Cross-Realm Zones Update

I had no real opinion of CRZ until I leveled a fresh toon through them.

I am now officially in the "I want them to go away" camp. Merge realms if you have to, but the CRZ is not working for me.

1) Low level CRZ zones are spammed with the usual "Paying X gold for guild sigs!" messages, yet CRZ people can't sign them.

2) Mining in Outland was always a pain the butt before CRZ, but with 4 realms competing for fel iron when there are fewer nodes in all of Outland than there is seemingly of ghost iron in just the Jade Forest, you might as well give up. You're never going to get one.

3) I'm on what I would call a dying server, but I can't get a minfernal pet to save my life because the area is constantly camped by at least 3-5 CRZ people at all hours of the day (seriously, I've set my alarm to get me up at 3 am on a Sunday to check, and the place was still packed, all of them CRZ).

4) They're nothing but window dressing, they do nothing but look pretty and steal our nodes/spawns/etc. You can't trade with them, you can't interact with them in any meaningful way, all they can do is talk and make your life harder while questing.

5) More people means more griefing. I know Blizz is all giddy at the thought of "world pvp" like its a good thing, but I transferred to a PvE realm all those years ago for a reason, I hate world pvp. I enjoyed Hellfire Penn being virtually empty, because it meant I could actually quest through there. My monk just finished that area, and you know what? Twice I had to just go do something else because CRZ alliance decided it would be awesome to take over Falcon Point or other quest hubs and just wipe them out for hours at a time.

Enough is enough. If you want to let us chat with people, just let us access Trade from everywhere in the world (I have an addon that lets me listen to it no matter where I am anyway). If you want people taking our gathering nodes and kills, then turn down the spawn rate. But for the love of biscuits, enough with the CRZ. Just freaking merge realms if you have to, anything is better than this.


#4 Hit it exactly right. All you get to do is say "oh boy! more people in the world!" but you can't do anything with them aside from grouping. You can't help with items, or signing stuff, as you said, or say I wanted to be generous and give a noob some gold, can't do that either.

Merging low-pop realms and leaving the rest of us alone is the way it should have been done. My server has always been medium and it's nice because there are people but you're not overwhelmed by the population like I am now. It's too much and it's unnecessary.
90 Undead Rogue
6670
11/29/2012 07:37 AMPosted by Akayuki
Yep. Before MoP, I had a character cap of 10 characters. I leveled my warrior, hunter, priest, shaman and mage through the world. Never had a lack of people in the world. No matter what zone I went to there was people running past me or in front of me to get to the next destination in a zone.


I was at 9 characters (I think) when CRZ hit. Now I'm down to 2. This one to post on the forums until my sub runs out, and my shaman because I needed to hand over the keys of my Alliance bank guild to my former guildies Horde side (along with about 20k gold).

I leveled mostly out in the world, too. About the only time I did dungeons was with my healer. And unless I was off in some abandoned corner of an unpopular zone, I was always running into other players. WrA was never an empty world.

I'm not sure how people are allegedly making so many friends with CRZ either. Every zone I've been in since this fiasco started has been dead silent in chat, and everyone seems to be ignoring each other. Unless they're just adding everyone they see to their Friends List and calling that a success. :/
100 Dwarf Hunter
10295
11/29/2012 07:32 AMPosted by Dhyana
Merging low-pop realms and leaving the rest of us alone is the way it should have been done. My server has always been medium and it's nice because there are people but you're not overwhelmed by the population like I am now. It's too much and it's unnecessary.


Free server transfers for everyone who wanted off a low-pop realm is what should have been done. If your realm has dipped into "low" population status anytime in the last 90 days months, you get a free transfer per toon on that server. Redeem the transfer and choose your destination. Want to stay where you are? That's fine, too.

No new game-breaking tech would have been required. It would have addressed the needs of the players who were having problems while respecting the desires of those who didn't have problems, rather than creating the illusion of those problems being addressed (while simultaneously ignoring the fundamental content issues that cause zones to become underpopulated and eight years of contradictory design decisions) and introducing a brand new set of complications for everybody except the players on the two RP realms that aren't CRZed.
90 Blood Elf Priest
11045
11/29/2012 03:40 AMPosted by Kwanyi
There in lies my question: Why not, I dunno get the server pop in there instead of the smoke and mirrors BS? Wouldn't that encourage more community growth?


(felt like a character change. but i couldn't find a xmog i liked. back on topic.) because server pop is more of a way to access the game than anything. like for example, on a low pop server i can always get in and play the game whereas on a full server, there might be a que. ive sat in ques for well over 3 hours to play on my server. crz also helps to foster a larger community. the odds of you seeing that person again is somewhat low but ive met people, got their real id and we quest/pvp and help eachother out. but i think its really dependant on how the people on the servers you are grouped with are. Like ive seen Blackrock and illiadin on my crz cluster. being out in the world is simply amazing. but if its anything ive seen, WRA and MG and probably moon guard have some of the rudest people i've ever seen.
90 Blood Elf Priest
11045
11/29/2012 08:13 AMPosted by Rollo
Free server transfers for everyone who wanted off a low-pop realm is what should have been done


the purpose of crz was tomake zones feel populated. your idea here makes dead servers even more dead.
100 Dwarf Hunter
10295
11/29/2012 08:19 AMPosted by Ininjaplate
Free server transfers for everyone who wanted off a low-pop realm is what should have been done


the purpose of crz was tomake zones feel populated. your idea here makes dead servers even more dead.


My idea addresses players' actual complaints.

Prior to CRZ, I saw few, if any, players whining about Redridge or Feralas being underpopulated. Blizzard had made the solo leveling process so quick from 1-80, that it had largely eliminated the need for any kind of mandatory player interaction unless you were doing dungeons, raids, or battlegrounds. This is still the case.

Instead, the complaints were mostly from players whose servers, on some level of functionality, were stone dead. The AH was dead, there was no raiding progression community, there was a low overall population or absurd faction imbalance, etc. They had enough and wanted out. They wanted access to the guilds, the raiding communities, and the active auction houses of busier servers. They didn't just want to see people out and about. They wanted to become a part of those servers. CRZ does not do this. Free transfers do, in addition to CRZ's goal of adding more players to potentially populate the deader areas of the game on the servers receiving low-pop realm refugees.

As for someone who wants to stay on a dead server when given the free opportunity to leave, that's their choice.
90 Blood Elf Priest
11045
11/29/2012 08:48 AMPosted by Rollo


the purpose of crz was tomake zones feel populated. your idea here makes dead servers even more dead.


My idea addresses players' actual complaints.

Prior to CRZ, I saw few, if any, players whining about Redridge or Feralas being underpopulated. Blizzard had made the solo leveling process so quick from 1-80, that it had largely eliminated the need for any kind of mandatory player interaction unless you were doing dungeons, raids, or battlegrounds. This is still the case.

Instead, the complaints were mostly from players whose servers, on some level of functionality, were stone dead. The AH was dead, there was no raiding progression community, there was a low overall population or absurd faction imbalance, etc. They had enough and wanted out. They wanted access to the guilds, the raiding communities, and the active auction houses of busier servers. They didn't just want to see people out and about. They wanted to become a part of those servers. CRZ does not do this. Free transfers do, in addition to CRZ's goal of adding more players to potentially populate the deader areas of the game on the servers receiving low-pop realm refugees.

As for someone who wants to stay on a dead server when given the free opportunity to leave, that's their choice.


crz was meant to populate zones thats it. although the idea of a cross realm AH is nice, it would probably take a bit of coding to get right. they cant just fix low pop servers, and what i mean by that is that people will flock to the high/full server for pvp and raiding. there will always be low pop servers/ the servers nobody wants to play on cause the community doesnt want to play there. i free xfered my pally to maiev and when the server died, i xfered all my toons back to high pop servers
11/29/2012 08:48 AMPosted by Rollo


the purpose of crz was tomake zones feel populated. your idea here makes dead servers even more dead.


My idea addresses players' actual complaints.

Prior to CRZ, I saw few, if any, players whining about Redridge or Feralas being underpopulated. Blizzard had made the solo leveling process so quick from 1-80, that it had largely eliminated the need for any kind of mandatory player interaction unless you were doing dungeons, raids, or battlegrounds. This is still the case.

Instead, the complaints were mostly from players whose servers, on some level of functionality, were stone dead. The AH was dead, there was no raiding progression community, there was a low overall population or absurd faction imbalance, etc. They had enough and wanted out. They wanted access to the guilds, the raiding communities, and the active auction houses of busier servers. They didn't just want to see people out and about. They wanted to become a part of those servers. CRZ does not do this. Free transfers do, in addition to CRZ's goal of adding more players to potentially populate the deader areas of the game on the servers receiving low-pop realm refugees.

As for someone who wants to stay on a dead server when given the free opportunity to leave, that's their choice.


Yeah... I agree with you. Server transfers or merging servers would do the trick. And again you're totally right -- people don't just want to SEE more people, they want their own economies to improve or to be able to join raiding guilds without having to pay for a realm transfer...

CRZs are just a temporary bandage and a flimsy one at that.
90 Blood Elf Priest
11045
11/29/2012 09:16 AMPosted by Dhyana
CRZs are just a temporary bandage and a flimsy one at that.


its a step in the right direction
100 Blood Elf Hunter
14480
11/29/2012 08:17 AMPosted by Ininjaplate
crz also helps to foster a larger community. the odds of you seeing that person again is somewhat low but ive met people, got their real id and we quest/pvp and help eachother out.


I have had nothing but animosity. But hey, good for you you made friends like that. I have only made friends though LFG (and quite a few, actually) and from these forums.

11/29/2012 08:17 AMPosted by Ininjaplate
but i think its really dependant on how the people on the servers you are grouped with are.


I have met only the rudest people from Darrowmere. I have been griefed by people from Echo Islands. Blizz refuses to enforce the CoC. When they start doing that and giving MAJOR repercussions for people's actions, maybe then I will re-evaluate my stance. But since I was told almost 2 yrs ago that they would not take action against them going around my ignore, I have no faith in that. And neither should you. Question: should I be forced to deal with idiots and jackasses from another server? I don't think so. Why should I? I don't play there, and I never will. I see people out there, and now I look at them with indifference or animosity myself. Why should I be nice to anyone anymore? No point if I have to deal with it... which is sad, because I am a nice person, I think.

11/29/2012 08:17 AMPosted by Ininjaplate
being out in the world is simply amazing.


Glad you like it. I will continue to stay away from alts I once loved because I cannot stomach it. Sick of getting griefed. Sick of being followed and harassed by level 85-90s who just want to make it harder on others to quest (not talking about PVP, being on a PVE server, but a lvl 85 that followed me around netherstorm just to kill my quest mobs... BECAUSE HE COULD). Not going to play a game to feel harassed, or be stressed out. Then, it is no longer a game.

If you had read the whole thing you quoted from me, we were talking about CRZing Brawler's guild, not the world in general.

11/29/2012 09:23 AMPosted by Ininjaplate
its a step in the right direction


I have to disagree. There were a myriad of other ways this no one in old zones thing could be handled.
Edited by Kwanyi on 11/29/2012 9:29 AM PST
100 Human Warrior
17810
11/29/2012 09:26 AMPosted by Xigwa
218 pages


You forgot the other threads that were uncapped multiple times. We're well over 1000 pages.
100 Night Elf Rogue
12025
11/29/2012 09:06 AMPosted by Akayuki
Actually I am from that person's same server. I got her on ignore because of hr drivel. Yeah we are on a full population server, but now, we feel it even worse. When you take 1 full population server there's still space to move around. Now, you got people practically stacked on each other like a can of sardines. This is even more apparent in Brawler's Guild. So the fact she doesn't see the problems, even though we are on the same server and my server definitely sees the problem, either means she is blind or such a fanboi she has to always defend Blizzard no matter what.


While I have yet to agree with anything that the poster has said, it is quite possible that she is questing during an off-peak time, or choosing to work unpopular zones, or actually questing through the zones.

I'm from your server also and I have not seen the problems to the extent that you have. I am not pleased with CRZ, for reasons RP/community related. The busiest zone I have been in so far is the Blasted lands. There were 3 others questing on my timetable and perhaps 15(?) players in the zone. General chat was a report fest for me as it had been commandeered by another server. The further along in the zone's questlines I got, the less players I saw. It was annoying for one quest, so I rolled onto my other alt to check my auctions. When I rolled back, those players that were "in my way", had progress through and the one player replacing them did not bother me.

Perhaps, after experiencing "The Great Death-grip Fest" in Hellfire Peninsula back in the day, I just have a higher tolerance level before I say: "man this is crowded".

My point is that it is equally ridiculous to claim, with all the variables that go into CRZ at a particular moment, that some one is _not_ not having a problem with CRZ overcrowding.

"It doesn't happen to me, therefore it doesn't exist" is a two edged sword.
100 Dwarf Hunter
10295
11/29/2012 09:16 AMPosted by Ininjaplate
crz was meant to populate zones thats it.


So...
- the larger problems still exists for a minority of servers,
- there are a bunch of new problems for a majority of servers, and
- boring game zones that have failed for years to attract players because the content is weaker and Blizzard chooses to funnel a great deal of exclusive utility into a couple of cities (portals, transmog, AHs) while ignoring the rest are still boring underpopulated game zones with weak content and fewer features to attract players.

We are so much better off.

11/29/2012 09:16 AMPosted by Ininjaplate
although the idea of a cross realm AH is nice, it would probably take a bit of coding to get right.


No coding required. There is no need for a cross realm auction house if people are allowed to transfer and there is no CRZ system.

That CRZ even exists is a head-scratcher. If I was looking at fixes for server population issues, I'd take the temporary hit in the pocketbook and use the systems that have been in place and functioning well for years rather than spend the time and money to reengineer a complicated game world and every server running it to simulate what those other systems could actually do relatively quickly while risking a bunch of new problems.

I have no faith in Blizzard's ability to get CRZ to do what they claim it's supposed to do. The 2-seater mount "feature," for example, appears to be a manifestation of the 2-seater mount zoning issues that existed in this game in Wrath when they first rolled out the phasing tech. You could ride up to Angrathar with a buddy who never did the Wrathgate storyline in your cycle's sidecar and watch him get booted from the vehicle and disappear from view because you were pushed into different phases based on your progress. It wasn't too bad because phasing used sparingly at the time. Several years later, the problem still seems to be around, is made worse by Blizzard's implementation of more flying 2-seaters, and they act like they didn't even foresee it would be a problem when they took phasing to a global scale.

11/29/2012 09:16 AMPosted by Ininjaplate
they cant just fix low pop servers, and what i mean by that is that people will flock to the high/full server for pvp and raiding. there will always be low pop servers/ the servers nobody wants to play on cause the community doesnt want to play there.


I never said free transfers wouldn't eliminate low-pop realms. They would eliminate the need for CRZ. Those who choose to remain on low-pop servers will be the ones who have to live with it. If they want to pay $15/month to be digital hermits, that's fine.
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