Our only saving grace right now is our absurd burst
In order to get your "absurd burst" and the 30% buff you seem to think is easy, you would need to take IW, then get everything lined up just about right, and then convince someone to do ~20k damage to you in the next 8 seconds. This gives you a 15 second window in which you get to do this absurd burst. I don't believe IW plays that way - its more of a "You hurt me, so I get the opportunity to hurt you back for a bit" scenario. If you're talking about Invocation, I have a hard enough time getting that off against dumb raid boss AI - you really think anyone in an arena is going to let you get off a 5.5 sec cast? Are you going to waste that 5.5 seconds of coordinated CC to buff yourself and pray the next window to do that comes up in less than 40 seconds?
Also, you must have missed it, we're only theoretically supposed to get 11% or so from any of the talents. So I guess your wish has been granted? :)
Annnnnnnddd... just for funsies - this is pretty much a pve thread. Has been for both iterations of it. I haven't seen anyone use anything but IW for PvP.
It's more than possible to get the timing right, but yes, it's difficult to line up. I'm defending our pvp, nor am I condemning our balance. We're a gimmick. These talents contribute to said gimmick. If they were serious about making us less gimmicky, then even out our damage by getting rid of these awful talents. Done.
Our PVP is about to get gutted when they finally nerf frost bomb.
Damage is still there, it doesn't matter if it takes 1 second longer, what makes it OP is that you know its coming, and if the healer has dispel on CD or is ccd you can expect to take 90k damage at least (non cds up), and i've seen it hit as high as 180k in arenas with Full cds, that just a "single" spell, chained with a deepfreeze and instant icelance is over 200k damage in a second.
The problem relies on big ammount of damage coming in so little time that it gets unheleable, and the ammount of CC that mages provides is absurd right now, if you buff their mobility then we will have mages running rampart in arenas (not that they aren't doing that right now).
Also mage is in a good spot in PvE (Fire spec is), You can get mobility when you have PvP issues covered.this is pretty much a pve thread. Has been for both iterations of it. I haven't seen anyone use anything but IW for PvP.
Yes but you can't balance PvE, without Hurting PvP same goes for PvP balance.
PvE was supossed to be balanced with the "New talent trees" leaving the numbers in passive abilities and balancing PvP thru talents, they were not suposse to affect numbers as I remember but utilities.
Oh please. Look at any arena ladder right now. Mages decently are represented, but nowhere near as much as warriors, paladins, hunters, or shamans. So spare me the "mages are running rampart" crap. Our control is getting nerfed bigtime and our burst is getting nerfed further than just a delay on frostbomb (see: GC's analysis). So we need compensation, because if we don't have our burst, we have nothing. We're hardcast dependent, our kiting has been nerfed with imp. coc gone. There are more stuns and interrupts than ever before. And considering burst is 100% necessary this xpac with hour powerful healing is, I'd say we're going to need a hell of a lot more tweaks to come come 5.1
And with that, I bolded the part where I actually agree. The mage talent trees have THREE throughput tiers. It's absurd. They completely bungled our talents.
I'd happily take 11% spell damage increase + pve utility tier any day or the week instead of the gimmicky crap we have now.