 Human Hunter
9500
I have a pet question. I just hit 90 after playing in Lich King. In WotLK the hunter Brang used a crab in PvP for the Pin ability, which holds your target in place for 4 seconds. Your guide says to use a basilisk or a crane. But the basilisk's spell makes the target invulnerable, so why is this preferred over the crab's 4 second immobilize? I'm sure there is a good reason I'm just hoping you can fill me in.

Also, this guide says to gem for PvP power over agility. Does the math just work out so this is more beneficial? In BC and WotLK it was always more beneficial to gem for +Agility over power because it gave crit as well. So I'm just a little hesitant to move away from my straight up +Agility gems.


The root from crabs is pretty nice still, but it tends to break quickly on damage and it also doesn't stop casting or abilities and is on the same diminishing returns as our narrow escape talent. Kiting is not AS important as it was in Cata and WotLK because you can still fire off your shots in melee range now. You want your pet's CC to be able to stop a healer from healing in an arena, the crane's lullaby is the best for this right now because it's a 4 second sleep that casts instantly (unlike bad manner from cata which had a cast time). The basilisk's ability is also nice because it doesn't care if there's DoT's on the healer, you just have to make sure to wait until its effect is over before using another CC.

There's some debate over how to gem. The reason I go for PvP Power is because in 5.3 blizzard is making it so EVERYONE will automatically get 65% PvP Resilience no matter their gear. When this happens, I believe (will have to actually test this once it goes live) that PvP Power will be the go-to stat in PvP. The bottom line is PvP Power gets you more DPS for PvP than Agility because agility gems only have 160 agility compared to the 320 PvP Power gems. This was changed in Mists for all gems to have double the secondary stats compared to primary stats. (However, I still put 80 agi / 160 resilience gems in my red sockets because you should still be getting the socket bonuses).

The debate is mostly whether to gem for PvP Power or PvP Resilience. I prefer power because of the changes coming in 5.3, and it just fits my playstyle more (I don't have time to do serious competitive arenas/RBG's anymore so I mostly do 2v2 for points and random bg's so I prefer the extra damage). Furthermore, in 5.3 PvP Power will increase healing done by you in PvP (exhilaration, chimera shot, spirit mends, etc). However, if you're pushing rating in 3v3 and tend to get focused a lot, or you're trying to gear up in random bg's, you should gem for resilience.
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100 Troll Hunter
8115
Thanks for the helpful reply.

I did not realize the crab's root breaks on damage, in WotLK I don't think it broke with damage.

Thanks for the clarification on the Crane/Basilisk question, I'll definitely take one into arenas. I think I'm going to use a Porcupine in BGs for the 2 second Disorient AoE.

I'll switch my gems to the PvP power then though I'm still a little nervous about losing the crit from Agility.

P.S. - the resilience standardization is BS. Then what's the point of getting good gear nowadays? Isn't this going to make everyone roll around in mostly PvE gear? Your resilience will stay the same so why not just for the gear with more damage? Unless I'm missing something. /sigh
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100 Human Hunter
9500
P.S. - the resilience standardization is BS. Then what's the point of getting good gear nowadays? Isn't this going to make everyone roll around in mostly PvE gear? Your resilience will stay the same so why not just for the gear with more damage? Unless I'm missing something. /sigh


Yes it's an extremely controversial change. The reason people won't roll with full PvE gear (aside from Tanks for flag carrying which is a whole other issue that Blizzard said they are working on) is because of PvP Power. Full pvp gear gives you a flat 55% - 65% damage (and healing) increase over PvE gear because PvE gear has 0 PvP Power. The only time that having full PvE gear would be beneficial in PvP would be if you were running around in full heroic raid gear, which less than 1% of the playerbase has access to anyways. Furthermore, Blizzard is also putting an item level cap on random battlegrounds, rated battlegrounds, and arenas at 496. So any gear you have that's above that 496 ceiling will have its stats lowered accordingly for the duration of the battle, so you'd only have to be concerned if you ran into a fully heroic geared raider out in world PvP.

Edit: To clarify, your BASE resilience will be 65%. Additional resilience you get after that via gems or enchants will raise your resilience past 65%. Base resilience on most pvp gear is getting removed to offset the change.
Edited by Qualk on 4/21/2013 3:52 PM PDT
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90 Human Hunter
10340
Spirit Cat (Heal and Mastery)
Shale Spider (5% stats and Wrap)
Devilsaur (Crit and reduction in heals)
Core Hound (Increase in cast time)
Silthid (Web and Stam Buff)

Thoose are mine at the moment i find them to be the best in arenas
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