I pull more damage solo questing on 87 alts.

90 Blood Elf Paladin
6385
Logging off my 87 warrior, and onto my 90 paladin really made me cringe today.

Deep wounds was nerfed by 50% for prot.

Holy wrath damage was increased by 100%

Avenger shield was increased by 50%

But quite honestly, the only time my damage is good is with lots of vengeance.

Now, I play nothing but tanks. Feral bears, Dks, warriors, Paladins, even working on a monk.

I play the same way, I gather what I can up until what I believe to be the collective mob pools leash threshold, and aoe them down to dust.

This is how I do my dailies, this is how I do my pve questing, this is how I do my heroic face roll.

It's all the same, on any tank, totally homogonized. Aoe Aoe Aoe.

On my 87 warrior, I'm pulling (post deep wound nerf) 40-50k solo questing.

My feral druid, 3 stacks of lacerate, thrash, mangle+maul and the mob is just melting. Doesn't matter if it has 1mil hp, 2mil hp, even at 86. You get those bleeds rolling and you can just coast. And never mind thrash/swipe spam.

But on my paladin, who probably has an average of 60 item lvl higher than both my bear/warrior - I'm peaking out at 22-25k dps, aoe solo questing.

Now, with big vengeance stacks, totally different - our sustained aoe damage can be jarring, especially when you take into account battle healer/SOI and the amount of utility/healing we can do all at once.

But questing is just about the most !@#$ing annoying thing. It's grueling, cumbersome, flat out dumb slow on a paladin.

I seriously was not going to whine like this, cause I'm a champ, but the second my 87 warrior was pulling twice the dps questing over my 90 paladin doing dailies - I just had to.
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100 Human Paladin
8295
I hope a blue looks at this and sends the feedback for analysis. I won't tell them what to do, but I have really poor solo target and small group target dps.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
6385
I may just bump this until I get reported/warned, I'll take this cause on for my skilladins.
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90 Pandaren Warrior
15860
Tanks don't do as much damage as dps, more @ 11.

Make sure you're using CS and consecrate over HotR spam
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You haven't lost huge amounts of crit rating at 87 yet. Just like when Cata came out, stat values change, crit drops, dps drops.
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90 Pandaren Warrior
15860
10/14/2012 10:38 AMPosted by Bromaster
You haven't lost huge amounts of crit rating at 87 yet. Just like when Cata came out, stat values change, crit drops, dps drops.


Tanks don't have crit rating to begin with. (that aren't monks)
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90 Human Warrior
13005
You haven't lost huge amounts of crit rating at 87 yet. Just like when Cata came out, stat values change, crit drops, dps drops.


Tanks don't have crit rating to begin with. (that aren't monks)

If he's leveling in DPS gear (which is very common), then he has significantly higher crit than he will at 90. People saw the same thing leveling through Cataclysm-- my hunter's DPS plummeted when he went from 82 to 83, and again at 84. The harsher rating conversions will drop combat stats by a huge amount. I think I lost over 20% haste and 15% crit over those two levels.
Edited by Muspel on 10/14/2012 11:06 AM PDT
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90 Pandaren Warrior
15860
10/14/2012 11:06 AMPosted by Muspel


Tanks don't have crit rating to begin with. (that aren't monks)

If he's leveling in DPS gear (which is very common), then he has significantly higher crit than he will at 90. People saw the same thing leveling through Cataclysm-- my hunter's DPS plummeted when he went from 82 to 83, and again at 84. The harsher rating conversions will drop combat stats by a huge amount. I think I lost over 20% haste and 15% crit over those two levels.


If you have dps gear just level as dps.
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90 Human Death Knight
8900
Seriously, leveling as DPS is so much easier. I spent as much time gathering mobs as a tank spec (on all four of my 90s) to AE, as I did just 1-2 targetting everything down. And if I was left 1 bear butt short of what I needed, sorry Charlie. Guess you'll have to pull another 10.

About the only exception is when soloing rares, but even then, you want to be wearing DPS gear.

Save tanking for instances. We're not in TBC anymore, to some dismay.
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90 Pandaren Warrior
15860
I pull as much as I do tanking as arms
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90 Human Paladin
12965
10/14/2012 10:33 AMPosted by Ðemolition
Tanks don't do as much damage as dps, more @ 11.


Pretty much this.

You also have the option of switching to a DPS spec for soloing if it's too painful as a tank.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
6385
10/14/2012 11:06 AMPosted by Muspel


Tanks don't have crit rating to begin with. (that aren't monks)

If he's leveling in DPS gear (which is very common), then he has significantly higher crit than he will at 90. People saw the same thing leveling through Cataclysm-- my hunter's DPS plummeted when he went from 82 to 83, and again at 84. The harsher rating conversions will drop combat stats by a huge amount. I think I lost over 20% haste and 15% crit over those two levels.


Absolutely not, I lvl in STRAIGHT TANK GEAR.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
6385
10/14/2012 12:01 PMPosted by Ðemolition
I pull as much as I do tanking as arms


Yes, but I am a paladin, which is not a warrior. I wish I could do lvl 90 dailies on my 88 prot warrior - it would be faster,

and that my friend, is my issue.

No actually, my issue isn't that warrior tanks do a lot of damage. Raid gear will eventually have dps push tank damage to the margins -

My issue is paladin damage
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
6385
10/14/2012 12:22 PMPosted by Alandrek
Tanks don't do as much damage as dps, more @ 11.


Pretty much this.

You also have the option of switching to a DPS spec for soloing if it's too painful as a tank.


My 88 warrior is a prot tank, did you even read my post? Is this reply a joke?

My 88 prot warrior quests and kills faster than my 90 paladin with 60 higher average item lvl.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
6385
Tanks don't do as much damage as dps, more @ 11.

Make sure you're using CS and consecrate over HotR spam


HOTR about matches CS with 2 targets, and beats it with 3.

Sorry, I can't revenge on parry and hit 3 mobs for 5000% weapon damage. And to think, it was your class that actually took ability a bit ago.

Furthermore - from the horses mouth -

"I pull as much as I do tanking as arms"
Edited by Husslehard on 10/14/2012 2:42 PM PDT
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90 Human Paladin
12965
10/14/2012 02:34 PMPosted by Husslehard
My 88 warrior is a prot tank, did you even read my post? Is this reply a joke?


Yes, I've read your posts. The only joke here is the attitude you're displaying.

My 88 prot warrior quests and kills faster than my 90 paladin with 60 higher average item lvl.


That doesn't change my statement in the slightest.

Blizzard isn't going to hand out significant buffs or nerfs to tanks based on how much DPS they can output while completing trivial single-player content like dailies. The reasonable options available to you are to either accept your lower DPS output as a tank spec, or switch to DPS.
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90 Pandaren Warrior
15860
If you want to do dailies as prot in full tank gear, thats kind of your own fault.

I'll be honest, I have no idea how good/not good prot warriors are at questing in MoP, I'm not as stubborn as a lot of people seem to be. The only time I kill anything outside of a raid/dungeon as prot is when I forget to respec after I'm done doing a dungeon/raid
Edited by Ðemolition on 10/14/2012 2:57 PM PDT
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
6385
You quoted someone saying news @ 11, tanks don't do as much damage as dps, and then when I clearly point out to you that my 88 warrior is not only prot spec, but fully geared to be a tank -

it has no bearing on your argument?

Again, I can do twice the dps solo questing which, in your view could be trivial, but for others, a good chunk out of a day on my feral bear/prot warrior.

Now again, when I'm aoe tanking a heroic, the way I pull, my damage is more than fine. Hell, it's impressive.

But solo questing, it's !@#$ing painful man. I wouldn't be beating this drum if it wasn't absurdly disportionate.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
6385
10/14/2012 02:55 PMPosted by Ðemolition
If you want to do dailies as prot in full tank gear, thats kind of your own fault.


No, it's just my playstyle. Now again, you seem to have some logical short comings.

PROT WARRIORS AND BEARS QUEST FINE AND FAST.

Why can't my paladin?

It's not accross the board tank damage that's suffering here, if it was, your argument would be much more valid to me.

You're just being a spoiled warrior.

I didn't catch your edit, but you added this, and its important for what i'm trying to discuss with you -

"I'll be honest, I have no idea how good/not good prot warriors are at questing in MoP"

Well, I do.
Edited by Husslehard on 10/14/2012 3:00 PM PDT
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90 Pandaren Warrior
15860
10/14/2012 02:56 PMPosted by Husslehard
But solo questing, it's !@#$ing painful man. I wouldn't be beating this drum if it wasn't absurdly disportionate.


My entire point is stop trying to solo as prot in full prot gear. You're just shooting yourself in the foot.

For example:

Red crane dailies at Chi-Ji, the 10 student one, they don't even give victory rush because they don't actually die. As long as I don't screw up, I can pull all 10 and aoe them in one pull as arms.

Sure, I could do it as prot with less risk, but it would be slower.
Edited by Ðemolition on 10/14/2012 3:01 PM PDT
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