Sick of Blizz Lies about hearing feedback

90 Draenei Shaman
17085
11/13/2012 01:46 PMPosted by Sanglis


Sure, you could skip dailies completely -- and you'd be left with exactly what to do ingame?

There's no depth to this expansion at all. It's dailies or nothing.


Another useless post. What, will you suggest takes the place of dailies? Grind mobs for resistances gear to provide longevity? A content block has always meant to last at least 4-5 months of entertainment.

This means giving players things to do when they log in, pray tell what else can Blizzard implement that you have not yet dismiss as "not interested"? You certainly didn't list BG, Arena, Pet Battles, alts, archaeology, dungeon runs, LFR, raids. The entitled bunch of whiners have dismissed any and everything as not interested, not fun if it does not provide almost immediate increase in power.

MMO has always been and always will be a grind game, the amount of whining and the massive nit-picking of any blue post is disgusting. This is not feedback, this is some sort of agenda to force Blizzard to change the direction of the game yet AGAIN like the great cataclysm dungeon nerfs.

I sincerely hope Blizzard stays strong and not bend over backwards for these whiners, because every single time Blizzard made earth-shattering changes, another bunch of whiners will just hop out and whine and beg for more.

For example, once players stop doing dailies, the amount of other activities that grant VP is simply not enough, and capping VP becomes difficult. They will end up doing 25 dungeon runs, which is about 15-20 minutes each totalling to 7-8 hours. The same whiners will come here crying and begging Blizzard to increase VP for dungeon, and they will utterly refuse to do anything else in the game.


Tell me -- is there one zone in Pandaria that has anything even remotely as epic as the Vashir quest chain? Uldum? Icecrown?

Does MV even make sense? I mean, why are we raiding it? We come to this new Panda land and they immediately need our help with this MV thing? Did they not know it existed? If so, how? The Drakkari apparently know about it. Isn't it a little forward of us to be visitors on their land, but go, "Yeah, no prob, we'll kill everything in there for you whether you need it or not?"

BTW -- Love the Shadopan 2nd boss telling us we need to learn to be less angry and violent by sending 25 of his students to punch us in the face. And when we best them, 2 of his best students do the same. And when we best them, he'll do it himself, while he lectures about how he turned his body into a weapon. And when we beat him by punching him in teh face even harder, he tells us "Good job."

Hypocrite, much? Or just some Dev/Designer who wasn't even thinking when they implemented this?

You know, you list all these things to do like I'm oblivious to the fact they exist. Maybe you could like click on that little picture in the corner of my posts and see that -- Hey, he's done them! And then slowly let 2+2 add up... Realize, wow all that crap I suggested he should do... he has already done... in less than a month...

So, let me remind you this is a MMORPG with a monthly subscription fee. That fee implies that there will be content that requires longer than a month to do. Or at least can fill out an entire month. I'm saying, there isn't.

While you may find my post "yet another pointless post," I really don't care. Cause apparently youa re happy with the game being for mindless drones that don't give a crap if they pay an endless subscription fee for nothing.

Me on the other hand, I care about that stuff. I'm broke. And I've player WoW for a very long time.

This is the first expansion where I felt the Dev team phoned it in. (Cata wasn't great. It misfired on a lot of levels. But it was TRYING. And for the most part, it was fun, and had a TON of content). Really, where Cata failed was only with DS.

MoP failed by trying to kowtow to casuals to the point that it is such a casual game it is disposable.
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90 Dwarf Warrior
14695
11/13/2012 05:00 PMPosted by Upton
Let's say I want the Shado-pan helm item for my Death Knight. Let's say I get him to 90 today. Let's say that, once hitting 90, I begin to work on Shado-Pan rep and I am happy to do so because I really want the helm transmog on my Death Knight, because trust me, I do indeed like dailies. Just not so much this time.


So...you just want the item handed to you (I'm assuming you're talking about the Replica Shado-pan Helmet)? This example would be like walking into a raid, looking at the boss and instead of killing him, asking him for the loot. Also, its a vanity item, so its not required for anything.

And lets say this DK is your alt, and you've already done the quests up to exalted Shado-Pan on your main. Yep that grind a 2nd time is going to suck, but guess what! They're changing that in 5.1 (yet another example that blizzard listens to feedback - yes I'm trying to keep this thread on topic somewhat, shameful!).
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90 Tauren Druid
3310
I like how the people on these forums always assume to speak for all 10 million players. Less than 1% of the player base posts here. Don't inflate your own worth, buddy.

You do not speak for me.


None of us speaks for you only because you're here doing it yourself. However, don't underestimate the value to Blizzard of each and every player who does post on these forums in a polite and constructive manner.

If less than 1% of the player base posts here, then the remainder is most certainly represented by those of us who do, whether they like it or not. Blizzard has no other system in place to gauge the temperature of the player base, other than watching subscriptions. While watching subscription numbers can help them tell if they're doing a good job, it really does nothing to help them know what they're doing wrong(if anything).

Don't deflate your worth, buddy.
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90 Orc Hunter
8590
"Dailies are optional" is quite possibly the dumbest thing I have ever read.

By your logic, driving to work is optional. Using a stove is optional. Using hot water is optional.

its funny because everything you said is in fact optional, you never have to drive to work, use a stove, or even use hot water.
you never have to do dailies EVER. If you think you do then you have problems.
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90 Dwarf Warrior
14695
11/13/2012 05:06 PMPosted by Deafwing
"Dailies are optional" is quite possibly the dumbest thing I have ever read


Technically, I can see how they are optional. They're iLvl 489, which is the same iLvl as normal raids. Why would you farm for valor gear thats 489, then raid and replace it with MORE 489 gear? That's like buying a brand new house, then building one because someone told you it was "better" that way.

Now if you're Min/Maxing, dailies become much more necessary. Its my opinion that that's part of the min/maxing deal, if you want to have the very best gear the fastest, you need to put some work in.
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41 Troll Mage
220
Let's say I want the Shado-pan helm item for my Death Knight. Let's say I get him to 90 today. Let's say that, once hitting 90, I begin to work on Shado-Pan rep and I am happy to do so because I really want the helm transmog on my Death Knight, because trust me, I do indeed like dailies. Just not so much this time.


So...you just want the item handed to you (I'm assuming you're talking about the Replica Shado-pan Helmet)? This example would be like walking into a raid, looking at the boss and instead of killing him, asking him for the loot. Also, its a vanity item, so its not required for anything.

And lets say this DK is your alt, and you've already done the quests up to exalted Shado-Pan on your main. Yep that grind a 2nd time is going to suck, but guess what! They're changing that in 5.1 (yet another example that blizzard listens to feedback - yes I'm trying to keep this thread on topic somewhat, shameful!).


How about in his example he could, ya know, FARM the faction he wants instead of it being gated behind a very very slow one first?

I understand the idea behind "Don't finish something too fast" in an mmo. But there's a fine line that got crossed along the way. I'm not someone that says that removing the daily cap was a bad thing, but having dailies be the end all be all right now is dumb. They reward too much in the current game, with no alternative.
Edited by Chiethree on 11/13/2012 5:17 PM PST
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48 Worgen Warrior
0
11/13/2012 05:07 PMPosted by Bjorgas
So...you just want the item handed to you (I'm assuming you're talking about the Replica Shado-pan Helmet)?


It's funny that not once did I ever say I wanted anything handed to me, and specifically said

I begin to work on Shado-Pan rep and I am happy to do so because I really want the helm transmog on my Death Knight, because trust me, I do indeed like dailies.


and that you completely miss the entire point of my post in doing so.

This example would be like walking into a raid, looking at the boss and instead of killing him, asking him for the loot. Also, its a vanity item, so its not required for anything.


No, this example is like me walking into a raid, killing the boss, and getting loot, because I never once said I don't like dailies.

And lets say this DK is your alt, and you've already done the quests up to exalted Shado-Pan on your main. Yep that grind a 2nd time is going to suck, but guess what!

I can actually start on Shado-pan without wasting 23 days of my life doing a faction I don't actually care about because Shado-pan totally aren't locked behind a completely irrelavent faction to my goal?

They're changing that in 5.1 (yet another example that blizzard listens to feedback - yes I'm trying to keep this thread on topic somewhat, shameful!).


Not really no. Shado-pan are still locked behind a completely irrelavent faction's rep.
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90 Dwarf Warrior
14695
11/13/2012 05:16 PMPosted by Chiethree
How about in his example he could, ya know, FARM the faction he wants instead of it being gated behind a very very slow one first?


I'll agree with you on the point that gating Shado-Pan / August Celestials behind revered Golden Lotus isn't awesome and makes it feel much more grindy. I read a post somewhere earlier (maybe it was even this thread) that I liked that suggested changing it to honored Golden Lotus, which is attainable much more quickly.
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90 Draenei Shaman
17085
"Dailies are optional" is quite possibly the dumbest thing I have ever read.

By your logic, driving to work is optional. Using a stove is optional. Using hot water is optional.

its funny because everything you said is in fact optional, you never have to drive to work, use a stove, or even use hot water.
you never have to do dailies EVER. If you think you do then you have problems.


That's what makes it a solid analogy.

This is the kind of circuitous logic that Blizzard is using. They're playing a very dangerous game, because what they are saying is:

"No one is forcing you to do anything." Which is true. But the second half is "You can always quit." Which seems odd that this would be their stance.

What players are saying is --"Hey, I like your game. It used to be fun. It's not anymore. And I think it is for these reasons. Maybe you should make it fun again before I get bored and quit?"

Instead of addressing these issues, the overwhelming Blue response seems to be "Nuh uh. You're wrong."
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90 Dwarf Warrior
14695
It's funny that not once did I ever say I wanted anything handed to me, and specifically said

I begin to work on Shado-Pan rep and I am happy to do so because I really want the helm transmog on my Death Knight, because trust me, I do indeed like dailies.


You're right, I misread your post. My apologies. I still disagree with completely removing gating from Shado-pan / August Celestials. Lowering the requirement isn't a bad idea, but removing it would mean your hat would be much less unique (which is part of what makes it so cool in my opinion).
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90 Gnome Priest
17660

While better gear is always helpful, the rep gear is only compelling enough to be called "necessary" relatively early in the progression cycle - and, in truth, it's only "necessary" for the guilds that are competing on that level. On the other hand, it seems that a certain type of player is always running extra miles of one sort or another to be at the cutting edge of content in every expansion, and with every new raid release. I mean, is any tangible, useful reward we provide--regardless of venue--going to seem to be anything less than absolutely mandatory to such a player, unless it is purely cosmetic?


This is confusing. First we get told that it isn't necessary at all. Now we're getting told that it is necessary for some but only those who are competing at the top levels.

Why are you gating gear that's "necessary" for the top end raiders behind daily rep grinds? Why not place the rep grinds into the raids themselves if they're the ones who need the gear?

And I suspect that you know this still isn't the truth. Right now, you need VP gear to get into HoF LFR if you don't already raid normal/heroic modes unless you had a massively lucky streak of RNG in MSV LFR or you're hideously rich on a realm with an AH that's well stocked with BoE epics. The personal loot system is designed to specifically prevent that because you know that most players are loot driven and you claim they get what they want they stop logging in so you want to slow down how fast that loot is obtained.

If the 16% chance to get loot that everyone keeps throwing out as the chance to get loot is correct, it will take the median player 57 boss kill, or 10 weeks in MSV LFR to get enough 476 gear to make it into the queue for the other raids. And that's only if the 16% drop rate yielded a new, usable item each time. If they get a 4th pair of gauntlets off Elegon while the weapons they actually need still don't drop (as is happening to one of my guildies), that could stretch out how many weeks they need that much more.

That means they would have endure at least another month of the same 6 bosses over and over. Would you be happy with only the same 6 bosses again over and over while the fruit pickers get to queue for for 16 bosses? Is this honestly good game design in Blizzard's mind to put the quality rewards behind the tedious but easymode work-like content while denying equivalent quality rewards from those who are participating in content that require at least a little bit of skill and raid awareness?
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90 Dwarf Warrior
14695
Yeah, let's talk about transmog. All the restrictions, all the complaints, all the problems.

Let's talk about how blizz has dealt with transmog feedback.


If you're referring to allowing lvl 60 pvp gear to be Transmog'd by anyone, or other examples where gear was earned (when it was relevant) by a very small portion of the WoW population, they have listened to feedback. The feedback of those who want it kept unique, because they earned it back in the day.

Edit: I guess I'm unfamiliar with any "problems" with Transmogrification you may be suggesting, unless you mean what I stated above.\

Edit #2: They also changed many fist weapons to be "One-Handed" instead of "Main Hand" as to make Transmoging them much easier, which I believe was a request from many people. Just one example that comes to mind. :)
Edited by Bjorgas on 11/13/2012 5:32 PM PST
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90 Goblin Shaman
15035
That's fairly rude and unbecoming of someone who is in the position you are in, Dax.

Treating people like an animal by saying, "No! Bad!" and then rubbing their nose in it for jumping the gun is definately not what you should have done. Rather, you should have POLITELY STATED the incorrectness of it and moved on.

In this case, both parties here made an error in judgment. Shame to both of you.
That's fairly rude to assume that of his intent. Just chill out and don't try to read between the lines when there's nothing there. It was a funny exclamation, that's all. Sorry if you failed to see that and just wanted an excuse to act offended.

Jebus l2humor or something.
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86 Human Hunter
1175
Blizz: You need gear for raids

Player: Ok! What's the most effective way to get gear for raiding?

Blizz: heroics, dailies, lfr

Player: ok, got my heroic gear, 0/3 on lfr. Boy those dailies are really not fun though. But, now that I have my heroic gear and lfr done this weak, what more could I do?

Blizz: Dailies

Player: But that's the thing I hate doing. You know, I don't mind doing dungeons for like 3 hours, and I bet teams could use a good tank; maybe if you give me a tabard?

Blizz: No, Dailies


Then it's a personal thing, nothing too important. You don't like dailies? Well, sorry, you have to do dailies, like it or not, because dailies are a big part of the game and that can't be changed over night or ever.

Grump, grump, nothing to do here.
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6 Gnome Warlock
0
Please do something about Galleon's Spawn rates, that is great gear, but I never get a chance at it........same gear as Sha....so what gives, it's so unfair
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90 Blood Elf Rogue
14935
The current dailies might feel that mandatory to some particularly progression focused players, but it is entirely possible to skip them, and the gear they provide, pretty much entirely and still arrive at the same level of character potency.

No doubt someone will mention profession recipes. Profession recipes have virtually always required some hoop jumping - ranging from RNG raid drops to rep grinds; the best recipes have always required a little something extra.


The message I interpret from Daxxtari’s and Zarhym’s earlier comments are that Blizzard are taking something of an “it’s your problem not ours” kind of approach with the suggestion that if players don’t like the daily system, just go around it.

I do think it’s quite an assumption to pin a dislike of the daily reward system down to particularly progression focused players. I don’t know what kind of data led to that conclusion.

Just like skipping dailies, it’s also possible to arena in quest greens to earn conquest gear if you didn’t like to BG, but that doesn’t mean it’s a good method. Of course Honour gains didn’t get nerfed in MoP whereas Rep gains seem to have been nerfed hard with much more placed behind them.

As to the recipes virtually always requiring some hoop jumping, I seem to remember rolling up to a vendor in Cataclysm and buying all my Enchanting, Tailoring and Blacksmithing recipes by turning in materials. I didn’t hear anyone complaining about that. It’s quite different to have a recipe or two sat behind a faction’s rep as opposed to a bunch of recipes.

It’s Blizzard’s game and they can do what they want. If the response to player expressed discontent is to suggest players just go around the ‘daily problem’ then that’s the response.

I don’t have to agree with it and I don’t have to put up with it and I sure don’t think double rep for alts once you’re exalted on one character is going to make any difference to my opinion of the MoP reward systems.
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