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90 Pandaren Rogue
12235
Not gonna lie, it'd be nice to have a BOA tome for my alts. I've been through the content once on a ground mount, and I don't see why it's necessary to do it again. However, I'd happily trudge through on my ground mounts on all my toons for a BOA tome of cloud serpent riding. :D
90 Undead Mage
9405
10/27/2012 10:09 PMPosted by Theoldman
We're not sure if we'll be doing this. The tome worked out well enough for Wrath of the Lich King as an experiment, but so much of the experience we spent a lot of time and effort shaping in Pandaria is negated by flying. In addition to the [url="http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/6794350230"]upcoming reputation changes[/url] for alts (when a character on the account hits Revered), we'll consider other methods of potentially speeding up the leveling process for alts, but we don't think "allow flying" is necessarily the best answer.


The tome was nice but yeah I agree.... I think not allowing flying until max level is a good idea. It takes me back to the days when I ran every where until lvl 30. I got to know the land, the mobs, and it's quirks quite intimately. Granted it was a pain running to avoid mobs (and at times quite exhilarating) but getting a mount at lvl 30 was something I really looked forward to and worked hard towards. Same with flying at lvl 60 (I believe it was 70 originally but I'm not sure on that). Point is, we've gotten spoiled being able to fly early, in every zone now, etc. Doesn't hurt us, though it does make some whine like a 2yr old being told "NO!", to wait until max level for convenience and joy. Anticipation and working towards goals like that are good things in games worth playing. IMO.

*has 1 lvl 90 and is slowly leveling the others ( 4 other alts btx 85 and 88 - multiple lower than 75) as I explore the content, scenery, and story lines - am NOT in a hurry to get to the end. The content is not going to run away and disappear while I take my time. As the NPCs keep saying "Slow down. Life is to be savored.". :)


Spoiled? It's a game and I should not have to feel like it's a chore. It's great that you can explore content, scenery, and story lines. Guess what, you can still do the same thing on a flying mount.
90 Blood Elf Paladin
15065
I don't understand why people are against this? It doesn't affect you if you don't want to use it. I can buy it, fly around and get my alts finally leveled and actually play them. They're just sitting there gathering dust.

I'm really getting tired of Blizzard telling me how to have fun.


I'm quoting this post above you,#133, below because its the perfect answer to your question.


No, you're looking at things too literally. In game design, when you make people choose to limit them self, they will constantly know they are doing that. It can turn into something nagging at you in the back of your mind.

When you force someone to accept a limitation, they learn to adapt to that limitation.

When you give people the option to fly, knowing they can bypass everything if they choose to creates an attraction that probably isn't best for your experience, but it's too attractive to resist.

It's nowhere near as simple as you make it out to be. But as long as you ignore things like the context I described, it's going to seem an easy thing to you that makes the people you disagree with into silly people trying to force you to do things.
90 Night Elf Rogue
15430
All the people who enjoyed Pandaria content are welcome to quest on the ground for all their alts if they wish.

However just because you disallow me to give my alts flying after having completed all the content with my first character to reach level 90 does not mean you are adding to my experience. While it makes sense to require people to reach 90 on at least one character in a manner that introduces them to the new world (of Warcraft) that has been created for the expansion, forcing players to do this multiple times is merely an artificial inflation in time required to play.

This expansion has seen a lot of new content, but a lot of that content seems to punish players for not being online as much as possible. It's a bridge too far to tell me that now I must have that experience again on every one of my alts, or abandon them, doubly so when I use them to farm materials for crafting professions on other characters.

Forcing level 90 to fly is a design choice. Forcing players to do the same on every character crosses the line into telling people how to play the game, because you think you know better than they do how to enjoy the content.
90 Blood Elf Rogue
10860
10/27/2012 03:38 PMPosted by Crithto
The tome worked out well enough for Wrath of the Lich King as an experiment, but so much of the experience we spent a lot of time and effort shaping in Pandaria is negated by flying.


If you already have a toon at 90 to even purchase it .. that means you have already experienced this content .. why would you then require alts to re experience this content.

Don't you believe once is enough for content this grindy and obnoxious ?
Judging by the design changes MoP has my guess is yes, so you sabotage alts by making it as painful as possible on them.

Ive seen Pandaria once by ground .. I shouldn't have to do it 3, 4, 6 or 11 times by ground. Nor should Blizzard be dictating how I play to me.

And dont even get me started on the horrible bugs you put in game .. they should have stayed in AQ and died with Cthun.

Cant believe you are making us do that whole AQ crap again.
Edited by Shixa on 10/27/2012 10:33 PM PDT
71 Undead Death Knight
1010
10/27/2012 10:17 PMPosted by Cuthgar


The tome was nice but yeah I agree.... I think not allowing flying until max level is a good idea. It takes me back to the days when I ran every where until lvl 30. I got to know the land, the mobs, and it's quirks quite intimately. Granted it was a pain running to avoid mobs (and at times quite exhilarating) but getting a mount at lvl 30 was something I really looked forward to and worked hard towards. Same with flying at lvl 60 (I believe it was 70 originally but I'm not sure on that). Point is, we've gotten spoiled being able to fly early, in every zone now, etc. Doesn't hurt us, though it does make some whine like a 2yr old being told "NO!", to wait until max level for convenience and joy. Anticipation and working towards goals like that are good things in games worth playing. IMO.

*has 1 lvl 90 and is slowly leveling the others ( 4 other alts btx 85 and 88 - multiple lower than 75) as I explore the content, scenery, and story lines - am NOT in a hurry to get to the end. The content is not going to run away and disappear while I take my time. As the NPCs keep saying "Slow down. Life is to be savored.". :)


Spoiled? It's a game and I should not have to feel like it's a chore. It's great that you can explore content, scenery, and story lines. Guess what, you can still do the same thing on a flying mount.


If it feels like a chore then you should go play something else. Not being able to ride much less fly until much later in the game was part and parcel to the experience originally. Either you accepted the game as was or you went and played something else. Same as then, same as now. As you say, it's a game. Every game has it's rules, mechanics, etc. We either do it or not, adapt or go do something else, it's that simple really.

And listen, spoiled? Yes. Even *I'm* spoiled. Until I get used to being little or a ground rider, I'm always looking for the 'fly mount icon'. And yes I grumble at times. But that still tells me I've gotten spoiled.
90 Pandaren Monk
11720
Haven't read the whole thing to see if it's been posted but:

Cloud Serpent Riding BoA tome, perhaps? At least by the tail end of the expansion, anyway? It's not so bad doing the grind on alternate toons while it's still current content (and especially with the reputation bonus coming soon), but I could see that being very tedious at some point.
1 Undead Warrior
0
10/27/2012 03:38 PMPosted by Crithto
We're not sure if we'll be doing this. The tome worked out well enough for Wrath of the Lich King as an experiment, but so much of the experience we spent a lot of time and effort shaping in Pandaria is negated by flying. In addition to the [url="http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/6794350230"]upcoming reputation changes[/url] for alts (when a character on the account hits Revered), we'll consider other methods of potentially speeding up the leveling process for alts, but we don't think "allow flying" is necessarily the best answer.

well then you can keep your game LOL and love it cause I for one cancelled all 3 of my accounts no flight for alts then no money for blizzard=). enjoy.
90 Blood Elf Rogue
10860
And listen, spoiled? Yes. Even *I'm* spoiled. Until I get used to being little or a ground rider, I'm always looking for the 'fly mount icon'. And yes I grumble at times. But that still tells me I've gotten spoiled.


If I have one toon at 90 then I have zero reason to want or need to re do that questing via the ground a second time . .nor should I be forced to.

This was the beauty of wrath, once you got to 80 you could pass on a tome to your alts so they didn't have to re do it via the ground. It's got little to do with being spoiled but more to do with Blizzard dictating how I play to me.

In the end I pretty much made the decision to abandon 9 of my level 85 alts since Re experiencing pandaria by ground is simply not an option 9 more times.

I should never have be forced into making such a decision ...what a waste.
Edited by Shixa on 10/27/2012 10:38 PM PDT
I don't think 5 levels is worth a tome of flying. It was different in wrath because it was 10 levels.

Honestly, I was able to level up a warlock, DK, and priest with hardly any trouble. My lock only took about 19 hours.

However, my rogue was a nightmare and I never want to go through that again.

Rep bonus between characters would be nice though. Might actually make me want to do dailies. (joy of being a PvPer)
90 Blood Elf Rogue
10860
10/27/2012 10:37 PMPosted by Spycei
However, my rogue was a nightmare and I never want to go through that again.


I know that feeling ...Why did they decide to make rogues take so much melee damage.

10/27/2012 10:37 PMPosted by Spycei
My lock only took about 19 hours.


Thats 10 hours to much.

and yes that's how much time flying would save.
Edited by Shixa on 10/27/2012 10:41 PM PDT
71 Undead Death Knight
1010
10/27/2012 10:32 PMPosted by Lilmehmeh
We're not sure if we'll be doing this. The tome worked out well enough for Wrath of the Lich King as an experiment, but so much of the experience we spent a lot of time and effort shaping in Pandaria is negated by flying. In addition to the [url="http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/6794350230"]upcoming reputation changes[/url] for alts (when a character on the account hits Revered), we'll consider other methods of potentially speeding up the leveling process for alts, but we don't think "allow flying" is necessarily the best answer.

well then you can keep your game LOL and love it cause I for one cancelled all 3 of my accounts no flight for alts then no money for blizzard=). enjoy.


Good for you! That exactly what you should do. If the game is not suited for the way you want to do things then go do something else.

Just an fyi, just as I learned at when I worked at Boeing, your $45 dollars plus whatever you spent at the Blizz store, is just a minor drop in the bucket to a multi-million dollar company. Now when you can effect several thousand players, that will make a dent in their profits. But to leave and say you've taken your 3 accts away and gone home... well... while they'll miss you playing their game (no one likes being disliked for whatever reason), they're not going to weep over it.
90 Troll Mage
8280
Why on earth people play this game and expect everything to be handed to them is beyond me.
90 Blood Elf Rogue
10860
10/27/2012 10:47 PMPosted by Wolvomo
Why on earth people play this game and expect everything to be handed to them is beyond me.


handed ...if by handed you mean grind my way to 90, then grind the gold to buy said item on top of my level 90 costs, then grind another toon up high enough to use the tome ...Then yes.
Edited by Shixa on 10/27/2012 10:50 PM PDT
90 Troll Mage
8280
Why on earth people play this game and expect everything to be handed to them is beyond me.


handed ...if by handed you mean grind my way to 90, then grind the gold to buy said item on top of my level 90 costs, then grind another toon up high enough to use the tome ...Then yes.


It's not just the main topic at hand I was addressing.

Just reading through this thread makes me sad that the community has gotten this bad.
Edited by Wolvomo on 10/27/2012 10:55 PM PDT
90 Blood Elf Rogue
10860
10/27/2012 10:55 PMPosted by Wolvomo


handed ...if by handed you mean grind my way to 90, then grind the gold to buy said item on top of my level 90 costs, then grind another toon up high enough to use the tome ...Then yes.


It's not just the main topic at hand I was addressing.

Just reading through this thread makes me sad that the community has gotten this bad.


Im just here about the flying tome ... couldn't care less about a rep grind I will never do.
90 Undead Priest
14805
10/27/2012 05:02 PMPosted by Advo
How about an account wide buff. Call it 'Veteran Adventurer', shows up at 85 and lasts til 90. +10% exp gain from all sources. For an added twist, make it stack per lvl 90 character you have. That would get me interested in alt leveling again.


This! This would be amazing! Alt leveling gets more painful as time goes one but this would make it not suck as bad! So your 11th char would be getting 100% xp the whole time! That would be glorious.
90 Gnome Mage
14010
remember... must be level 90 to buy. Simply for alts.

hell, make it 20-30k to buy. alts are gathering dust until then : /


NO I don't have that much on all 16 of my toons combined..... make it 2k and make it very very very soon! I would kind of like to get my alts leveled before I die of old age!
71 Undead Death Knight
1010
10/27/2012 10:36 PMPosted by Shixa
And listen, spoiled? Yes. Even *I'm* spoiled. Until I get used to being little or a ground rider, I'm always looking for the 'fly mount icon'. And yes I grumble at times. But that still tells me I've gotten spoiled.


If I have one toon at 90 then I have zero reason to want or need to re do that questing via the ground a second time . .nor should I be forced to.

This was the beauty of wrath, once you got to 80 you could pass on a tome to your alts so they didn't have to re do it via the ground. It's got little to do with being spoiled but more to do with Blizzard dictating how I play to me.

In the end I pretty much made the decision to abandon 9 of my level 85 alts since Re experiencing pandaria by ground is simply not an option 9 more times.

I should never have be forced into making such a decision ...what a waste.


Yes, I got the tome too in Wrath, and yes it was wonderful to be able to pass down to my alts. I fully admit it was nice. I loved being able to do. When Cata brought in all Classic zone flying my desire for ease was fed. But not spoiled now because I can't do the same thing I was able to do then? Sorry, that's being spoiled. Things change. I was used to being able to do things the easy way... and it was sooooo easy... but now I have to adapt and do things the hard way... well dangit! *grumble grumble, grumble, grumble, bad words, bad words for the first week or so when I found out no flying*... Spoiled. No one gets <insert most favorite thing in the world> 100% of them time in 100% of all circumstances. Nothing stays exactly the same. So deal.

Now if they change their mind, that's one thing. But being able to fly before 90, while nice, convenient even, is not essential to the leveling process and truthfully, other than convenient, I'm not sure it's healthy for this xpac. We got our sugar highs and gluttonous need for and of convenience fed in Cata, now it's time to deal with the addiction to it and get back to basics. Hard but needful and for some certainly not easy.
90 Blood Elf Rogue
10860
remember... must be level 90 to buy. Simply for alts.

hell, make it 20-30k to buy. alts are gathering dust until then : /


NO I don't have that much on all 16 of my toons combined..... make it 2k and make it very very very soon! I would kind of like to get my alts leveled before I die of old age!


I have 9 more toons I could drag through Pandaria . .but I refuse to and would rather abandon them than subject myself to Pandaria leveling by ground mount again.

Ive done it twice now ...NO MORE.
Edited by Shixa on 10/27/2012 11:03 PM PDT
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