5.2 Rise of the Thunder King!

So what options do they have now? If you cannot see that killing him vindicates his prejudices because we shown him that we will continue to slaughter and impede troll kind no matter what. So he thinks to himself - I was right. Humans/Orcs/Pandaren their all the same they take and take and never consider us. While we think the same of him and the genocide we feel he has called against us.

In the end two wrongs don't make a right. He's wrong and we're wrong but we know better.
Sparing him forces him to realize that we're not all the same and there is another path. If he can some how be made to realize that even in his death throes that the path for his people is born in peace than maybe then 4.2 and 5.2 will be worth it.

That's what I want to see.


Still doesn't justify tying killing Zul with committing genocide. Zul has committed crimes against the Horde and Alliance and for that he must be brought to justice regardless of how well he can justify his own actions.

This does not mean that after we kill Zul (along with most of the Zandalari's upper leadership most likely) we can't spare the remaining Trolls. Perhaps a new leader rises up who is more amicable to the idea of peace. Perhaps we simply intimidate them into not crossing us again without butchering every man, woman, and child.
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85 Blood Elf Warlock
10350
I think that it would make for interesting story if Blizzard presented that particular scenario. Throwing the whole, "it's not right," or "it's not fair!" or "it's not equivalent" arguments out of the mix and simply presenting it as is would make for an interesting player base study of what they value more, gear or sparing lives.
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100 Blood Elf Death Knight
9765
I'd like to see it be a total anti-climax - instead of the now trite big bad showing up and "oooh, only these 10 or so people have ANY hope of defeating him", I'd like to see it used to better leverage the sheer power an scope of the Horde and/or Alliance.

Let's take the big leaders of the Wandring Isle Pandaren, Lord Zhu, Lorewalker Cho, and maybe even one of the celestials. We plunge in on behalf of Pandaria, but... hey, this inflated lion dog squid monster thing might get int he way of the superpowers, so THEY send someone in on the back end - pick any severe Horde or Alliance badass leading them. Jaina, Rexxar, Crowly, Saurfang - anyone really signature and powerful beyond reason.

We get to the top and, oops, turns out Commander Badass of the Horde/Alliance found another way in and beat us up there. Zul's already dead, the room looks like a bomb convention rioted held a riot inside, and the Thunder King is trying to escape.

Something to give Pandaria some semblance of what it's really up against when it comes to the modern world - we've dealt with threats and dangers that make this oh so terrible "Thunder King" look like schoolyard bully, and hammering that home, that the most terrible thing in their history is really nothing compared to the powers knocking on their door, would put things in perspective for the Pandaren people better than anything we could hope to explain.

It's one thing to have Prince Peaceybald tell stories to some tiger, but seeing your very legends and nightmares crushed under the weight of what's coming is entirely another.
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90 Pandaren Monk
10655
I think that it would make for interesting story if Blizzard presented that particular scenario. Throwing the whole, "it's not right," or "it's not fair!" or "it's not equivalent" arguments out of the mix and simply presenting it as is would make for an interesting player base study of what they value more, gear or sparing lives.


That's my point. Its easy to just play it out that Zul and the Thunder King are just big bad that need to die. Their people are broken and desperate. I want to see and hear this in the raid. I guess I'm tired of the stereotypical villain that gives the usual I'm evil speech and I want to destroy you all.

If the Thunder King and Zul and Rastakhan are to be killed then let them die on terms which makes them the antivillains. We know the Mogu are desperate for leadership and the Thunder King is the FOUNDER of their empire. It would be like us resurrecting John Adams or Thomas Jefferson for advice and leadership experience. To the Mogu he's that big of a deal. Let's see them revere him and ask, "Why?" Perhaps the answer is that they themselves need to change and adapt in order to survive.

The Zandalari also need to have this experience. A moment where they realize how pointless this war is. They break down as they see their leaders/saviors die infront of them. They need to be shown as a broken people and after all our murdering we need to be asked, "Are you satisfied?" It then throws our actions against us sorta like how Vanessa VanCleef, daughter of Edwin VanCleef, was shown to us. A little girl crying witnessing her father's murder by the players hand. Worse she witnessed his beheading. How traumatic was this to her?

We need this moment again just in a grand cinematic style. The survivors need to be shown picking up the bodies of their leaders and putting them to rest. The survivors crying helplessly asking us, "WHY?" This would put it back on us. We murdered their leadership who were beloved by their people. We butchered violent men but we did so without thinking how this would reflect on the mind of the people they led.
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90 Human Warlock
13830
I don't think the Mogu have a wide enough range of emotion to weep over the corpse of their leader. They would be more likely to vote YOU to be their new leader, since their succession of leadership is based on eliminating the opposing regime.
Come to think of it, that could be the groundwork for a 'friendly' Mogu faction like the Klaxxi. A short term alliance to solve a prickly problem.

Zul could have dissentors in his faction already, much like Garrosh does within the Horde. We don't have enough information though to assume that there are enough of them in the right places to form their own splinter group to send us on quests to curry their favor and fight the good fight, or even any friendly Zandalari left at all. From what we've seen from the trolls so far, I don't expect any quarter to be asked or given.
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90 Pandaren Monk
10655
I don't think the Mogu have a wide enough range of emotion to weep over the corpse of their leader. They would be more likely to vote YOU to be their new leader, since their succession of leadership is based on eliminating the opposing regime.
Come to think of it, that could be the groundwork for a 'friendly' Mogu faction like the Klaxxi. A short term alliance to solve a prickly problem.

Zul could have dissentors in his faction already, much like Garrosh does within the Horde. We don't have enough information though to assume that there are enough of them in the right places to form their own splinter group to send us on quests to curry their favor and fight the good fight, or even any friendly Zandalari left at all. From what we've seen from the trolls so far, I don't expect any quarter to be asked or given.


In the world of trolls I think you maybe right. They are the most stubborn race on Azeroth but I'd like to think at the brink of extinction they have a change of heart or at least a mental breakdown where they begin to question their culture and purpose, but knowing how the Zandalari have acted as of late they may prefer extinction than submission but IF they can be convinced otherwise than maybe the trolls can be spared. Considering that Rastakhan ordered his hands to help kill Hakkar than maybe he could reign in his people and lead a splinter group but as far as we know he's all for troll dominion as envisioned by Zul.

The Mogu on the other hand worship power. He who has the most is to be respected but they also hate non Mogu races, but if they see Lei Shi, the Thunder King die than they pretty much have to accept us as their betters since the Thunder King was their effective progenitor of their culture, language, and system of laws. If he's dead then we must be his better and if we are his better then well they must serve us... I kinda like the ring of that.... from slave to master and from master to slave! Though I think the Mogu would also prefer extinction like the trolls.
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10 Blood Elf Paladin
1095
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Our players grab the hand of a child and menacingly grin. The screen turns black and we hear screams from the children and the elderly.


This part creeped me out.
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90 Dwarf Paladin
14910
I find it funny they're calling it "Rise of the Thunder King" when he'll be dead in less than a month on all difficulties. The Thunder Kings is barely going to register as a speed bump, even in the short term.
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