Sick of Blizz Lies about hearing feedback

90 Human Paladin
11825
11/16/2012 02:08 PMPosted by Daralii
Fishing tournament's back in 5.1, they're working on the timezone issues. Fixing things in a game this big isn't as simple as hitting a magic [FIX THINGS] button. I shudder to think how many millions of lines of code the devs have to comb through.


So why couldn't they roll back/disable CRZs in the meantime while they debug the feature on PTRs?

The only reason I could think of is that CRZ was used as a cost cutting measure and they physically couldn't roll it back due to lack of servers.

But we'll see if they fix it. (-_-);
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90 Pandaren Monk
10790
11/16/2012 02:19 PMPosted by Xiaoli
Sick of Blizz Lies about hearing feedback


In all honesty, I am sick of ignorant players carelessly talking out their pooters with no repercussions.
I like you.
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Community Manager
11/16/2012 02:20 PMPosted by Reactable
Sure and you also have feedback from people that work at Blizzard that play in this world they helped to create. Surely having that internal type of data proves to be useful in seeing what is going on in the game?


Absolutely.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
15755
11/16/2012 02:20 PMPosted by Reactable
Sure and you also have feedback from people that work at Blizzard that play in this world they helped to create. Surely having that internal type of data proves to be useful in seeing what is going on in the game?


Just because you dont like it, doesnt mean its bad.
And you cant speak for everyone. Just because you see a bunch of people mad out of their mind doesnt mean something is wrong. No it means they are just mad.



"Mostly" is a key part of that sentence. There are certainly still improvements to make.



Your guess is spot on. We are constantly gathering and analyzing information on gameplay. Raw data is tremendously useful, but it doesn't really offer context, which is why other sources of information are essential.


Sure and you also have feedback from people that work at Blizzard that play in this world they helped to create. Surely having that internal type of data proves to be useful in seeing what is going on in the game?


Just because you dont like it, doesnt mean its bad.
And you cant speak for everyone. Just because you see a bunch of people mad out of their mind doesnt mean something is wrong. No it means they are just mad.

EDIT: wrong quote
Edited by Potato on 11/16/2012 2:24 PM PST
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90 Night Elf Druid
10550
11/15/2012 02:29 PMPosted by Abluething
Read it again smart guy. Toon has been 90 for 2 weeks. Check the Armoury if you like. Have a couple of items from MV and the Sha boots. Completed the quests for Kalaxxi and Shadow-pan whilst leveling and have not hit honoured with either. Even were I to make or buy the crafted gloves and get the cloak to 463 I would still not have ilvl to get into HoF LFR. Now it's not like its BC and I'm wanting to jump straight nto BT. This is the first tier of raiding. Unless I do dailies or hope for drops I will not have the ilvl to get in.


Sorry, but I'm not in the practice of looking at everyone's armory before I respond to their posts. Also, your comment I quoted did not say you were 90 for only 2 weeks and you did not state which LFR you were referring to, so you can save the snitty remarks.

Given the progression path laid out for those that can only do LFR for whatever reason, you shouldn't be able to jump right into HoF LFR like you're wanting to do.
Heroic Dungeons/Crafted Gear > MV LFR > HoF LFR.
MV and HoF LFR may be considered the first tier but as far as difficulty goes, HoF is harder hence the higher and justified ilvl requirement. You have a couple pieces of raid finder gear from a total of 2 LFR runs. I don't consider that crappy RNG.

I've not done a lot of dailies at all because I too find them repetitive and boring, yet by running dungeons, LFR and some normal MV bosses, I've amassed enough Valor to obtain 2 pieces of gear from the Klaxxi. Do you not have any valor from your dungeon running, Sha killing and LFR rolling? You are also honored with the Klaxxi (which you claimed to not be), not to mention Golden Lotus. That's at least a few pieces of valor gear open to you. If you don't want to do dailies, then run more heroic dungeons for the valor.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
5670
11/16/2012 02:08 PMPosted by Camaltoe
Nothing has been given or said one way or the other.


Never hurts to be polite.

Besides, I've already made my decision about playing in this expansion and my account runs out in January. I'll keep an eye on the patch notes, but I'd have to see something really enticing to bring me back.

Until then, I'll log on every once in a while (maybe) and continue to provide whatever feedback I can that isn't tasty and delicious bait for some internet troll.

But sometimes it's really hard, oh my yes it is ......
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90 Draenei Paladin
8910
Jeez, it's like as more time goes on more of the player base becomes more and more entitled. Honestly it's like seeing a bunch of little kids in a store crying because their parents vetoed their suggestion of candy for dinner and it's only gotten worse with MoP.

I'm not saying that the points people bring up occasionally aren't well thought out but, this constant "Waaaah, you didn't change what I want you guys don't listen to us! We're your customers you have to respect our opinions" is infuriating! And sadly because of the latter the former gets drowned out and rarely seen.
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90 Night Elf Hunter
9140
11/16/2012 02:27 PMPosted by Hozzarn
any ETA on the CRZ fixes?


I'll take next expansion for 1,000 Alex...
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90 Human Priest
7535
Wait just curious, how important are the analytics of previous expansions, when you guys are developing a new expansion?
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
19665
11/16/2012 01:49 PMPosted by Daxxarri
CRZ is harshly criticized by some, and praised by some, but mostly it fits seamlessly into the gameplay of many


Once all the bugs are set on fire and destroyed i think CRZ will be great.

11/16/2012 01:49 PMPosted by Daxxarri
And, on that note, it's very much worth noting that we change our minds with a fair amount of frequency. Our decision to provide alternative means to acquire Brawler's Guild invitations was based on player feedback


Thank you so much for making that change!

11/16/2012 01:49 PMPosted by Daxxarri
Yes, the current design for dailies is very much based on player feedback, and it fixes some of the things that, ultimately, really weren't working well in Cataclysm


There are alot of dailys at first it was all very daunting for me and took about 2 ours to complete them but i got exalted with every faction pretty fast.
What i like most about the dailys is the EPIC quests you get at the end of shado-pan GL Klaxxi, i like how you get different buffs from klaxxi and companions from shado pan =)

11/16/2012 01:49 PMPosted by Daxxarri
Brace yourself, because I'm about to say some things that will probably ruffle a few feathers. Got your feathers ready?


Sigh, Exuse me while i go fix my feathers =(
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- Hearthstone
100 Tauren Paladin
12695
11/16/2012 02:15 PMPosted by Daxxarri
If CRZ is here to stay, it would be nice if we could get some confimation that the fishing tournaments will be back and that two player mounts will eventually be fixed.


Those are both issues that we're working on, amongst others.


I hope one of those issues is Darkmoon Faire time issues. While you're working on the Fishing Tournaments, which were disabled because of time differences, you could look into fixing DMF ending early for the western half of the US playerbase.

I suggest a "simple" change such as forcing CRZ off in Mulgore, Elwynn, and Terokkar while DMF is active, "simple" being subjective. This would also be a good option to fix the Fishing Tournaments, if you want to have Stranglethorn and Crystalsong/Dalaran disabled only during those events (or 30 minutes before and after the events happen).

Either way, DMF and the Fishing Tournaments are essentially in the same boat when it comes to CRZ issues.
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100 Dwarf Hunter
23125
11/16/2012 01:58 PMPosted by Daxxarri
"Mostly" is a key part of that sentence. There are certainly still improvements to make.

I'm afraid I'm in the camp that can't even agree to this much. The only sense of it being seamless is that there isn't actual loading screens between zones (but the 5+ seconds of lock-up feels like a brief loading screen anyway -- if not more annoying).

In every other sense, it feels pretty 'seamed'. The tools for checking who is in a zone aren't present/working correctly, passenger mounts are hopelessly broken (with no fix in sight since it's 'tricky' -- I'm of the opinion that this alone should have delayed the CRZ launch), and the aforementioned lockup when crossing boundaries. (Edit: Forgot time changes around dawn/dusk times and the total shutdown of the fishing tournaments.)

At least the bugs that made it worse than actually zoning into an instance have (mostly -- "You feel normal. You feel normal. You feel normal. You feel normal.") been fixed. Once it's entirely fixed, then I guess we could finally agree on it being 'mostly' seamless.
Edited by Itarater on 11/16/2012 2:42 PM PST
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90 Human Warrior
13015


They haven't said anything. All they said was "it based on feedback". Blizzard could look at that anyway they want. They could say "we have feedback where people said they love dailies so we are keeping things they way they are based on feedback." If they do this they commit no resources to a change and status quo. People grind and pay.

People get so happy when they see blue text that they fail to read what is actually being posted. Blizzard CMs have elevated vague posting to art form rivaled only by politicians. Hell if their public speaking skills were anywhere near what their posting skills are they could run for public office and be quite successful.

Almost every post a blizzard CM posts can be broken down to the following:

A firm definite of a possible maybe

They are the dog that is wagging its tail but growling at you. You don't know which direction they are coming form.

Nothing has been given or said one way or the other.


They can't promise anything, that's part of how corporations work. Unless you are talking to the CEO, or Managing director, most people don't make 100% commitment because they won't know if another department can/have the time/resources to commit. You can strong arm the CEO and demands to talk to them, but ultimately the ones who makes the game and knows the ground works/schedule knows whether they can deliver, not the top personnal. The only few who knows how everything works probably don't want to burn their office politic credits on forcing somethings to work.

Everything is wrapped in red tape around one-another, your demand merely demonstrates your lack of experience in corporate environment, which is fine, different people works in different fields. However, if you want 100% promise, transparency from dev, who is also the director, the CM, you have to find a smaller company's game. Blizzard at it's size, is absolutely doing the best it can considering all sides.

People need to give Blizzard more time, no one I know in software industy will want to work on a Legacy system like WoW and had to pump out hotfix after hotfix. Not to mention patches and major content release.

The success of hotfix seems to create an illusion in players that EVERYTHING can be hotfix or fix is easy, this is not only ridiculous, but downright bat!@#$ insane if you think of it from a coder's PoV. There are things that need world restarts, tons of testing and fine-combing to ensure they don't interrupt another legacy block of codes, and to find ways to fix where none existed and there's no precedence to follow. (CRZ causing multi-player mounts to fail probably fall into this category) There are things in coding that can't be solve no matter how much time and money you throw at it, and you won't know it until it already broke too many things. Not to mention to get the approvals for change, you need to wade through a corporate hierachy.

Players gave Blizzard too little credit for the world they have created, the incredile responsivenes of their toons, the amount of optimization and creativity to make this magic last for as long as it has, and Blizzard has continue to deliver. The amount of fixes and support Blizzard provide would have cost anyone in business environment hundreds per month but players continue to hold up their $15 like it's a golden ticket that requires first priority. Everyone have their concerns, sure. List them up and move on, there's really NO need for the hostility many has display here, especially towards CMs.
Edited by Sanglis on 11/16/2012 2:46 PM PST
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90 Human Paladin
8535
11/16/2012 02:15 PMPosted by Daxxarri
There are discussions about adding in some reputation gain from other methods. There's not much concrete to report yet, though.


Daxx, have you thought about implementing daily dungeons again such as were present in BC and LK? Except this time, you could have a faction leader (i.e. whoever is in charge of the Shado Pan, Klaxxi, etc.) task you with clearing a dungeon related to their lore. When completed you would be rewarded VP and rep with that particular faction. I think this would be an excellent middle ground for everyone.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
7665
11/16/2012 02:15 PMPosted by Daxxarri
I don't know why you guys cannot admit you made a mistake and just give us some alternate ways to gain rep. Many excellent suggestions have been made and yes, before you say it, making the dailies the only path to reputation progression was a mistake.


There are discussions about adding in some reputation gain from other methods. There's not much concrete to report yet, though.

If CRZ is here to stay, it would be nice if we could get some confimation that the fishing tournaments will be back and that two player mounts will eventually be fixed.


Those are both issues that we're working on, amongst others.


Daxx, you're the best. Thank you in the strongest terms for getting back to us about these pain points (especially CRZ and the Brawlers guild)!

We all (well, most anyhow) understand the concept of an echo chamber and do appreciate the work you guys do. To paraphase a quote GC used; "If Henry Ford had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses." That said, we're just trying to say the seats in your new car are a bit uncomfortable. :)
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