Forcing players to AFK until they are geared



Those 'bots' are not real bots. They are basically a macro that auto targets the nearest friendly player and auto follows them, powered by an auto clicking program. Both are impossible to detect by Warden, but completely obvious to any non-afk player.


You're missing my point. Why doesn't Blizzard just turn off the ability to /follow in BGs? If the AFKers are exploiting via the ability to /follow, then turn off /follow in BGs. Is that really all that needs to happen?


Why should Blizzard remove a feature from the game just because all of 3 people are abusing it? Why don't you instead use the report feature to let Blizzard know about those individuals, so they can investigate them and ban them?
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90 Undead Warlock
8580
11/09/2012 01:29 PMPosted by Daxxarri
Edit: Somewhat off-topic, I'm already regretting glibly using the term 'speed bump'. It's much more than that - getting in the face of the enemy, playing smart, using interrupts, and generally being a nuisance can actually have a significant effect on a battle, even if the player falls in the process.


While I was still building up 90 PVP gear my goal in PVP is very simple

Look at the enemy roster, Find someone that looks like a healer on the other side and never ever let him cast.

and assuming I'm right about that guy being a healer I hunt him down every time I rez and make his life miserable using every god damned CC I have in my little warlock bag of tricks.

When I found myself getting a half dozen people focus firing me to instant death, after casting just 1 CC spell on the poor bastard, near the end of the BG I knew I had done my job well.

Now I actually have some PVP gear so I spend most of my time setting people on fire. It's a little more satisfying and my survivability is much better (plus I actually come out of the BGs with some Killing Blows which is nice), but I still look back on those speed bump days and laugh.
Edited by Drakmor on 11/11/2012 12:51 AM PST
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90 Pandaren Monk
10990


You're missing my point. Why doesn't Blizzard just turn off the ability to /follow in BGs? If the AFKers are exploiting via the ability to /follow, then turn off /follow in BGs. Is that really all that needs to happen?


Why should Blizzard remove a feature from the game just because all of 3 people are abusing it? Why don't you instead use the report feature to let Blizzard know about those individuals, so they can investigate them and ban them?


Is it just 3 people? I'm hearing it's often 8 out of 10 people in a BG. Sounds like that would solve a lot of the problem.
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90 Blood Elf Priest
10990
11/09/2012 01:22 PMPosted by Daxxarri
And account at risk for AFKing? That made me laugh. Tell the other half of the team chillin out that as well cause its happening alot. Which ruins the game for the rest of us so yeah lets see some action on those afk bots. Not just words.


We are constantly working to ensure that PvP is fair and fun, and it this is an important issue to us.

It is a great help to us when players use the reporting tools that we've included in the game, though. It seems that use of the AFK reporting feature has dropped off considerably, which is unfortunate, because it really does play a direct and active role in our investigations. Ultimately, cynicism doesn't help us catch the offenders. And yes, I realize that bots will clear the AFK flag by getting into combat. Rest assured that the reports can still help.


You want us to report however the problem with the current system is that it takes way to long to get a result & even harder to use when there are not enough players that are actually playing to get rid of afk'ers/bots.

Players have given countless ideas over ways to help rid the game of them but they have gone ignored or simply overlooked. You keep saying that you study bots/afk'ers but when are you gonna learn that with every action you take there is an equal & opposite reaction from those players who choose to go afk/bot? If it is not working, admit it, move on & find something that does work.

I have asked lots of players if getting the honor/conquest points is the only reason they PVP & the responses are usually "Sometimes but usually I PVP to be with friends." or how bout "I PVP to relieve frustration." So, I believe that cutting out any reward for actually losing a BG will help rid the game of the afk'ers/bots do not aid in winning the BG. Offer more honor/conquest points for winning teams, a satchet with some gold & extra points to entice the player to win. Last time I checked those that afk/bot are only there to get honor/conquest. Why should the players that actually play help gear them?
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90 Night Elf Druid
10950
11/09/2012 01:22 PMPosted by Daxxarri
It is a great help to us when players use the reporting tools that we've included in the game, though. It seems that use of the AFK reporting feature has dropped off considerably, which is unfortunate, because it really does play a direct and active role in our investigations. Ultimately, cynicism doesn't help us catch the offenders. And yes, I realize that bots will clear the AFK flag by getting into combat. Rest assured that the reports can still help.
So ... the tool doesn't give immediate feedback to the player that they've accomplished something ("Hey I reported that player and now they're gone!") ... it's more of a 'well down the road we'll be able to prevent that player from maybe not doing that again' tool? To promote a positive feedback, that is to encourage people using the reporting tools, they have to have active results ... if a bot just clears it, than the reporters are discouraged from using it as it doesn't have an immediate effect. Consider, how often would a player run into the same AFKing bot? I would bet that it isn't that often ... so there's no feeling of reward for 'doing the right thing' because the target just fades into the ether as far as the reporter can see.

Please ... if the AFK report tool is to have any meaning, it needs to have immediate teeth.
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90 Worgen Mage
9785
i started pvping with full PvE gear without having the contenders starting pvp gear, and i kicked alot of as*, yes i died some but isnt that what pvp is about? no class is inviciable lol. stick with people and you will have a better fighting chance. no person is useless in battlegrounds if they got smarts
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90 Blood Elf Warrior
9495
The new PvP gear system is terrible, like I've been posting about since beta. It's just not good. In order to not be terrible you need full PvP gear. In order to get PvP gear you need to grind endless BG's before you can even do any damage to anybody when others have 60% PvP Resilience and like 30% Damage while you have 30% Resilience 0% attack. Removes all skill from it, if you have worse gear you lose unless you're class is a hard counter to what you're fighting. Always. Hands down. I don't care how good you are, take off your PvP gear and you'll get stomped by *anyone* who has gear.

Makes PvP terrible, and it's really just more incentive to AFK every game you play until you get gear. There's a lot of things people complain about in WoW, a lot of it is just opinion based, but this is factual. You *can't* compete with people who have PvP gear anymore like you used to be able to. Before you took more damage, and the enemy took less. Now you take more, the enemy takes less *AND* the enemy deals more and you deal less.

If both people have 300,000 health and do 10,000 per swing, with the old system you could be at roughly 40% damage reduction. So the player without PvP gear does 6,000 per swing and kills the opponent in 50 hits, while the geared player does 10,000 and kills in 30 hits. Now the player without gear has 30% reduction, while the player with gear has 60% reduction plus 30% damage. So instead of the player with no PvP gear hits for 4,000 and the player with PvP gear hits for 10,000 (Doesn't change, because they get +Damage but now the gearless player has base resilience). So now it still takes 30 hits for the PvP geared player, but it takes roughly 72 hits for the player with no gear.

The new system hurts new players with no gear, and makes it more frustrating to grind honor when it's already not that fun (this is subjective, but I'm sure a lot of players will agree the only reason to grind BG's is to do arenas or RBG's), one of the reasons I haven't bothered leveling an alt yet honestly.
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90 Human Mage
6810
11/09/2012 01:29 PMPosted by Daxxarri
Please tell me you're joking.


Not, I'm not joking, nor were the other players who suggested it as one of several options. It exists, and it can help plug gaps in gear while earning points for better gear. If the concern is walking into PvP and getting steamrolled until you can earn Honor or Conquest gear, it's still a step in the right direction.

Edit: Somewhat off-topic, I'm already regretting glibly using the term 'speed bump'. It's much more than that - getting in the face of the enemy, playing smart, using interrupts, and generally being a nuisance can actually have a significant effect on a battle, even if the player falls in the process.


Hey, I know you're trying to help and be constructive. I appreciate that. The issue though is that currently too much of a players dps comes from burst... no matter the class. this ends up leading to a stutation where new/undergeared players get blown up in a stun or cc. When your life expectancy is under 5 seconds( usually 5 seconds without control of your character), players get frustrated. You cannot out play someone if you die in a stun. Or a deepfreeze, or a chaosbolt, or a heroic strike... or too a stampede... this list of silly burst goes on. Anywho, when these players step into a bg and litereally get 3 shot, they say to themselves, "Well, I cannot possibly be helping this bg if I die without being able to hit the enemy more than once." They feel if they cannot help, well they can sure just afk until they are geared and try again. Its not really that there is such a gear gap between fresh 90's and full deadly 90's. The gap in gear is relative to previous expansions, I feel. No the issue, is the gap in burst damage. For whatever reason, the dev teams have given almost every class a way to knock out 200k+ dmg in about 3 seconds. this is around 2/3's of a new 90's life. In previous expansions, I could pop cooldowns and maybe do about half of that in the same window. Which means comparatively, our health pools are half what they need to be. Also, in pvp, healing is about 20% too much at the moment. This is less of a problem right now when dps can kill a player before a healer can react, but if we ever dig ourselves out of this hole, healing will also need to be adjusted in pvp. I suggest a 10% healing reduction in bg's and arenas (conservative) and either a 15% bump in default resilience (55% damage reduction before resilience) or a much more troublesome doubling of life from stamina. The resilience would help by not affecting pve while fixing pvp for the forseable future (resilience scaling may need to be adjusted as nearing 90% would be bad), but the increasing of life pools would probably be a better fix for pvp, but would cause you to need to inflate boss damage in pve to compensate. It is what it is... messy. But it's broken. It's borken and everyone knows it. Your bot problem is the symptom of the cause.
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90 Worgen Hunter
9675
This is what TB is for. If you aren't having fun in a match involving other players, you don't afk. That's called being a douchebag, as it affects the enjoyment of nine other people. You just don't do it.
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30 Orc Shaman
8195
blue post: "well at least you can be a target dummy trololol"

10/10
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18 Dwarf Hunter
0
btw blue go check out the rampant mmr cheat in http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/7004046156

if you guys are truly " constantly working to ensure that PvP is fair and fun..."
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90 Pandaren Monk
10990
11/11/2012 07:16 PMPosted by Alitari
It is a great help to us when players use the reporting tools that we've included in the game, though. It seems that use of the AFK reporting feature has dropped off considerably, which is unfortunate, because it really does play a direct and active role in our investigations. Ultimately, cynicism doesn't help us catch the offenders. And yes, I realize that bots will clear the AFK flag by getting into combat. Rest assured that the reports can still help.
So ... the tool doesn't give immediate feedback to the player that they've accomplished something ("Hey I reported that player and now they're gone!") ... it's more of a 'well down the road we'll be able to prevent that player from maybe not doing that again' tool? To promote a positive feedback, that is to encourage people using the reporting tools, they have to have active results ... if a bot just clears it, than the reporters are discouraged from using it as it doesn't have an immediate effect. Consider, how often would a player run into the same AFKing bot? I would bet that it isn't that often ... so there's no feeling of reward for 'doing the right thing' because the target just fades into the ether as far as the reporter can see.

Please ... if the AFK report tool is to have any meaning, it needs to have immediate teeth.


That sounds like a good idea to me.

In fact, I think I said the same thing, earlier. :)
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90 Blood Elf Death Knight
5170
11/09/2012 12:34 PMPosted by Daxxarri
Getting beat down in a few hits is never fun in PVP. Dont let me hear "But I try anyways" because that is just crap. What's fun about trying when you die in a few hits anyways? REMOVE HONOR CAP BEFORE WE REACH MAX LEVEL ALREADY!


There is crafted PvP gear that can help players get off on the right foot. Actually participating in a Battleground increases your team's likelihood of winning (even under-geared players can CC, heal, or even just act as speed bumps - if you genuinely believe that you can't help in other ways, damage you are taking is still damage a team mate isn't taking). By participating, a player can accrue honorable kills, which nets more Honor. Under-geared players can also make a point of sticking with larger groups - there is safety in numbers, and getting lost in the crowd can help you stay alive long enough to make a difference.

There's a handy little guide on things you can do to give yourself an edge over on [url="http://www.arenajunkies.com/news/539-mists-of-pandaria-level-90-pvp-preparation/"]Arena Junkies[/url].

Facing the challenges involved with PvPing versus more well geared players is something that nearly all players face in Battlegrounds. There is never call to violate the terms of service and put your account (and any gear you've acquired by exploiting) at risk by AFKing in Battlegrounds.
well, i'm gonna hate sayin this... but we all know in a season or two, or even this season as people get the malevolent weapons.. people in crafted gear arnt gonna have a chance. so this makes me wonder if regular bg que's can attempt to group people based on itemlevel. not something esclusive, but enough to attempt to keep well geared players with other well geared players. as to keep it competitive and not as one sided. might help keep people grouped by season in the end if its set up by the item level of seasonal tiers
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90 Blood Elf Warrior
8845
11/12/2012 02:36 PMPosted by Sunless


There is crafted PvP gear that can help players get off on the right foot. Actually participating in a Battleground increases your team's likelihood of winning (even under-geared players can CC, heal, or even just act as speed bumps - if you genuinely believe that you can't help in other ways, damage you are taking is still damage a team mate isn't taking). By participating, a player can accrue honorable kills, which nets more Honor. Under-geared players can also make a point of sticking with larger groups - there is safety in numbers, and getting lost in the crowd can help you stay alive long enough to make a difference.

There's a handy little guide on things you can do to give yourself an edge over on [url="http://www.arenajunkies.com/news/539-mists-of-pandaria-level-90-pvp-preparation/"]Arena Junkies[/url].

Facing the challenges involved with PvPing versus more well geared players is something that nearly all players face in Battlegrounds. There is never call to violate the terms of service and put your account (and any gear you've acquired by exploiting) at risk by AFKing in Battlegrounds.
well, i'm gonna hate sayin this... but we all know in a season or two, or even this season as people get the malevolent weapons.. people in crafted gear arnt gonna have a chance. so this makes me wonder if regular bg que's can attempt to group people based on itemlevel. not something esclusive, but enough to attempt to keep well geared players with other well geared players. as to keep it competitive and not as one sided. might help keep people grouped by season in the end if its set up by the item level of seasonal tiers


crafted gear will update like in cata...
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90 Blood Elf Death Knight
5170


crafted gear will update like in cata...


Patch 4.2 - New Crafted PvP Gear
Blizzard already announced that there will be a new tier of crafted PvP gear with every new major content patch. It appears that instead of the new recipes, all of the crafted PVP gear will be getting upgraded when patch 4.2 goes live.

All existing recipes will be called "Bloodthirsty" instead of "Bloodied", the Tailoring crafted items don't have a prefix name currently, but now all of them will be called "Bloodthirsty" as well. This gear will have an item level of 358 instead of 339. There will be a new set bonus, 400 resilience rating.

This means you don't have to buy any new recipes, all of your recipes will be upgraded to the new version when patch 4.2 comes out.

However, existing gear made with the older version of the recipes will not be upgraded. Do not stockpile the crafted gear, it won't be upgraded.

These new crafted PvP items use the same materials as the old ones.

There are also new necks, rings, relics and cloaks. All of these new items are item level 358 PvP items.


my bad :P came back in late cata. was going based off wotlk.
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