Resto druid pve

90 Blood Elf Priest
6590
Perhaps a better way to think of it is...the issue that many Disc Priests have with PoH being our one-button wonder is the issue that Resto Druids have with Rejuv. They literally have nothing else to use in 99% of scenarios. Outside of extreme stack fights, what else are they going to do?

No class should be THIS tied to ONE spell, imo. That it's expensive to the point that it will run you OOM very quickly only adds insult to injury.


Very nice way to put it. Having another button to use besides NEEDING to use rejuv on multiple people could possibly offset being that tied to rejuv.
90 Troll Druid
HC
12650
Perhaps a better way to think of it is...the issue that many Disc Priests have with PoH being our one-button wonder is the issue that Resto Druids have with Rejuv. They literally have nothing else to use in 99% of scenarios. Outside of extreme stack fights, what else are they going to do?

No class should be THIS tied to ONE spell, imo. That it's expensive to the point that it will run you OOM very quickly only adds insult to injury.


Very nice way to put it. Having another button to use besides NEEDING to use rejuv on multiple people could possibly offset being that tied to rejuv.

And I do think that was the purpose WM was supposed to serve, but it hasn't turned out that way.
90 Blood Elf Priest
13110
12/06/2012 03:55 PMPosted by Fleurs
And I do think that was the purpose WM was supposed to serve, but it hasn't turned out that way.


Pretty much.
100 Night Elf Druid
6355
12/05/2012 09:13 AMPosted by Alphadrood
How exactly does someone argue that WOL parses are an "invalid" measure of raid performance?


Well, the obvious example would be if someone casts a direct heal on a player that already has a HoT on them and the addon counts the HoT as the overheal. Anyone with a brain should realize that that was a bad time to cast a direct heal on that player and the player who cast the direct heal should be charged with the overheal instead, but addons don't have brains and it's difficult to code that kind of thing.

If your cohealer views healing as a competition to top the meter rather than as a collaborative effort to keep the raid alive, then yeah, it's going to suck to use HoTs. And if your raid leader looks at the guy competitively healing to top the meters and concludes that he genuinely is a better healer, then you need a new raid leader.

But that's just a longwinded way of saying that meters are a very poor way of judging performance of non-dps roles.
90 Blood Elf Priest
13110
12/06/2012 04:09 PMPosted by Calonderiel
Well, the obvious example would be if someone casts a direct heal on a player that already has a HoT on them and the addon counts the HoT as the overheal. Anyone with a brain should realize that that was a bad time to cast a direct heal on that player and the player who cast the direct heal should be charged with the overheal instead, but addons don't have brains and it's difficult to code that kind of thing.


That makes absolutely no sense. Overhealing, by definition, is healing done to a player when they are not injured.

I can't see the HoTs my Druid co-healer puts out. Nor should the onus be on me to track his HoTs on my bars so that his numbers can somehow be "better."

But that's just a longwinded way of saying that meters are a very poor way of judging performance of non-dps roles.


Meters are a fine way of looking at performance, but you can't just look at the straight up HPS. You have to look at a multitude of things BEHIND Those numbers, and that is where people get messed up.
90 Troll Druid
HC
12650
I can't see the HoTs my Druid co-healer puts out. Nor should the onus be on me to track his HoTs on my bars so that his numbers can somehow be "better."

I remember back in early t11 progression Sensations and Jumpies made it so they could see my hots so they didn't overwrite them as much as they had been. That way they wouldn't waste mana on something that already had a hot, and I wouldn't be so useless. :P
90 Blood Elf Priest
13110
12/06/2012 09:57 PMPosted by Fleurs
I remember back in early t11 progression Sensations and Jumpies made it so they could see my hots so they didn't overwrite them as much as they had been. That way they wouldn't waste mana on something that already had a hot, and I wouldn't be so useless. :P


So far, I haven't found a way to that doesn't cause my abilities to scroll off the health bar, and the health bars are already full of plenty of other things that I need to be watching. :-P

I operate under the assumption that everyone I'm healing, Dalaylan is healing. We talk to each other about CDs before using them. I might bubble someone who is low, but that doesn't mean I'm going to immediately drop an emergency heal on him (unless he's like "ur gonna die from someone sneezing on you, bro" low). I let the Druid heal up the excess while I focus on whatever else I'm doing.

But I usually don't raid heal as much as tank heal in my team. *shrug* When Dalaylan and I heal together, our numbers are fairly close. I don't try to snipe his Tranqs. I really don't try to snipe his HoTs in general. It's been this way since I started healing - I did the same with my other Resto Druid buddy, Tyleigh. It just requires communication. But especially in a 10 man, the assumption should be that your cohealer is healing everything.
90 Night Elf Druid
10550
I can't see the HoTs my Druid co-healer puts out. Nor should the onus be on me to track his HoTs on my bars so that his numbers can somehow be "better."


While tracking your druids HoTs may be optimal and efficient for both of you, I agree it's probably not needed for a ten man. Especially if you and your fellow healers have been working together for a while and you have that relationship where you know exactly how the other operates.

Our resto shammy and I work quite well together. I'm still working on or feral druid turned MW Monk as he tends to smother my HoTs in a panic when there's a moderate to a lot of damage going out.
100 Night Elf Druid
6355
Overhealing, by definition, is healing done to a player when they are not injured.


No, *that* makes absolutely no sense. Overhealing is healing done to a player who does not need to be healed.

Now, obviously, a player at 100% HP doesn't need to be healed (in some situations it might be a good idea to shield them, or even to pre-hot them at the risk of wasting a tick).

But a player who is at 95% HP and under a hot that will tick for 5% in a couple seconds ALSO doesn't need to be healed, even if addons aren't smart enough to realize that. Healing that player is a waste of YOUR mana, because they will already be back at 100% in a few seconds even if you don't. This is equally true regardless of whether the HoT is Recup or something cast by your co-healer.

Nor should the onus be on me to track his HoTs on my bars so that his numbers can somehow be "better."


It's not about whose numbers are "better" -- if you snipe heal players who DON'T NEED IT you are wasting mana and ultimately hurting the group. That's far more important than the fact that you're also trashing your co-healer's meter numbers for no good reason.
100 Tauren Druid
9885
trashing your co-healer's meter numbers for no good reason.


You just described 99.99% of raid teams.
85 Night Elf Druid
0
12/07/2012 05:39 AMPosted by Calonderiel
Overhealing is healing done to a player who does not need to be healed.


No, it isn't. By definition, it isn't. There's literally no simpler way to say it, you're just wrong.
100 Troll Druid
12515
12/07/2012 12:43 PMPosted by Anarri
Overhealing is healing done to a player who does not need to be healed.


No, it isn't. By definition, it isn't. There's literally no simpler way to say it, you're just wrong.


Everyone is playing semantics today

Overhealing is the concept of healing more than is required.

http://www.wowwiki.com/Overhealing

Notice how I backed up my argument with an authority on a subject that has no real meaning - at least not in RL ;)
100 Night Elf Druid
9110
12/07/2012 01:12 PMPosted by Moophious


No, it isn't. By definition, it isn't. There's literally no simpler way to say it, you're just wrong.


Everyone is playing semantics today

Overhealing is the concept of healing more than is required.

http://www.wowwiki.com/Overhealing

Notice how I backed up my argument with an authority on a subject that has no real meaning - at least not in RL ;)


However did we manage without addons ........
90 Blood Elf Priest
13110
12/07/2012 01:17 PMPosted by Silksight
However did we manage without addons ........


Since they had Healbot back in vanilla, I really don't know...
100 Night Elf Druid
10255


But the reality is that, if the other healer can heal over your hots like that, what is the resto druid contributing?

Asking other classes not to play to their potential so the druids can keep up... isn't that pretty much the definition of being underpowered?


QFT. Other healers generally are not running in to mana issues so it isnt like our HoTs are helping them in that way either.

Our class design is fundamentally flawed and the devs have no idea how to fix it. HoTs as a primary mechanism of healing is significantly and substantially underpowered due to the nature of the content and the direct output power of other healers. The vast majority of the time we cannot predict damage on players (it is either random or due to player error) and, even if we could, the reward for having to play with such a high degree of foresight is really minimal. Why play a druid, who has to predict who is going to be damaged 5-10 seconds in advance and roll hots, while managing harmony and lifebloom uptime, when I can just play a disc priest and spam smite, ignoring any future incoming damage because my heals are intelligent and will pick hurt players up one by one eventually with no further thought on my part?
90 Tauren Druid
11420
The reason is because it's incredibly powerful when the other healers CAN'T keep up with outhealing our hots. Mana bars only stretch so far and we (and disc priests, I found it odd that you picked the other healing class that needs to be thinking 30sec ahead of the fight so they can pre-bubble) are about the only ones that can set up absorbs/heals for damage BEFORE it happens.

I <3 my druid, I like being able to predict whats coming and take care of it beforehand. It drives me crazy when I'm on say, a shaman, and know a large damage hit is incoming and have nothing but healing rain that I can really do to help beforehand without tanking a mana bar.

I'm really not seeing these issues...if your healers have enough time and mana to snipe over all the druids hots without causing themselves mana issues then either you are overhealing the content, are on a non-healing intensive fight like spirit kings, or are on farm content. If your non-druid healers are running themselves oom trying to top everyone up when they all have hots rolling then 1. your healers need to l2heal and 2. your raid leader needs to do healing assignments better and perhaps start going over logs with the healers so both can learn/grow together.
1 Goblin Shaman
0
Ok - I am likely doing something fail on my resto - I think druids are the funnest to play when healing. I really enjoy the run and gun style.

However - you cant spam rejuvs - you go oom - or at least i do - tried it.

And I cant seem to get a HT or Regrowth for that matter to crit harder than 165K. A straight casted HT hits for around 80k on my druid. Does that seem right?

It doesnt feel like my druid has any punch when it comes to casting HT, regrowth, and especially nourish - hardly ever use it anymore.

Mostly casting lifebloom - swiftmend, wildgrowth and some rejuvs tossed in.

I would love to see some 300K HT's - some punch ya know.
91 Night Elf Druid
9335
Picked a good time to quit :)
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