Locks WOW!!!

I should have leveled my lock first... pvp wise they are so nicely OP and I say this cause for so long (too long) Blizz has focused on other classes leaving locks to be great dps in pve or in a setting where they have a healer. These days, locks stand on their own 2 feet no healer required or desired, please ffs Blizz leave them be, just for a little while
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90 Undead Warlock
7545
Locks are not OP in pvp. Not even close.
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90 Human Paladin
8560
11/14/2012 01:19 AMPosted by Malagon
Locks are not OP in pvp. Not even close.


Your spec............ is,, I dont even know what you are trying to do there?? Do you run flags in WSG or somthing.

Spec correctly and that Demo spec can 2 shot players.
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90 Night Elf Druid
7565
11/14/2012 03:33 AMPosted by Cezar
Locks are not OP in pvp. Not even close.


Your spec............ is,, I dont even know what you are trying to do there?? Do you run flags in WSG or somthing.

Spec correctly and that Demo spec can 2 shot players.


If you get two Chaos Wave crits in a row.

Good luck!
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90 Goblin Warlock
0
11/14/2012 03:33 AMPosted by Cezar
Locks are not OP in pvp. Not even close.


Your spec............ is,, I dont even know what you are trying to do there?? Do you run flags in WSG or somthing.

Spec correctly and that Demo spec can 2 shot players.


Demo has to pop every cd to hurt and then be stuck much like a certain other spec but worse.... I wonder what spec it sounds like.... it's so close to the tip of my tongue...

Off topic, some sort of win trading has to be occuring or idk what, but I'm seeing teams with 2700 PR with a 30% win rate which sounds fishy to me. Never really payed attention to the ins and outs of gaming the system there.
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90 Undead Warlock
7545
11/14/2012 03:33 AMPosted by Cezar
Locks are not OP in pvp. Not even close.


Your spec............ is,, I dont even know what you are trying to do there?? Do you run flags in WSG or somthing.

Spec correctly and that Demo spec can 2 shot players.


I'm PVE specced? Derp.
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90 Human Warlock
17825
Your spec............ is,, I dont even know what you are trying to do there?? Do you run flags in WSG or somthing.

Spec correctly and that Demo spec can 2 shot players.

Are you F'ing serious? You realize this is MOP right? We not playing in cata or previous?

You realize there is no talents that grant signifcant damage boosts over other talents? I'm at a loss as to what talent change you think he should make that will suddenly make him 2 shot people if he cannot do it with his current spec since only one tier (grimoire) has anything to do with raw damage output, and the grimoire talents are all balanced to provide almost identical dps.

If anything, its PVP survivability his spec is unsuited for (no dark bargain, HOL > Dark Regen), his offesnive ability has almost nothing to do with talent choices.
Edited by Thanatosia on 11/14/2012 1:33 PM PST
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90 Worgen Warlock
7200
LOL.

Yeah. We are so OP in PvP. Thats why we are dominating the charts.

Oh wait...

http://www.crossladder.com/arena/stats/
All Brackets:
Warrior 9252 (17%)
Paladin 7878 (15%)
Druid 6656 (13%)
Shaman 5726 (11%)
Mage 5114 (10%)
Hunter 5032 (9%)
Priest 4577 (9%)
DK 3266 (6%)
Warlock 2937 (6%)
Rogue 1391 (3%)
Monk 1294 (2%)
Its average outside of those.

Hint: Demo is a duel hero spec. Something tells me your perspective comes from being one of the only 2 classes that has it worst...

EDIT: dont get me wrong, we are currently amazing for PvE (both in terms of power AND design), but PvPwise we are hurting bad in the current environment.
Edited by Stonedsoul on 11/14/2012 5:38 PM PST
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11/14/2012 05:33 PMPosted by Stonedsoul
but PvPwise we are hurting bad in the current environment.

You know, for so long everybody always said "Representation means nothing".
Now it does, I guess.

Locks are pretty dang good.
I'm not just saying that because I'm a WW either.
-20% physical is AMAZING, you can work with your team to get Dark Souls off, you can do plenty.

They're basically up there with the other, privileged classes. :3

I don't know why, despite locks never having a truly bad season in this game, they're convinced that they're weak, and hold that opinion at pretty much any point in time.
Edited by Draggy on 11/14/2012 5:42 PM PST
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1 Undead Priest
0
[
Edited by Sunnyc on 1/8/2013 2:23 AM PST
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90 Undead Warlock
6970
What I've seen in pve, locks are more or less middle of the road on the charts. I'm not talking about that one heroic raid geared out guy in some min-max guild, I'm talking about the typical recount rankings in LFR.

In pvp, I have no idea. I don't see anyone crying about locks, so at the very least they are NOT OP. I've heard the tears over BM hunters though, and Blizzard has more or less heard the crying and is going the nerf them.

In pvp, it's real simple. Just read to see what class and spec everyone is crying over - and roll that. Prepare to do that every 3-4 months. I don't do wow pvp anymore.
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90 Draenei Shaman
17085
Honestly, I think Locks are low because of where Hunters and Warriors are at currently in PVP.

The nerf to Gag Order is a huge benefit to Locks. It'll stop Wars from Roflstomping your faces. Next stop is getting Hunter Burst knocked down to survivable levels for clothies lawl.

Both Demo and Destro are strong in PVP.
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90 Human Priest
6925
Demo is fine. The aura is just broken though. Thank god they are gonna fix it.
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90 Worgen Warlock
7200
but PvPwise we are hurting bad in the current environment.

You know, for so long everybody always said "Representation means nothing".
Now it does, I guess.

Locks are pretty dang good.
I'm not just saying that because I'm a WW either.
-20% physical is AMAZING, you can work with your team to get Dark Souls off, you can do plenty.

They're basically up there with the other, privileged classes. :3

I don't know why, despite locks never having a truly bad season in this game, they're convinced that they're weak, and hold that opinion at pretty much any point in time.

Or may it be that you are the one who's perception is skewed? Ever thought of that? Because you are essentially saying that your empirical anecdotes trumps numerical and factual evidence.

In the end, warlock spent last expention being fear-bots in 3s and useless outside that braket. This time we are great for duel and pug BGs, but terrible in ranked PvP.

Demo is fine. The aura is just broken though. Thank god they are gonna fix it.

Yeah, that 5% magic damage taken debuff is just so completely OP man! Its what is currently breaking PvP!

Seriously? I mean... REALLY?!?

P.S. and no you dont want to use that other aura. Thats the one you cast as a curse, because it stays on healers who get out of range.
Edited by Stonedsoul on 11/15/2012 7:57 PM PST
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90 Undead Warlock
9600
11/14/2012 03:33 AMPosted by Cezar
Locks are not OP in pvp. Not even close.


Your spec............ is,, I dont even know what you are trying to do there?? Do you run flags in WSG or somthing.

Spec correctly and that Demo spec can 2 shot players.

And as expected Cezar arrives spouting chaos wave nonsense.

I did some tests after seeing you complain in another thread.
I have >60% pvp power.
My friend I was experimenting on had ~55% resilience.

I would build up fury, use my trinket, use dark soul, sacrifice my demon (I would never normally do this, but I'm trying to get this CW to hit as hard as possible) then enter meta and hit her with two chaos waves.
Each would consistently hit her for about 78k.
I gave up on trying to get a crit after doing this 4 times (surprising isn't it? Because I know you think CW crits like 99% of the time) but going off that base damage it should never crit for more than 160k.
While receiving two of those crits in a row would still be devastating, and something should probably be done to stop it from critting twice in a certain period of time, it is very unlikely to occur, and is not as game breaking as you chalk it up to be.
I'd be surprised if it has ever even happened to you. I don't think I've ever seen it happen and I'm the one constantly trying to do it to people.

The fact that your desire to nerf demonology has become the strongest motivating influence in your life is somewhat ridiculous.
Demonology is maybe overpowered based on a 1% chance, yet there are a number of other classes doing just as much damage in a short period of time, that are capable of doing so consistently that you completely ignore.
/shrug
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90 Pandaren Priest
5640
You really can't look at representation numbers and think that it means anything, without also looking at the number of people actively playing a class in genearl.

I'm willing to bet that Warlocks are also still one of the least played classes period, not just in PvP.

Second, you do have to admit that Warlocks are super strong. Considering that the team that won the championship this weekend was using a warlock makes that pretty obvious.

I don't know how he was doing it either, but his CW was hitting like a truck, it wasn't two shotting people, but pretty much all their kills came from him getting two off, with one critting, and the damage was absurd.

I'm not saying that they need a nerf, or don't need a nerf, but we need to be realistic. The real thing is that Warlocks take SKILL to play, just like Rogues did last season (until the legendaries came along). That is why you see such a difference in them in Arenas. Because most of them probably suck, or are just PvE players. It takes a lot of skill to manage all of the aspects of Demo in a PvE environment when you can plan everything out to the T. Now do it in PvP and tell me it's easy. It's not as simple as "pop CD's and win" like it is for a Warrior or a Hunter.

Again, not saying that they need, or don't need, a nerf just saying that when you talk about these sorts of things, the big picture needs to be considered.
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90 Worgen Warlock
18570
Empirical stats say locks are below average with most of the ranking sites putting us about 2nd to last in terms of representation in pvp. You can argue minor semantics of each sites methodology but they all say basically the same thing and its hard to confuse approx 2nd lowest with "OP".

PVE locks are midpack most fights...with 1-2 fights where we do well. Sort through raidbots, WoL, etc at different percentiles (95, 90, 85, 80, etc) and see where locks stack up. Its not at the top nor is it at the bottom. We have some fights we are good at and some we arent' (or others are far better).

We spent much of the last two expansions basically sucking in terms of pve tuning so this may "feel" like locks are powerful. We've basically had to outplay everyone else for a couple years. Perhaps sucking is a strong term but "our mechanics vs encounter mechanics made a very unfavorable choice compared to xyz". Wotlk it was legendary warriors and mages, DS it was legendary rogues and mages....see a trend yet? 2x expansions as the obligatory "buff bot" for the real caster dps now has a more balanced damage contribution than simply fluffing other classes numbers.

Demo can hit hard once every 2 mins (which is what many specs suffer) with a "kitchen sink" macro that basically pops everything. Chaoswave can hit hard but has about a 10% (13% crit chance is possible if you forge crit but then you lost a ton of base damage) so you just don't see double crits since with a mastery reforge (what you need to hit hard) its roughly a 1:100 chance to double crit chaoswave. The ONLY way CW hits really hard is sac'ing the pet which since demo is a pet spec, can leave it a bit gimp. Demo also has to wait till a good 30-60 sec into a match to have enough DF to be dangerous. Most anyone else can have their secondary resources ready nearly off the rip. That leaves the spec at the mercy of just about everyone else till a good while into the match...since most matches now are burst/zergfests you have quite a nice grace period to know demo isn't possible of fighting back just yet.

If you are losing to destro you are just flat out terrible. There probably isn't an easier to counter spec out there. Stop CB during the all cd's macro and you win. The rest of the time it doesn't matter. Destro also kinda sucks in pve once you get out of 5 mans.

Not sure why you feel locks qualify for "wow" status other than you probably haven't played the classes that sit atop the FOTM throne. BTW, how can a monk not be happy with how they heal right now?
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90 Pandaren Priest
6185
11/19/2012 08:12 AMPosted by Werst
PVE locks are midpack most fights...with 1-2 fights where we do well. Sort through raidbots, WoL, etc at different percentiles (95, 90, 85, 80, etc) and see where locks stack up. Its not at the top nor is it at the bottom. We have some fights we are good at and some we arent' (or others are far better).


This is absolute nonsense. In a 10 man setting, affliction is top 3 for both top 100 parses and parses overall for Heroics. In Heart of Fear, Demo is in the top 3 for Vizier. Affliction plummets to number 4 on Blade Lord. Demo is top 3 for windlord. Those are the only Heroic fights in HoF that raid bots can access right now due to logging issues at WoL. Let's look at Heroic MV, since there are more data points.

10 man Heroic Stone Guard

Top 100- Aff #4
All parses- Demo #3

Feng

Top 100- Aff#5
All parses- Aff 10, demo 12

Garajal (which is a tough fight to read)

Top 100- Aff #2
All parses- Aff #2

Spirit Kings

Top 100- Aff#2
All- Aff #3

Elegon

Top 100- Aff #1
All parses- Aff #1

Will

Top 100- Aff #1
All- Aff #2

Midpack MOST fights, you say? Get real, dude.
Edited by Dictainabox on 11/19/2012 9:52 AM PST
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