Where did Tyrande need Mal's help?

49 Human Warlock
340
yeah i have seen your intrepretation of novels and you telling me your accurate doesn't do squat to change that. so he made a mistake it's called being flawed hardly makes him uncaring especually when he didn;t know ysera would of been fine with him leaving. and jarood is infailable now huh?


It's also the Alliance getting pissed off at the Night Elf druids for not helping other Night Elves. And the fact he turned down immortality.. And the fact that he was going to leave his wife's daughter to die. And a few other facts that back up that statement.

So yeah, between nature and his people, he cares more about nature. So he shouldn't be leading his people, because he doesn't have their best interests at heart.

And you saying my interpretation of novels are not credible don't make that so either, so have fun with that?

I'll be over here though, in the group that pretty much accepts Malfurion is a douchebag who really shouldnt have crap to do with the playable Night Elves and you can be over there, on the other side of the fence, and we can at least act like we are friendly neighbors..

People do it all around the world, all the time.. Just, don't keep my mail.

weither malfurion is their leader or not he doesn't speak for everyone their are jerks in every group. he was going to leave some one for dead, who was almost 100% chance already dead. Who was in fact dead becuase it was reckless to drop everything and he changed his mind rather easily. the horror what a bad person for caring more about the gareenteed help he could do in the capital/surronding land then a place miles away for a person most likely dead.

Immortality wasn't doing the night elves any favors your holding up living for ever as if it were something great in and of it's self it isn;t and not every one is going to think so.

again caring about nature in azeroth tends to kill less people then not caring about it though as you say there are exceptions ones that malfurion has stayed away from.

i said i wouldn't give your interpretation of the novel any credience not that other people couldn't have a different veiw.
Edited by Listinna on 12/5/2012 5:43 PM PST
Reply Quote
42 Draenei Mage
550
Immortality wasn't doing the night elves any favors your holding up living for ever as if it were something great in and of it's self it isn;t and not ever one is going to think so.


So because 'not every one is going to think so' that gives him the right to strip it away on a whim?

I'm sorry, I really can't fathom how you can see this guy as anything other than a monster.

again caring about nature in azeroth tends to kill less people then not caring about it though as you say there are exceptions ones that malfurion has stayed away from.

That's sort of completely outside the point though.
Reply Quote
90 Blood Elf Death Knight
7185
As a side note, how cool would it be if when Tyrande gets killed in Horde raids Malfurion holds a funeral service for her until she respawns?
Reply Quote
89 Undead Warlock
5785
12/05/2012 03:49 AMPosted by Royceweiss
As a side note, how cool would it be if when Tyrande gets killed in Horde raids Malfurion holds a funeral service for her until she respawns?


I would prefer it if Malfurion defends Tyrande.
Reply Quote
90 Night Elf Rogue
8210
12/04/2012 04:55 PMPosted by Royceweiss
Makes perfect sense to me. I could have sworn that I said some thing about going through Ashenvale undercover? Ah well. They could have also flew in discreetly. There are many possibilities. Use your imagination.


I know I'm late on this, but I'm going to respond to it anyway.

They wouldn't have just had to go through Ashenvale undercover, they would have had to have done it with a large army, through Ashenvale, Felwood, and Winterspring. As for what they -could- have done, we're not in the business of speculation. I could see that with the twilight dragons, but not with all of the assets that they brought into the fight.

That leads us again to the Firelands being used to move stuff in, which doesn't appear to be limited. Again I'm left with the question as to why they couldn't just dump spires surrounded by lava in major cities whenever they felt like if they could just do it in Hyjal.

This and the return of Molten Core bosses just shows the sloppiness of the whole affair, which leads me back to my central point that we can't blame Malfurion for Hyjal. He's just being used in this case as Blizzard's way of keeping the Cenarion Circle out of the war. That's also where these "petty" discussions end, because we still have Blizzard to thank for creating this side-show in the first place so that they could avoid saying more about Ashenvale.

It gets a tad worse when we introduce the world character thing into this though. Blizzard has this habit with such characters where they make them wise to the point beyond reproach, and then use that character's bully pulpit to ram down an unsupported argument, usually employing either a sidekick who is shown the error of their ways (Tyrande, Tychus), or by employing a villain who is evil because the main character disagrees with them (Leyara, Maiev).
Reply Quote
90 Blood Elf Death Knight
7185
You have even said it yourself that the Cenarion Circle is a neutral faction. Their priority has never been the ongoing conflict between the Alliance and the Horde.

Cataclysm, Wrath, and the Burning Crusade expansions weren't even about the war between both factions.

Burning Crusade was about the Dark Portal opening and heroes going inside to combat the potential invasion of Azeroth from the Burning Legion.

Wrath was obviously about the Lich King.

Cataclysm was about the reemergence of Deathwing and the Twilight Cult which had been largely inactive since Ulduar.

Mists of Pandaria is the expansion that is supposed to address some of these issues between the Alliance and Horde. If any of the past expansions were about the continuing war between both factions I don't think they would have put so much emphasis on all of the final bosses of those expansions at the time. Heck, the box art for Cataclysm had a picture of a big flaming dragon on it. Not a bunch of elves holding hands around a great redwood.

Though I can agree with your last statement Blizzard does tend to put some of their characters on a pedestal. Though like I said before, nothing is set in stone and they can't possibly address every issue at once.

I'm glad you share the same passion for this game and it's world as I do Kyalin. It's going to be sad seeing you go.
Reply Quote
90 Night Elf Rogue
8210
I'm glad you share the same passion for this game and it's world as I do Kyalin. It's going to be sad seeing you go.


Well, by May I expect to be in public accounting anyway, so it may be for the best. Even I don't say this with finality though. I'm hoping that Blizzard can turn their ship around here before I migrate completely to their competitors.

Heck, the box art for Cataclysm had a picture of a big flaming dragon on it. Not a bunch of elves holding hands around a great redwood.


Elves, Tauren, Worgen, and Trolls, right? Of course, this is what annoys me about Hyjal. Yes, the Cenarion Circle is, and was forced to remain neutral, but they had to do so in order to fight a rather implausible conflict so that they could be given the excuse of ignoring Ashenvale. Now I'm not saying that Tauren and Trolls should suddenly turn on the Horde, that wouldn't make sense, but it makes even less sense for Night Elf druids to not care when there's a warlord to the south who is trying to exterminate them.

But, if we are going to press forward with Hyjal, I still have issues. Ashenvale isn't even considered to be an issue. We can't even get a side conversation to acknowledge that the Night Elven druids know about and are not happy about what's going on to the south, even as they continue to fight for the world's survival.

Leyara could have used a bit more sympathy as well. Instead of Malfurion writing her off at the end as not having listened to reason, we could have ended with a conversation between Malfurion and Hamuul where Hamuul makes a comment like that, and Malfurion gently reminds him that Hellscream's war has made victims out of many people, it is inevitable that some would turn to such desperation. This doesn't require that Malfurion leaves Hyjal or kicks the Tauren and the Trolls out of the circle and down the mountainside, it simply means that he shows at least some sympathy for or understanding of his people. We should expect it, given that he co-leads them.
Edited by Kyalin on 12/5/2012 6:11 AM PST
Reply Quote
90 Blood Elf Death Knight
7185
No. Just Elves. Your main concern seems to be the apparent neglect to your race that you feel.
Reply Quote
90 Night Elf Rogue
8210
12/05/2012 06:22 AMPosted by Royceweiss
No. Just Elves. Your main concern seems to be the apparent neglect to your race that you feel.


Not neglect, abuse. As I've brought up before, the problem isn't that we have too little lore, it's that we have too much lore and it's all terrible.

To be quite honest, I envy the position of the Draenei, even as I think they should be more involved in the Western Alliance. They don't have to deal with being a constant cheap plot device every time Metzen wants to make an individual or group look better. They don't have to deal with having their original presentation butchered. They're not made fun of on a daily basis, both by players and by characters in the story.

Getting lore isn't always a good thing. The strange case of the Night Elves demonstrates that vividly.
Edited by Kyalin on 12/5/2012 6:33 AM PST
Reply Quote
49 Human Warlock
340
Immortality wasn't doing the night elves any favors your holding up living for ever as if it were something great in and of it's self it isn;t and not ever one is going to think so.


So because 'not every one is going to think so' that gives him the right to strip it away on a whim?

I'm sorry, I really can't fathom how you can see this guy as anything other than a monster.

again caring about nature in azeroth tends to kill less people then not caring about it though as you say there are exceptions ones that malfurion has stayed away from.

That's sort of completely outside the point though.


he didn't strip it, the night elves didn't have it at the time, and if the dragons had really wanted to give it back to them they wouldn't have asked for malfurion advice. which was just that advice not a hard choice but a peprsonal feeling that immortality wasn;t good for his people. the dragons were free to say yeah we think you need it dude that they agreed with him doesn;t make malfurion a monster.
Reply Quote
90 Night Elf Warrior
0
he didn't strip it, the night elves didn't have it at the time, and if the dragons had really wanted to give it back to them they wouldn't have asked for malfurion advice. which was just that advice not a hard choice but a peprsonal feeling that immortality wasn;t good for his people. the dragons were free to say yeah we think you need it dude that they agreed with him doesn;t make malfurion a monster.


No they didn't have it but he turned down the chance at having it again. Also, although I could be wrong, didn't he say he never wants that brought up again. So even if it could become good for his people in his own flawed sense of morality the night elves wouldn't get it back.

The aspects aren't going to force immortality on anyone. Of course they asked for advice on what to do, they aren't going to go "you will have it and you will like it". That isn't their style. They listened to Malfurion's opinion which is not agreeing, it is respecting his decision. Did they ask the wrong person. Yes. Malfurion has only been awake in Azeroth when the whole world is going to burn do to someone or something's evil plot. He has seen the world and the night elves from a flawed perspective. Malfurion is a terrible character because he does not care about his people and deciding to make the decision for the night elves when he is a member of a neutral faction isn't fair. That is why he is a monster. It would be as if Jaina pre Tides of War was running around and making decisions for Stormwind and the humans. Biased perspective that does not represent the beliefs of her people.
Reply Quote
90 Blood Elf Death Knight
7185
12/05/2012 06:27 AMPosted by Kyalin
No. Just Elves. Your main concern seems to be the apparent neglect to your race that you feel.


Not neglect, abuse. As I've brought up before, the problem isn't that we have too little lore, it's that we have too much lore and it's all terrible.

To be quite honest, I envy the position of the Draenei, even as I think they should be more involved in the Western Alliance. They don't have to deal with being a constant cheap plot device every time Metzen wants to make an individual or group look better. They don't have to deal with having their original presentation butchered. They're not made fun of on a daily basis, both by players and by characters in the story.

Getting lore isn't always a good thing. The strange case of the Night Elves demonstrates that vividly.
Well you have mostly Golden and Knaack to thank for that. In my honest opinion Warcraft lore would be a lot better without the books.
Reply Quote
90 Human Warlock
5390
In my honest opinion Warcraft lore would be a lot better if the main story was told in the game and the books were regulated to supplementary stories, like Arthas: Rise of the Lich King.
Reply Quote
49 Human Warlock
340
12/05/2012 10:19 AMPosted by Ondor
he didn't strip it, the night elves didn't have it at the time, and if the dragons had really wanted to give it back to them they wouldn't have asked for malfurion advice. which was just that advice not a hard choice but a peprsonal feeling that immortality wasn;t good for his people. the dragons were free to say yeah we think you need it dude that they agreed with him doesn;t make malfurion a monster.


No they didn't have it but he turned down the chance at having it again. Also, although I could be wrong, didn't he say he never wants that brought up again. So even if it could become good for his people in his own flawed sense of morality the night elves wouldn't get it back.

The aspects aren't going to force immortality on anyone. Of course they asked for advice on what to do, they aren't going to go "you will have it and you will like it". That isn't their style. They listened to Malfurion's opinion which is not agreeing, it is respecting his decision. Did they ask the wrong person. Yes. Malfurion has only been awake in Azeroth when the whole world is going to burn do to someone or something's evil plot. He has seen the world and the night elves from a flawed perspective. Malfurion is a terrible character because he does not care about his people and deciding to make the decision for the night elves when he is a member of a neutral faction isn't fair. That is why he is a monster. It would be as if Jaina pre Tides of War was running around and making decisions for Stormwind and the humans. Biased perspective that does not represent the beliefs of her people.


well lets put it this way if malfurion wasn't who he was they never would of offered in the first place. the dragons never asked the first time they gave the night elves immortality why would it be against their style to not ask the second time? they offered it becuase they knew malfurion was wise enough to know if it was a good idea or not. if he wasn't able to see that it was bad for the night elves they never would of asked. you say his out look is flawed becuase he slept alot guess that makes it even more impressive that he made the right call. A huge chunk of the story since the night elves lost their immortality and even before that was that the night elves were too prideful about their immortality and it was poisoning them as a race.
Reply Quote
90 Night Elf Rogue
8210
Well you have mostly Golden and Knaack to thank for that. In my honest opinion Warcraft lore would be a lot better without the books.


No, we have Metzen and Fargo to thank for that, for two reasons:

1. Metzen greenlights the books.

2. The bad lore is front and center in the game too.
Reply Quote
90 Human Warlock
5390
12/05/2012 12:41 AMPosted by Listinna
i have seen your interpretation of novels way too many times to give this any credability.


Pretty late, but Malfurion straight up says the wilds of Azeroth concern him more than the night elves at the beginning of Wolfheart.
Reply Quote
90 Night Elf Rogue
8210
12/05/2012 08:02 PMPosted by Tessa
i have seen your interpretation of novels way too many times to give this any credability.


Pretty late, but Malfurion straight up says the wilds of Azeroth* concern him more than the night elves at the beginning of Wolfheart.


*Except Ashenvale

... there, fixed it.
Reply Quote

Please report any Code of Conduct violations, including:

Threats of violence. We take these seriously and will alert the proper authorities.

Posts containing personal information about other players. This includes physical addresses, e-mail addresses, phone numbers, and inappropriate photos and/or videos.

Harassing or discriminatory language. This will not be tolerated.

Forums Code of Conduct

Report Post # written by

Reason
Explain (256 characters max)
Submit Cancel

Reported!

[Close]