Account-wide Cloud Serpent Riding?

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90 Undead Warrior
11040
Look you guys dont think they know its stupid, trust me they do its just the easiest solution to players consuming content too fast and the entire reason the game is gated this way with dailies.

The longer they keep us doing the same dailies over and over the longer they have to develop new real content. They mask the dailies as new content but its just recycled gated trash.

The longer we do the dailies the longer they have to develop new content and to keep telling us "look your not out of things to do you dont have cloud serpent on your alts do you?"

While I am not saying I agree with this system, in fact I hate it, but make no mistake this is why its there.


I agree with you on the other factions and dailies, but I honestly think the Order of the Cloud Serpent faction requirement was just an oversight, and what Blizzard (and Fasc) are offering are just post hoc explanations.


I don't because even if you don't want the mounts from factions you cant use any of the raid or heroic meta mounts without grinding it, this is working as intended.

When have they ever said "we know you did all of the heroic or raid metas and got a mount but if you want to use it grind this faction to exalted first."
90 Night Elf Hunter
17910
10/30/2012 03:30 PMPosted by Rygarius
Some account-wide mounts have restrictions based on profession, faction, or class. In this instance, cloud serpents have a factional requirement.


This is the first time I have ever seen a blue response that actually ignored the OP :( how disheartening.

I don't understand why we need cloud serpent riding on each separate character if we already have the mount. It's one thing working to get the flying to ride the mounts in the first place, that's fine and all, but why is this not an account wide thing?

I mean, this kind of screws the people who worked hard on Glory of the Pandaria Raider AND getting exalted with the faction. The mount itself is account wide, but you can't ride it unless you have the flying? That doesn't really make sense.


Not once did the OP imply that he did not understand that the mount was a factional requirement. He very specifically asked WHY the mount has that requirement in the first place. He pointed out that there are some rewards in the game (outside the reputation grind for the mounts) that we cannot even USE without first grinding what is supposed to be an optional faction. This is the first time in the history of the game that a meta achievement reward had such a requirement.

A few years ago I paid a sum of gold to purchase faster flying so that I could ride the Bronze Drake that was sitting in my bank. That is the most similar requirement that I can think of...but again, it is a one time, non daily thing.

Either way, the OP expressed full understanding of the fact that the mount has a factional requirement. He is attempting to understand a decision made by the developers, he is not arguing with it. The post was polite, straightforward, and concise. How sad to see such a condescending blue post in response to a reasonable question.
90 Undead Warrior
11040
I think the blue responded like that because they have no way to defend it but to say "look we need to make you grind more to make this content seem longer". Problem is they aren't fooling anyone. another problem is that they probably wont lose a lot of subscriptions because of this so they will have no incentive to change it.
90 Night Elf Druid
13785

The process by which exclusion is achieved, through attainment of Order of Cloud Serpent Dailies (which itself can only be gained through another gated, dailies system), is honestly pretty lazy.

Lazy... as opposed to... what? Grinding reputation via tabard buffed dungeon runs? Defeating a fixed number of dungeon/raid bosses? Acquiring a tremendous number of high end, hard to find, difficult to farm/craft items to repeatedly turn in over and over?

Reputation gains have never been particularly stunning feats of design in terms of complexity.


There's no point in stymying a player's selection of what mount to use in this manner. The hard part of any of the raid/dungeon achievement mount, or the rare mount, is actually getting it in the first place. Adding another restriction on top of that, a restriction that's entirely based on an easily-attainable, but utterly pointless, achievement does very little to advance Blizzard's reasoning for implementing account-wide mounts and achievements.

Easily obtainable doesn't do your argument any credit. It is like talking about how difficult it is to achieve a perfect score on an AP test while also talking about the pointless restriction of getting into an AP course (which merely requires talking to the teacher and filling out a form).

Also, there is a point to it. Exclusivity still factors in and the only way to maintain a system that allows antiquated mounts to be usable by all across all characters but make new and exciting mounts actually somewhat rare is by adding in these restrictions. The big meta achievements ARE indeed noteworthy... hence why some random Outlands alt shouldn't be roaming around on it.


If you're going to allow players account-wide mounts, and players will understandably want to show off the newest (and impliedly more rare) mounts, why implement such a restriction? To give players something to do on their alts? I honestly don't the reasoning behind the "exclusion" process, since it is so easy, but annoying, to get, and is not indicative of any real skill.

Things aren't all or nothing and never will be. That is what isn't understood by most of the posters. Furthermore, if it takes no skill and its just annoying is still not compelling. If its just annoying to you, then it really isn't much of a restriction and we're just talking about antsy stuff (to which I already said: stop whining).


Hypothesizing what would have happened during WotLK and Invincible is dumb, since there's no way to know what would have been had account-wide mounts been in place at that time. Ditto with "well, they might allow account-wide Cloud Serpent riding in the future." Instead of arguing what could have happened, or what may happen, focus on what is happening.

LOL

The comparisons to past mounts are perfectly relevant in that you had to actually acquire the mounts a second time. What's happening now is... they're making some mounts exclusive like they have in the past.
90 Blood Elf Paladin
8075
10/30/2012 07:38 PMPosted by Fasc
What's happening now is... they're making some mounts exclusive like they have in the past.


Which flies in the face of the philosophy Blizzard put out about making mounts account bound in the first place.

I'm fine with their decision to exclude Arena mounts from the account-wide system because the reasons they stated made sense. I'm fine with some mounts requiring flying in order to use at all because up until now said flying skills weren't gated behind a faction rep requirement. Cloud Serpent Riding is gated and for a reason that's completely contradictory to the entire point of the account-bound mount system.
Edited by Hallower on 10/30/2012 7:48 PM PDT
90 Human Paladin
10930
Mists of Pandailies
90 Night Elf Druid
13785
10/30/2012 07:47 PMPosted by Hallower
Which flies in the face of the philosophy Blizzard put out about making mounts account bound in the first place.


Incorrect.
90 Night Elf Hunter
6525
10/30/2012 03:08 PMPosted by Dippindotss
I don't understand why we need cloud serpent riding on each separate character if we already have the mount.


Because its kind of one of the whole points of rep raising in Mop. Its their ONLY thing, unlike the other people who maybe have a couple of mounts but you mainly raise them for other stuff.

With cloud serpent faction, its JUST the mounts; That is what makes it special.
90 Blood Elf Paladin
8075
Which flies in the face of the philosophy Blizzard put out about making mounts account bound in the first place.


Incorrect.


Fantastic rebuttal.

Since you're claiming my statement is incorrect, perhaps you can provide something besides your own opinion that will back up your claim?
Edited by Hallower on 10/30/2012 8:04 PM PDT
90 Night Elf Druid
13785
Fantastic rebuttal.

Since you're claiming my statement is incorrect, perhaps you can provide something besides your own opinion that will back up your claim?


By all means quote the philosophy that Blizzard states that disallows them to create mounts that are exclusive in any way, shape, or form and I'll happily change my stance.

Thing is, exclusivity of items will always be a thing. Mounts are one of those rarities and the discourse back and forth about PvP mounts should have been indicative enough that the line between acceptably exclusive and not is not only subjective but contingent upon Blizzard themselves.

They obviously chose that Cloud Serpents in general are to be somewhat exclusive and that mounts like Alani are even more so.

So... you are incorrect.

Most of this is already stated in the thread though, you should read more next time.
90 Night Elf Druid
13785
10/30/2012 08:13 PMPosted by Sealan
The difference is they don't have a special "skill" to use like the poorly designed serpents.


Necessary prerequisites are poor designs... interesting. Tell me more how you would design the cloud serpent to be better and why it improves without taking away anything significantly...

/wonka-face
90 Human Warrior
5915
10/30/2012 08:16 PMPosted by Sealan
I think the blue responded like that because they have no way to defend it but to say "look we need to make you grind more to make this content seem longer".


+10


Why do they have to justify absolutely everything? seriously, can any of you come up with a reasonable answer?
90 Pandaren Monk
13715
10/30/2012 03:30 PMPosted by Rygarius
Some account-wide mounts have restrictions based on profession, faction, or class. In this instance, cloud serpents have a factional requirement.
Buttttt, do the Neatherwing Drakes have a required faction to ride them?

Nope.
1 Tauren Warrior
0
Well, it's clear that most of us agree that it's dumb to grind all those dailies for all your toons if you wanna ride the damn mount.

In fact, this is just ONE thing, if you want, for example the bag recipe for your tailoring too, guess what? Sigh.......
90 Troll Death Knight
12865
Necessary prerequisites are poor designs... interesting. Tell me more how you would design the cloud serpent to be better and why it improves without taking away anything significantly...

/wonka-face

Personally, I think it's rather silly to require an entirely new skill to ride one in the first place. I am in no way saying there shouldn't be some form of gate or time sink, but that it's classified as a riding skill just seems rather arbitrary. Also, for my alts' whom I've no interest in riding a cloud serpent on, it will always be an annoying empty space in the spellbook.

Additionally, if we're going to continue calling back to WotLK or Cata designs, there really aren't any comparisons to how this whole cloud serpent thing works. The reputation grind itself is very much similar to netherwing, but then we have the riding skill. We also have achievements that reward cloud serpents; mounts that we can't ride without the reputation. In WotLK, if you were rewarded a meta protodrake, you could ride the thing. Not only that, but you got a boost to your mount speed as well. The closest comparison that can be made is that it combines dark phoenix/guild rep and netherwings, and I think that's rather clunky in design.

I would rather the mount/riding skill be made accountwide, but have the grind itself be nerfed. I don't have a problem whatsoever with the work involved, and I wouldn't have even the slightest problem in putting forth even more work. And I don't think I'm alone in that. I'm not looking for handouts. I just think this restriction flies in the face of what Blizz publicly announced as one of its goals for MoP and future design, and that Blizz is willing to let design and intention fall to the wayside merely for the sake of a time sink seems cheap. It's just a cheap ploy, and I expect better from Blizz.
Edited by Jubba on 10/30/2012 8:36 PM PDT
90 Human Paladin
5495
10/30/2012 03:30 PMPosted by Rygarius
Some account-wide mounts have restrictions based on profession, faction, or class. In this instance, cloud serpents have a factional requirement.

this is a bit weird, because I can ride my netherdrake on characters that never did the Netherwing rep.
90 Human Warrior
7855
10/30/2012 03:30 PMPosted by Rygarius
Some account-wide mounts have restrictions based on profession, faction, or class. In this instance, cloud serpents have a factional requirement.


Then Faction Reputation needs to become account wide.
90 Troll Death Knight
12865
10/30/2012 08:24 PMPosted by Baneusprime
Why do they have to justify absolutely everything? seriously, can any of you come up with a reasonable answer?

They don't, and the people asking for a straight answer aren't actually looking for a straight answer. The answer is painfully obvious, that it's a restriction for the sake of a time sink for time sink's sake and nothing more.

People are antagonizing the blues because they already know the real answer, and they also know the blues can't give it.
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