And Mistweavers get the kick (Part 2!)

90 Pandaren Monk
11210
Since the previous thread hit 500 posts and have had requests to do this, I'm making a new thread to continue the discussion about the 5.1 changes, whether they were warranted, how they could have been done better, how to adapt to them and hold our own in the 5.1 world, and pretty much anything else.

So to start us off, here's a compiled list of the changes so far (including hotfixes, but only including mechanical changes that actually affect raids):

General
  • Spear Hand Strike now costs 10 Energy, down from 30. (no change to mana cost).
  • Crackling Jade Lightning now has a 30% chance per tick of generating 1 Chi, up from 25%.
  • Healing Sphere now scale 50% better with Spell Power and Attack Power. (Base healing and all of Mastery version unchanged).
  • Healing Sphere nows costs 40 Energy, down from 60 (mana cost unchanged).
  • The base healing of Chi Torpedo has been quadrupled, but it now scales less efficiently with attack power. (Edit: Tested, PTR numbers are current identical to Live, not sure what the deal is here).
  • Legacy of the Emperor and Legacy of the White Tiger energy costs reduced to 20, down from 50.
  • Base healing and scaling for Chi Burst, Chi Wave, and Zen Sphere's explosion reduced by 25%. Damage unchanged.
  • Monks in Stance of the Fierce Tiger now move 10% faster, stacking with other movement increasing effects.
  • Power Strikes and Healing Elixirs now show a buff when you're able to benefit from them. In addition, their cooldown starts when the buff is applies, rather than when it is used (unless the buff is still active when the buff would be applied by the cooldown, at which point the cooldown will start once the buff is consumed).
  • Power Strikes can now proc from Soothing Mist and Crackling Jade Lightning.
  • Healing Elixirs now has an 18 second ICD, up from 15.
  • Ascension now increases total mana by 15% and energy regen rate by 15%, in addition to increasing Chi pool by 1.
  • Dampen Harm requires damage taken to exceed 20% of your total HP, up from 10%.
  • Tiger Power (from using Tiger Palm) no longer stacks and instead provides its full benefit (30% ArP) on the first use.


Mistweaver
  • Renewing Mist now costs 45% more mana.
  • Jab and Spinning Crane Kick now costs 30% more mana.
    • Life Cocoon, Revival, Surging Mist, Path of Blossoms, and glyphed Uplift now cost 10% more mana.
    • Crackling Jade Lightning now costs 5% more mana.
    • Soothing Mist now costs 5% less mana.
    • Just to be explicit, Spear-Handed Strike, Expel Harm, Detox, Healing Sphere, Disable, Legacy of the Emperor, Paralysis, Resuscitate, Transcendence: Transfer, and Summon Jade Serpent Statue have no changes to their mana costs.
    • Soothing Mist now has a 30% chance per tick of generating 1 Chi, up from 25%.
    • Renewing Mist hits for approximately 2/3rds as much per tick, but ticks every 2 seconds instead of 3 (roughly the same HPS and total healing, just different haste breakpoints).
    • Enveloping Mist now heals for 32% less per tick.
    • Renewing Mist only hits 3 targets per cast, rather than 4. (nets to a 25% reduction in total healing to both Renewing Mist and Uplift).
    • Mana Tea has a chance equal to your spell crit chance of applying 2 stacks instead of 1 when a stack is generated.
    • Monks in Stance of the Wise Serpent now receive 50% more benefit from Haste Rating on gear.


    Brewmaster
    • Keg Smash now DRs past 5 targets.
    • Power Guard (from using Tiger Palm) no longer stacks and instead provides its full benefit (+15% Guard absorption) on the first use.


    Windwalker
    • Fist of Fury now requires the target to be in melee range in order to use.


    Also, here's the original thread for reference:

    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/7004403582?page=1
    Edited by Daerien on 12/3/2012 1:41 PM PST
    Reply Quote
    90 Blood Elf Monk
    8360
    first! bwuahahahahahah

    But yah, lets start the QQ:
    Reply Quote
    90 Pandaren Monk
    11210
    Well, if it puts it into perspective, that 30% mana nerf also convinced me to start looking back at my warlock.
    Reply Quote
    90 Blood Elf Monk
    10440
    12/03/2012 02:41 PMPosted by Daerien
    Well, if it puts it into perspective, that 30% mana nerf also convinced me to start looking back at my warlock.


    I only played because of fistweaving. I don't like playing the spec anymore.
    Reply Quote
    100 Blood Elf Monk
    17680
    Nobody saw anything. Twas just a dream.
    Reply Quote
    100 Blood Elf Monk
    17680
    But to be completely serious for a moment, there needs to be a very, very serious conversation between players and developers at some point really soon. I'm still collecting my notes but I've got finals all week this week so I can't write anything until next week.

    Posts will have to remain small.
    Reply Quote
    90 Pandaren Monk
    7105
    awww, loaded the page just a few seconds too late to see what I missed.
    Reply Quote
    100 Blood Elf Monk
    17680
    You'll see it at a later date.
    Reply Quote
    12/03/2012 02:53 PMPosted by Mist
    Nobody saw anything. Twas just a dream.


    i wish :(....

    Im having mana issues now and outside of chi burst what do we have left to ae heal without going ooom.
    Reply Quote
    90 Pandaren Monk
    11210
    Ya, the Devs seem to have gotten it into their head from the DK fiasco that listening to community concerns = OP class, period. Their thought process now seems to be that if the community is complaining about it, it must be balanced, and that if the community isn't complaining about it, it must be OP (at least where new classes are concerned).
    Reply Quote
    90 Pandaren Monk
    9310
    first! bwuahahahahahah

    But yah, lets start the QQ:


    No QQ, just feedback.
    Here is what we don't like and why.
    QQ causes our problems to be ignored, feedback solves them.
    Reply Quote
    90 Pandaren Monk
    0
    Honestly, I'm really thrown off.

    Let me start by saying, I've been healing since Molten Core. I know how to heal well, and have been consistently and reliably on the top of the meters of every single healing class I play within my guild for every expansion. Last expansion, I managed to do consistently more healing on other characters in greens then my guildies in full epics. I'm not saying this to toot my own horn, but to give tried and true evidence that there's something wrong.

    These are people who pre 5.1, were only doing at most ~15% (that's being generous) of the total healing when we three healed it. 5.1 comes, suddenly they're only 10% behind me; (on a few occasions I've done double the other two healers combined.) I'm not saying that these numbers are fair, but to get that much of a reduction from these changes is really just inappropriate.

    I don't even think it's so much from an output perspective, though I definitely hurt there; but more because of how chaotic healing on a monk now seems. One of the reasons I always play a healer is while it's really active it's more of a guttural/instinct type playstyle then mash these buttons in this order.

    5.1 hits, and my mana isn't even bad, it's just bizarre and erratic. Sometimes, I'll be fine with my mana tea, then I'll suddenly go oom because I needed to cast 1 or 2 single target heals with a few chi abilities mixed in, yet I'll only have one stack of tea but 10% mana left.

    It's very hard to be a reliable healer when my mana is so erratic.

    And then, to top it off; they changed the enveloping mists icon. I know have this really bizarre brownish yellow icon in the middle of my soothing green icons. I want the old one back.
    Reply Quote
    90 Blood Elf Monk
    8360
    first! bwuahahahahahah

    But yah, lets start the QQ:


    No QQ, just feedback.
    Here is what we don't like and why.
    QQ causes our problems to be ignored, feedback solves them.

    Ghostcrawler has specifically stated nothing we say is considered in their thought process unless it is incredibly genius that they realize their original intent was wrong. So no, feedback pointless, qq good for venting.

    amirite?
    Reply Quote
    90 Pandaren Monk
    Vex
    11920
    But to be completely serious for a moment, there needs to be a very, very serious conversation between players and developers at some point really soon. I'm still collecting my notes but I've got finals all week this week so I can't write anything until next week.

    Posts will have to remain small.


    Im honestly willing to forgo a conversation at this point. ACKNOWLEDGE US. Say 'Hi, monks.' Something.

    Have they ever mentioned monks since MoP came out?
    Reply Quote
    90 Blood Elf Monk
    8360
    But to be completely serious for a moment, there needs to be a very, very serious conversation between players and developers at some point really soon. I'm still collecting my notes but I've got finals all week this week so I can't write anything until next week.

    Posts will have to remain small.


    Im honestly willing to forgo a conversation at this point. ACKNOWLEDGE US. Say 'Hi, monks.' Something.

    Have they ever mentioned monks since MoP came out?

    I think once when they talked about the soothing mist healing reduction, i think i saw some blue post on MMO champion about blizz wanting us to have a "mana neutral" heal
    Reply Quote
    90 Pandaren Monk
    11210
    Yup, here's the next thing for Blizz to nerf, since it still allows monks to be viable:

    http://img716.imageshack.us/img716/3026/wowscrnshot120312165344.jpg
    Reply Quote

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