A guide for Holy Paladins 5.1

90 Human Paladin
7045
While I was looking for Holy Pally guides into more theory-crafting I stumbled upon Icy-Veins site and noticed that they are being greatly misleading against what should be taught about our class' abilities and spec.
The long and short of what I'm explaining is best described in Noxxic's link http://www.noxxic.com/wow/pve/paladin/holy

This is going to be a work in progress but I will be continuing to update and edit this post as EJ, Icy-Veins, and MMO MeltingPot are all incorrect in their stat weights.
Holy Pally stat weights:

Spirit >=Int > Mastery >= Haste > Crit

    Quick breakdown of Mastery >= Haste. Until you have ~10k+ mp5 you are going to be burning though mana too fast for it to be a sustainable stat beyond 3-4 minutes in a raid fight. Where our mastery doesn't force us to consume mana faster it provides a % of our heal as a bubble on top of the 100% heal that we provide to that person. Look at getting to around 485 iLvl and get your haste to 3506 rating (with the raid buff it brings your haste to 25.03% which gives your EF an additional tick for healing), then pour the rest into mastery if spirit isn't the first option. Only go this route if you have the play room, until then stat mastery into a higher priority over the soft haste cap until then.


    First thing people need to know about 5.1 is that with the mana cap we are going to need a ton of spirit, which no longer comes from int as it once did. Mastery is weighted over haste due to the bubble it creates on people without the cost of any additional mana. (MoP is rewarding efficient healers over speed healing), look at Holy Radiance (HR) or Divine Light (DL) they both cost 21k mana, that is a !@#$ ton to spend on a single heal!
    I want to note our soft haste cap (Entirely optional!!!) of 3506 (this is accounting for the haste buff in raid) is something that you may want to look at when you have 11k+ mp5 unbuffed as it provides your EF another tick in the HoT. Please note that the haste rating of 5806 without the 5% buff in raid is not quantifiable in any situation compared to the stat weight into Mastery


With our gemming we want to use 3 Gems


Haste caps received from: http://www.totemspot.com/vb/entry.php?b=41

Talent Tree:
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/tool/talent-calculator#ba!211221!SKr

    NOTE: The one thing I want to critique here is that you will be swapping your 4th, 5th and 6th talent a lot based on the fight if you are doing progression, look into fights and see what can give you the edge as going into detail will not help without knowledge of your raid comp and skill level.[/ul]

    The use of Sacred Shield (SS) or Eternal Flame (EF)

      The biggest difference is on the implementation of the two abilities; SS is a predict and prevent where you need to be able to predict the damage coming in. The major downside to this is that it has a 5 second ramp up time and can only prevent a small amount of damage every 5 seconds IE: Doesn't handle well with burst damage. Looking at the EF ability it is designed for instant recovery with a HoT on top to finish off their health pool, it works very effectively in playing catchup, MT/OT healing as one is beaconed and you EF the other, effectively healing both tanks with one heal, combined with Glyph of the Protector of the Innocent you also heal yourself for 30% of your total EF on the target. Overall for most people I would suggest EF as looking into WoLs and trying to predict damage taken is not as effective for people as healers are used to being reactionary; we see health bars go down and we fill them up.


    Regarding rotation you want to use Holy Shock (HS) whenever it is off CD.

      Our healing is based off our Holy Power (HP) and mana conservation to do this I use Beacon of Light (BoL) on the main tank and Holy Light as much as possible (spamming it to no end) the reason is the beacon target receives 100% of the heal on top of your target, your heal just doubled in its efficiency on top of being a mana conservation. Divine Light should only be used on your beaconed target as this will generate 1 HP (there are one off situations where another person needs a DL).


    Eternal Flame's use

      In 25m don't worry about Eternal Flame (EF) on anyone other then the MT and OT, as Light of Dawn (LoD) heals more then EF does in 25m to benefit from LoD in 10m you need to make sure that there is steady aoe damage coming out. With the talent tree in the 5th row in Divine Purpose, 25% of the time you will have a free heal with your HP, and yes it can proc from itself over and over again (I have personally hit 7 procs in a row resulting in using 24 HP for only the cost of 3).


    How to use Divine Plea to its maximum benefit.

      The biggest thing people who play Holy Pally's seem to forget is the use of Divine Plea (DP), it should be used at 80% mana. People ask "but why would I use it when I have tons of mana already?" Divine plea gives you 12% of your mana back, on a 2 minute cd you can use it 3-6 times a fight depending on the fight (haven't seen been in a raid fight where the boss is less then 6 minutes long). Rather then only using DP when you have to cause you are out of mana use it at 80% (this accounts for the 12% and the additional you wait while it is being used that is mp5 regen/the casting time from the glyph of DP) at that point you should use it every time it is up from that point.


    I wanted to continue this thread with a bit more about the nitty gritty on Holy Pally healing, when you look at healing it isn't as simple as just using an add-on to heal people and end of story. Every class has a strong point and a weak spot knowing how to utilize your class to the best possible in every situation will make you wanted by every guild out there. People can fix a lack of gear but a lack of skill is another thing. I will lay it out so everyone can benefit as much as possible.

    Our Strengths:

      Holy Pally's real strength lies in being a reactionary healer, we see something happen and fix it, we are provided with such strong single target heals that we are often relied on as tank healers. With the change in MoP with HP we are much more versatile once we adapt to the changes, if you have noticed that resto shamans are coming out on top over your heals it is because you are missing the key point: HP is more then a instant burst of healing with EF, use your holy power when there is massive AoE damage going out with LoD, we have enough normal healing spells that are high single target as is to not worry about burst damage too much with HP.


    Our weaknesses:

      Holy Pally's biggest downfalls are mana conservation and raid positioning, I have touched on why mana is such a huge issue with the cost of spells, but I want to talk about how to counteract this, HP, our abilities are based around HP and should be utilized as much as possible, Holy Shock (HS) should be used every time it is up (even if there isn't anyone to heal), Holy Radiance (HR) generates a HP also but is expensive, Divine Light (DL) and Flash of Light (FoL) both generate a HP when used on a beaconed target, Crusader Strike if you are in melee and need HP for LoD you can rack it up quickly with multiple abilities.

    FUN FACT: Holy Shock is not just a burst single target heal, it is also an AoE heal if used after a HR.

    The second thing I want to touch on here is our second greatest weakness: Positioning.

    [ul]We are not instant casters (with the exception of EF/WoG and LoD which is our little trick to turn it around which I'll explain in a bit). When it comes to raid positioning you want to position yourself so that if possible you never have to move your character to heal someone as you are always in range of every character, you plant your feet there as long as possible without ignoring raid mechanics (FIRE!!!) with the most of our abilities being casting we cannot move and heal. HR, DL, FoL, HL are all caster heals and as such we need to have the best positioning as possible so we are not continuously moving and not healing. The only thing I can advise is that we save HP for if we have to move often (Stone Guard in MSV) and use it accordingly, if I know I am going to be moving a bit in the fight I generate 5 HP and then move, I now have 3 heals on the move which are all quite strong (3HP LoD or EF) which ever is taking more damage, then a HS on a single target (this generates 1 HP and is an instant cast so you can cast on the move with it) and another 3HP heal. At this point stringing combos is going to come more naturally as you start to realize what we have in our toolbox to string heals off back to back without worrying about mana.


EDIT: I did some much needed formatting and addition to the page.
Edited by Kromus on 12/1/2012 8:54 AM PST
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90 Human Paladin
5785
While I was looking for Holy Pally guides into more theory-crafting I stumbled upon Icy-Veins site and noticed that they are being greatly misleading against what should be taught about our class' abilities and spec.
The long and short of what I'm explaining is best described in Noxxic's link http://www.noxxic.com/wow/pve/paladin/holy[1]
This is going to be a work in progress but I will be continuing to update and edit this post as EJ, Icy-Veins, and MMO MeltingPot are all incorrect in their stat weights.
Holy Pally stat weights:
Spirit >=Int > Mastery >= Haste > Crit
Quick breakdown of Mastery >= Haste. Until you have ~10k+ mp5 you are going to be burning though mana too fast for it to be a sustainable stat beyond 3-4 minutes in a raid fight. Where our mastery doesn't force us to consume mana faster it provides a % of our heal as a bubble on top of the 100% heal that we provide to that person. Look at getting to around 485 iLvl and get your haste to 3506 rating (with the raid buff it brings your haste to 25.03% which gives your EF an additional tick for healing), then pour the rest into mastery if spirit isn't the first option. Only go this route if you have the play room, until then stat mastery into a higher priority over the soft haste cap until then.
First thing people need to know about 5.0.4 is that with the mana cap we are going to need a ton of spirit, which no longer comes from int as it once did. Mastery is weighted over haste due to the bubble it creates on people without the cost of any additional mana. (MoP is rewarding efficient healers over speed healing), look at Holy Radiance (HR) or Divine Light (DL) they both cost 21k mana, that is a !@#$ ton to spend on a single heal!
I want to note our soft haste cap (Entirely optional!!!) of 3506 (this is accounting for the haste buff in raid) is something that you may want to look at when you have 11k+ mp5 unbuffed as it provides your EF another tick in the HoT. Please note that the haste rating of 5806 without the 5% buff in raid is not quantifiable in any situation compared to the stat weight into Mastery
Haste caps received from: http://www.totemspot.com/vb/entry.php?b=41[2]
Talent Tree:
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/tool/talent-calculator#ba!211221!SKr[3]
The one thing I want to critique here is that you will be swapping your 4th, 5th and 6th talent a lot based on the fight if you are doing progression, look into fights and see what can give you the edge as going into detail will not help without knowledge of your raid comp and skill level.
The use of Sacred Shield (SS) or Eternal Flame (EF)
The biggest difference is on the implementation of the two abilities; SS is a predict and prevent where you need to be able to predict the damage coming in. The major downside to this is that it has a 5 second ramp up time and can only prevent a small amount of damage every 5 seconds IE: Doesn't handle well with burst damage. Looking at the EF ability it is designed for instant recovery with a HoT on top to finish off their health pool, it works very effectively in playing catchup, MT/OT healing as one is beaconed and you EF the other, effectively healing both tanks with one heal, combined with Glyph of the Protector of the Innocent you also heal yourself for 30% of your total EF on the target. Overall for most people I would suggest EF as looking into WoLs and trying to predict damage taken is not as effective for people as healers are used to being reactionary; we see health bars go down and we fill them up.
Regarding rotation you want to use Holy Shock (HS) whenever it is off CD, our healing is based off our Holy Power (HP) and mana conservation to do this I use Beacon of Light (BoL) on the main tank and Holy Light as much as possible (spamming it to no end) the reason is the beacon target receives 100% of the heal on top of your target, your heal just doubled in its efficiency on top of being a mana conservation. Divine Light should only ever be used on your beaconed target, this will generate 1 HP. In 25m don't worry about Eternal Flame (EF) on anyone other then the MT and OT, as Light of Dawn (LoD) heals more then EF does in 25m to benefit from LoD in 10m you need to make sure that there is steady aoe damage coming out. With the talent tree in the 5th row in Divine Purpose, 25% of the time you will have a free heal with your HP, and yes it can proc from itself over and over again (I have personally hit 7 procs in a row resulting in using 24 HP for only the cost of 3).
The biggest thing people who play Holy Pally's seem to forget is the use of Divine Plea (DP), it should be used at 80% mana. People ask "but why would I use it when I have tons of mana already?" Divine plea gives you 12% of your mana back, on a 2 minute cd you can use it 3-6 times a fight depending on the fight (haven't seen been in a raid fight where the boss is less then 6 minutes long). Rather then only using DP when you have to cause you are out of mana use it at 80% (this accounts for the 12% and the additional you wait while it is being used that is mp5 regen/the casting time from the glyph of DP) at that point you should use it every time it is up from that point.
I wanted to continue this thread with a bit more about the nitty gritty on Holy Pally healing, when you look at healing it isn't as simple as just using an add-on to heal people and end of story. Every class has a strong point and a weak spot knowing how to utilize your class to the best possible in every situation will make you wanted by every guild out there. People can fix a lack of gear but a lack of skill is another thing. I will lay it out so everyone can benefit as much as possible. Holy Pally's real strength lies in being a reactionary healer, we see something happen and fix it, we are provided with such strong single target heals that we are often relied on as tank healers. With the change in MoP with HP we are much more versatile once we adapt to the changes, if you have noticed that resto shamans are coming out on top over your heals it is because you are missing the key point: HP is more then a instant burst of healing with EF, use your holy power when there is massive AoE damage going out with LoD, we have enough normal healing spells that are high single target as is to not worry about burst damage too much with HP.
Holy Pally's biggest downfalls are mana conservation and raid positioning, I have touched on why mana is such a huge issue with the cost of spells, but I want to talk about how to counteract this, HP, our abilities are based around HP and should be utilized as much as possible, Holy Shock (HS) should be used every time it is up (even if there isn't anyone to heal), Holy Radiance (HR) generates a HP also but is expensive, Divine Light (DL) and Flash of Light (FoL) both generate a HP when used on a beaconed target, Crusader Strike if you are in melee and need HP for LoD you can rack it up quickly with multiple abilities. FUN FACT: Holy Shock is not just a burst single target heal, it is also an AoE heal if used after a HR.
The second thing I want to touch on here is our second greatest weakness: Positioning. We are not instant casters (with the exception of EF/WoG and LoD which is our little trick to turn it around which I'll explain in a bit). When it comes to raid positioning you want to position yourself so that if possible you never have to move your character to heal someone as you are always in range of every character, you plant your feet there as long as possible without ignoring raid mechanics FIRE!!! with the most of our abilities being casting we cannot move and heal. HR, DL, FoL, HL are all caster heals and as such we need to have the best positioning as possible so we are not continuously moving and not healing. The only thing I can advise is that we save HP for if we have to move often (Stone Guard in MSV) and use it accordingly, if I know I am going to be moving a bit in the fight I generate 5 HP and then move, I now have 3 heals on the move which are all quite strong (3HP LoD or EF) which ever is taking more damage, then a HS on a single target (this generates 1 HP and is an instant cast so you can cast on the move with it) and another 3HP heal. At this point stringing combos is going to come more naturally as you start to realize what we have in our toolbox to string heals off back to back without worrying about mana.


Needs some editing....... and paragraphs.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
15495
My god..

Use that there formatting, guy.

Absolutely disgusting.
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90 Human Paladin
7045
Edited
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100 Draenei Paladin
14025
n 25m don't worry about Eternal Flame (EF) on anyone other then the MT and OT, as Light of Dawn (LoD) heals more then EF does in 25m


Speaking as a 25m raider, this is a pretty big exaggeration. They're both useful tools, and should be treated as such. If you are never ever using EF on anyone but the two tanks, you're doing something drastically wrong - on the other hand, if you're ignoring LoD much of the time (the way you would heal quite a few 10m encounters) you're also doing it drastically wrong.

You also shouldn't pop Divine Plea right at 80% mana. Look for opportunities with low damage, or when other healers pop raid cooldowns such as Healing Tide or Tranquility, and take advantage of that to regen mana without endangering your raid with 50% reduced healing.

Also, in any situation where you need to heal heavily during DP, you typically are better off not casting it. Plan better next time :-P really, it's a waste of mana because you would need to cast 2x as much.

You also didn't really go into talents or glyphs, really.
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100 Draenei Paladin
12720

You also shouldn't pop Divine Plea right at 80% mana. Look for opportunities with low damage, or when other healers pop raid cooldowns such as Healing Tide or Tranquility, and take advantage of that to regen mana without endangering your raid with 50% reduced healing.
.


You really should be using the Divine Plea glyph. With a good amount of haste you can get the cast time under 5s, and you should be able to find a good point to use it around 80% mana and then close to every cooldown.

Also, EF blanketing works better in 25 mans.

Also if your not using EF Blanket, don't bother with haste break points. Just try and get more mastery, obviously once you get past 10-11k spirit you should go for haste.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
6080
Don't forget to use divine plea cancellation

/cancelaura Divine Plea

you should add that line to your Divine Light or Holy Radiance macros.

Divine Plea is so weak now, compared to what it was, that I think players will just stop using it when we have better gear.
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90 Human Paladin
8740
Don't forget to use divine plea cancellation

/cancelaura Divine Plea

you should add that line to your Divine Light or Holy Radiance macros.

Divine Plea is so weak now, compared to what it was, that I think players will just stop using it when we have better gear.


Why would you ever do this... There are plenty of opportunities where there is almost next to zero healing required for a good 10 seconds. And if someone spikes, that's why you have another healer. Obviously you wouldn't use it right before a massive AoE attack...
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
6250
Not a bad post at all OP, good job.

12/01/2012 06:08 PMPosted by Danhaas
Divine Plea is so weak now, compared to what it was, that I think players will just stop using it when we have better gear.


Umm.. okayy.. I feel sorry for any other healers in your group that have to pick up your slack when you oom.
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90 Human Paladin
4035
thanks i found this very useful. i just went pvp holy yesterday and this helped.
Edited by Asaemon on 12/2/2012 9:49 AM PST
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100 Draenei Paladin
14025
12/01/2012 03:34 PMPosted by Tierná
You really should be using the Divine Plea glyph. With a good amount of haste you can get the cast time under 5s, and you should be able to find a good point to use it around 80% mana and then close to every cooldown.


It's a useful glyph, no doubt, but it's merely kind of okay. I would consider using it if we didn't have SO MANY good options. I would put it roughly on par with Protector of the Innocent, personally.

Saving a few seconds with DP really isn't that big of a deal that the glyph would be mandatory.

Also, EF blanketing works better in 25 mans.

Also if your not using EF Blanket, don't bother with haste break points. Just try and get more mastery, obviously once you get past 10-11k spirit you should go for haste.


Uhhh. Like I said, it's a useful tool, but blanketing with EF isn't the only way to heal and isn't viable in some situations. You need to mix'n'match, not just pick one and stick with it.

I have yet to play with breakpoints. My hunch is that it's not remotely worth it unless you're only a few hundred off naturally, just because of the mana efficiency factor and because one extra tick on an ability that already has 12(?) or so isn't a ton, but that's from a 25-man setting where EF is less of a go-to. I may be wrong for 10 man.
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100 Draenei Paladin
12720
EF Blanketing works on any encounter where the raid takes a significant amount of damage. It works great in 25 mans, because you should have someone else that can do burst healing. (LoD)

It also triggers our mastery. So it is great for stacking shields on the raid. Its also better than Sacred shield assuming you use more than 2 EF every 30s and you maintain perfect SS uptime.

EF blanketing is still a skill holy paladins need to cultivate to excel, even with the divine purpose/pvp 4 piece interaction nerfed/fixed.

I'm not saying you should devote your entire healing strategy to using EF, but there are situations where it is very powerful.

Obviously on garajal SS is better as it prevents damage that spreads to vodoo dolls.
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90 Tauren Paladin
12145
Just FYI:

Protector of the Innocent only heals you for 20% of the initial heal, and has nothing to do with the HoT portion.
Only using DL on your Beacon is just silly. Anyone who needs a big heal should either get a DL or a 3 HP WoG.
Lots of repetition. Could cut out plenty of things that are restated repeatedly.
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90 Human Paladin
9920
I'm sitting at about 487 ilvl hpally right now, 10mans 3/6h and rest cleared on norm atm (been rolling through a new tank each week it seems :S)

I did not read the entire post just skimmed it, but one thing I challenge is

12/01/2012 12:47 AMPosted by Kromus
Holy Pally's real strength lies in being a reactionary healer,


Holy pally IMO is in no way a reactionary healer. Other classes (shaman for example) have much better tools to react with, especially burst/aoe damage.

Where hpally is at right now we do NOT want to panic heal. Leave that to other classes, we just chug through channeling Holy Light and Shock through the raid with the odd Radiance and we can keep up with most heals.

At the point now where I can pop Int flasks/food and with stacking mastery its very nice heals/absorbs, much nicer than hard-stacking spirit out every orafice and spamming high-cost heals

Granted I have heals that I can rely on, which is not a luxury many healers out there can count on having
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90 Human Paladin
2860
I am not trolling, but alot of the information in this guide is misguided.
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93 Orc Death Knight
8035
What about melee for mana? and does crit still give mana back?
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90 Draenei Paladin
16080
It's not a great guide. There's some repeated information near the start, it puts too much weight on certain aspects (such as haste breakpoints for EF), some notable information is lacking (a discussion on level 90 talents, for instance), and some of the info is questionable.

12/05/2012 12:45 AMPosted by Rolyizbawz
What about melee for mana?

Still works assuming you have Seal of Insight. As always, it's very fight specific.

and does crit still give mana back?
Not unless you use a specific glyph.
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93 Orc Death Knight
8035
okay thanks, and what about judgment, does holy use that anymore?
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90 Draenei Paladin
16080
12/05/2012 01:24 AMPosted by Rolyizbawz
okay thanks, and what about judgment, does holy use that anymore?

No real reason to in PvE.
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90 Human Paladin
6490
Judgment isn't used for any kind of extra mana regen now.
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