Blood DK tanks Dual Weilding?

90 Orc Death Knight
8115
11/12/2012 04:03 AMPosted by Icelord
1. if death knights dont have a survivability issue then why have a seen none of them do any good at surviving, is that only in BC dungeons that they die alot, because that seems a bit illogical that it would only affect a small level range


They don't have Blood Shield yet. Low level dungeons are irrelevant to class balance at 90.

11/12/2012 04:03 AMPosted by Icelord
3. yes, just because something is there doesnt mean you should do it, but it represents that you CAN do it, so why would it exist if their was no possibility of it


Because most Runeforges are worthless and the ones that are useful you can only have about 2 at a time if you're DW which doesn't work for tanking sorry.
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90 Draenei Death Knight
11090
11/11/2012 10:08 PMPosted by Icelord
i was just thinking about this topic and wondered (prove me wrong if i am wrong) but with DW wouldnt it give you more survivability considering that all 2 handers have DPS specs but there are 1 handers designed for tanks, so dual weilding tank weps would increase you survivabilty (which i beleive to be the strongest weakness of a dk as they cannot use a sheild and therefore loose alot of armour), then in the way of threat: 1. in blood presence you generate double threat by default and 2. blood boil does mega damage and geuss what it doesnt scale off your weapon damage mix theese 2 together and you can almost garrentee never loosing threat that fight.


I just realized that this is all apparently 1 sentence.

Anyway, yes, theoretically, you do have more survivability from stats with 2 tanking 1-handers, but realistically, you don't because RNG exists. I'm not talking about worst-case scenario RNG, either. The stat gain is rendered insignificant in the face of RNG. It was like 0.3% in Cataclysm, which was well within the margin of error. In MoP, there is even less benefit to DW-ing (SoB nets less RP). Really, you aren't at a disadvantage because your 2H weapons don't have pure tank stats on them. Swordshattering is miles better than any other tank weapon with its enchant plus its secondary stats.

Using a 1H weapon, when almost all of your highest damage-dealing attacks are based off of main-hand weapon damage, is going to hemorrhage your DPS. Thus, even though you may have the threat output necessary to hold threat, you could be doing tremendously more damage.

Spamming Blood Boil is a crutch for DW. It may do more damage than Heart Strike, but the simple fact of the matter is that a 2H using Heart Strike would hit much harder.
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100 Human Death Knight
12060
11/12/2012 04:03 AMPosted by Icelord
Everything. Everything is a fault with your theory. DKs don't have a survivability issue, Blood Presence is their shield. Blood Boil doesn't do mega damage at 90. Using weapons with different stats won't help you avoid DR. The fact that runeforges exist for a particular purpose is not evidence that you should do it. There's also Lichbane, but nobody uses that either.


1. if death knights dont have a survivability issue then why have a seen none of them do any good at surviving, is that only in BC dungeons that they die alot, because that seems a bit illogical that it would only affect a small level range

2. considering that DR is a thing that makes multiple of the SAME stat have less effect, then logicaly spreding various stats out evenly would make the penalty less. and yes i have been to the wiki and read up what DR means so dont give me that crap

3. yes, just because something is there doesnt mean you should do it, but it represents that you CAN do it, so why would it exist if their was no possibility of it

when you reply please use resourses to back yourself up, i dont mind being proven wrong, but not just being told without reason or logical explaination.


You're level 73. You are missing a ton of abilities that make a difference in endgame tanking. It would be like making a mage, getting rolled in level 19 WSG, and concluding that mages are horrible at PVP. Max level is really the only point where theory crafting and min/maxing matters. I'll not continue to debate max-level DKing with someone who's never been there. Your experience is what it is, but it's irrelevant to end game.

Edit: also, we've been dealing with these same exact arguments for 4 years and I have neither the time nor the inclination to repeat my reasoning against same for what would surely be the hundredth time. Frankly, if you want to dual wield so bad, go ahead. You might even do a decent job of it. But the math will bear out that you'd always be better off with a 2h.
Edited by Deathquoi on 11/12/2012 6:36 AM PST
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100 Blood Elf Death Knight
12905


1. if death knights dont have a survivability issue then why have a seen none of them do any good at surviving, is that only in BC dungeons that they die alot, because that seems a bit illogical that it would only affect a small level range

2. considering that DR is a thing that makes multiple of the SAME stat have less effect, then logicaly spreding various stats out evenly would make the penalty less. and yes i have been to the wiki and read up what DR means so dont give me that crap

3. yes, just because something is there doesnt mean you should do it, but it represents that you CAN do it, so why would it exist if their was no possibility of it

when you reply please use resourses to back yourself up, i dont mind being proven wrong, but not just being told without reason or logical explaination.

1. burning crusade is a derp area for dks. new players are attracted by the fact that a new class opens up at level 55 for them so they reroll, burn through the opening quests without ever really learning how to play a dk then queue for dungeons totally clueless. hence you see the frost/unholy dks trying to tank in blood presence, the blood boil spamming blood tanks that never even touch death strike never touching defensive cds etc. dont base a classes viability on underleveled content combined with the likelihood that a great number of the people playing at that level are totally clueless.

2. doesnt matter if you seperate which stats you are using. one handers have less raw stats to work with and they are still subject to DR. the gain is so small you dont notice it and once again this is not worth nerfing your damage output.

3. the only logical reason why dw still exists for blood and unholy spec dks is the starting quests for dks which require you to dw and torture scarlet crusade warriors. being funneled into frost wouldnt be fair to starting dk players. blizz has expressly stated that unholy and blood are 2h weapon specs. they are fine with blood dks dw tanking and if you can make it work thats great as long as it doesnt outshine 2h tanking but they have said they have no intention of adding features to make it work
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100 Draenei Death Knight
17865
This is the cries that never ends. It just goes on and on my friends. Somebody cried to dual wield tank not knowing why it sucks and they'll keep crying for it forever just because.
Repeating...
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90 Orc Death Knight
8115
Just like 2hand Enhancement and Blood dps..
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92 Blood Elf Death Knight
10115
i was thinking dk tanks should duel weild because that means much faster scent of blood procs= more death strike heals. and more runic power= more dps. but i didnt research much
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90 Goblin Death Knight
13715
Oh boy! What a thread to necro!
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90 Human Death Knight
9470
HOLY BATMAN'S BALLS NECRO!
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90 Night Elf Rogue
5635
Ok, just so I understand.

A lot of the Blood DK's abilities are based off of how much a single weapon strike does, so by using a one handed weapon, you do less damage per strike than if you used a two handed weapon, so your abilities do less. Is this correct?

Excuse my ignorance, I am essentially completely new to WoW. I played for a couple months back before WotLK released, quit, and recently a friend gave me a SoR. So, I'm new, and just trying to figure things out. I asked because I had wanted to dual wield, as it looks bad !@# IMO, but saw that everyone on here said Blood DK's can't/shouldn't do it.


dont know if this was replied to or not. just saw this and wanted to try to answer in a way that a new person might understand. The reason you dont want to use DW is as previously stated, because a blood dk's skills are based off of weapon damage. 2 1h weapons will have less overall power than a single 2h weapon of comparable level. Here is an example. You have two 1h Maces. in each tooltip it reads lets say. 280.4 dps. Now, on the otherhand you will have a 2h weapon of the same tier, an Axe whose tooltip will read, 740.6 dps. Since Blood spec has no passives that boost 1h weapons power, 2h is the best course of action.
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100 Orc Death Knight
12865
Leiyha, why the F*ck did you necro this thread? Everybody here is tired of seeing these threads.
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100 Blood Elf Death Knight
12905
Ok, just so I understand.

A lot of the Blood DK's abilities are based off of how much a single weapon strike does, so by using a one handed weapon, you do less damage per strike than if you used a two handed weapon, so your abilities do less. Is this correct?

Excuse my ignorance, I am essentially completely new to WoW. I played for a couple months back before WotLK released, quit, and recently a friend gave me a SoR. So, I'm new, and just trying to figure things out. I asked because I had wanted to dual wield, as it looks bad !@# IMO, but saw that everyone on here said Blood DK's can't/shouldn't do it.


dont know if this was replied to or not. just saw this and wanted to try to answer in a way that a new person might understand. The reason you dont want to use DW is as previously stated, because a blood dk's skills are based off of weapon damage. 2 1h weapons will have less overall power than a single 2h weapon of comparable level. Here is an example. You have two 1h Maces. in each tooltip it reads lets say. 280.4 dps. Now, on the otherhand you will have a 2h weapon of the same tier, an Axe whose tooltip will read, 740.6 dps. Since Blood spec has no passives that boost 1h weapons power, 2h is the best course of action.
thank you for repeating what has been made clear at least 20 times in this thread over a year ago
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96 Human Death Knight
9380
Are we going to revive this? *sits down and eats popcorn*
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90 Orc Death Knight
10370
10/29/2012 08:02 PMPosted by Kusari
because the important abilities scale with weapon damage. it isnt now and never will be viable
wrong use of the word viable once again

viable = feasible. which means it can be done. you are capable of dual wielding as a blood and meeting with success. however you are making it more difficult for your group in doing so.

the word you are looking for is optimal

dual wielding as a blood dk for the purpose of tanking is not optimal because there is no noticeable benefit for doing so and in turn are gimping your damage output since all of your strike abilities are based off of weapon damage.


Semantics.
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100 Blood Elf Death Knight
12905
03/29/2013 11:06 PMPosted by Lanthorin
wrong use of the word viable once again

viable = feasible. which means it can be done. you are capable of dual wielding as a blood and meeting with success. however you are making it more difficult for your group in doing so.

the word you are looking for is optimal

dual wielding as a blood dk for the purpose of tanking is not optimal because there is no noticeable benefit for doing so and in turn are gimping your damage output since all of your strike abilities are based off of weapon damage.


Semantics.
old thread
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90 Orc Death Knight
10370


Semantics.
old thread


Just noticed.
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96 Human Death Knight
9380
*stares at Kusari and Lanthorin still eating popcorn*
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90 Night Elf Rogue
5635
hehe! Fear the Master Necro Rogue? 0.o *scurries away*
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100 Orc Death Knight
12865
Reported for trolling.
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