Curtailing bad behavior

12/05/2012 06:14 PMPosted by Hothlo
Privacy is one thing... but we're talking about psuedo-anonymous character avatars, not real names. By only reporting on the highest level of bans (eg. mass bans, or such), you make the actual enforcement of the rules, especially for bad player behavior that doesn't directly impact gameplay (since this is never part of the mass bans or guild bans), transparent to the players, giving the impression that such things are tacitly endorsed.
Actually, it makes it not transparent, but, yes, i agree with the sentiment, here. People need to see that their efforts bring fruit, or else they eventually lose faith in the system, as many already have. This only compounds the problem, as people are less and less inclined to report inappropriate behavior, and as a result, it goes on unchecked more often. This just snowballs the situation.

I had other things to say, but... i don't feel it's worth putting anymore effort here, nothing will be done to try to improve things.
90 Blood Elf Warrior
9850
The problem for Blizzard right now is people are losing faith in them. In their rules and guidelines. Its like Lord of the Flies in this game, where people eat their young and gutting of the weak is sport.
100 Undead Priest
12440
This thread depresses me.

It depresses me to read people's stories of pretty terrible situations, and nothing being done.

It depresses me to see how many people are discouraged with this system.

And it depresses me to know that that discouragement is not unwarranted at all.
90 Blood Elf Paladin
5670
12/05/2012 10:48 PMPosted by Cellnine
The problem for Blizzard right now is people are losing faith in them. In their rules and guidelines. Its like Lord of the Flies in this game, where people eat their young and gutting of the weak is sport.


Without proper moderation, without proper consequence, without repercussions that actually matter ... it's really just a matter of time.

And, to be fair, it's not the fault of the employees.

It has to be one of the toughest jobs in the video game business.

But if your *boss* won't back you up?

Then there's no point in doing anything other than handing over a metric that says, "Minimum Accomplished."

If the CM's, GM's, mods and various support staff hit a strike tomorrow, I wouldn't blame them in the slightest.
100 Draenei Shaman
16140
12/05/2012 08:31 PMPosted by Alera
I would happily volunteer my time to help monitor reports, even if it's just for naming reports. This would leave the "more serious" issues of language/harassment, spamming and cheating for the paid GMs who are able to take appropriate actions, if any, against players, while allowing volunteers to "flag" players and guilds for renaming.


Same.

I have experience as a Guide in EQ2 and forum moderation on a few different forums now. I *can* moderate people who don't follow a guideline. And the names alone would go a long way.

12/05/2012 08:37 PMPosted by Mythox
The tools to report are there, just not used very much (that I can see anyways) by the player base. The GMs wont know who to action if the tools are not used. Just putting people on ignore and not reporting is akin to putting one's head in the sand and hoping the problem blows over.


And those of us that DO use the tools get ignored, probably because there's not enough reports. Because most people don't seem to care.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broken_windows_theory

Just a sidenote: letting the playerbase know in a visible way that such behavior isn't acceptable is a good way of ensuring the playerbase doesn't try to break them as much.

This is basic psychology, but, anonymity, CRZ, random grouping has degraded server communities. The lack of visible enforcement of the rules has allowed it to slip further. It's a snowball effect.


I can totally envision a mass ban of stupid and offending names for 24 hours, starting from next attempted log in.

Oh the rage. But it'd send a message.


Nobody cares about what Riot Games does, besides Rip Off of other MOBA's . Even comparing League of Legends to Wow is a Joke.
League of Legends ripped off of WC3, then Dota 2, then had the nerve to go pay2win.
Game balance revolves around buying the newest hero , only to have it nerfed 2 weeks later (they call this a hotfix) They will ban you for so much as calling a player bad or telling them what item to buy. You have to literally avoid chatting or become Sir Buttkiss to not receive a ban for telling people what not to do.

I laughed when you said they hired psychologists. Someone could make 5000 league of legends accounts and troll people every game, and what would Riot be able to do about it? Nothing . This game is different because of the amount of time people put into their characters.

I think Blizzard is just extremely understaffed atm. I remember when opening a ticket a GM would come extremely fast. Now it takes at least 1-2 days, if not more. Pretty sure they laid off a bunch of Customer Service Staff.


Honestly, it sounds like you just don't like Riot.

Given your dislike, you seem to be using it as an excuse to make baseless accusations while spouting forth general derision over an otherwise successful game. One I play on occasion for the fun of it.

They implemented something called the Honor System about two, maybe three months ago, before the Shadow Isles patch. Basically, this system allows players to grant other players an award based on Teamwork, Helpfulness, Friendliness, or (opponents only) Honorable Combat. Likewise, their reporting system has a lot of different specific topics, as well as a comment field. Filing a report sends it to the Tribunal for peer review by other LoL players and moderators.

Basically, they made players accountable. If you act like a douchenozzle in all your games, you're going to get reported more often than you get Honored. Get reported enough, you start getting suspended, or possibly banned for doing long and hard enough.

Warcraft? The Report button is just a free mute. I've never seen anyone personally disciplined by the company. Maybe LoL ain't perfect, but it does get things done in a manner that allows players to both report unfriendly or trolling players and later judge the veracity of reports.

It's a hell of a lot better than just ignoring that "Posterior Orifice" spam that Trade seems to love.

Yes, LoL is still a troll-heavy environment, and there are a lot of jackasses there, too. The difference is I can deal with them directly.
90 Goblin Priest
2605
I wish blizz would take an effort in putting a stop to all these bots. Its about to make me go to another game.
100 Draenei Shaman
16140
12/05/2012 10:46 PMPosted by Salt
I like Guild Wars 2's instant 72 hour ban, bam! Thanks for coming enjoy your holiday. The diffence in community between WoW and GW2 shows because of it.


Same.
90 Blood Elf Priest
4490
12/05/2012 10:58 PMPosted by Wexlur
The problem for Blizzard right now is people are losing faith in them. In their rules and guidelines. Its like Lord of the Flies in this game, where people eat their young and gutting of the weak is sport.


Without proper moderation, without proper consequence, without repercussions that actually matter ... it's really just a matter of time.

And, to be fair, it's not the fault of the employees.

It has to be one of the toughest jobs in the video game business.

But if your *boss* won't back you up?

Then there's no point in doing anything other than handing over a metric that says, "Minimum Accomplished."

If the CM's, GM's, mods and various support staff hit a strike tomorrow, I wouldn't blame them in the slightest.


Frankly I tend to disagree I do not feel it is your buisness to know how Blizz doles out punishment. For Blizz to tell you how they punish another player or even if they do punish another player is a breach in privacy

If you inadvertantly broke the rules would you want the person who reported you to know that you were one Punished and two with how you were punished? I doubt it..

I understand wanting to see the end results of reporting a player to know that something is being done.. but in this case I think it opens up a Can of worms that had best remain sealed
90 Gnome Monk
7430
Is there any particular reason you have yet to implement account-wide ignores yet? I shouldn't have to ignore multiple alts from the same account in order to avoid their crap.
90 Blood Elf Priest
4490
12/05/2012 11:58 PMPosted by Teelo
I must strongly disagree with this sentiment. Just letting it slide simply allows the in-game environment to become more toxic. We've provided the tools to allow each realm population to help shape its environment. It's important to use them, and use them consistently.
Players are not going to bother to use the tools if there is no ackowledgement that you are even looking at the reports. As far as we know, the reports go to null();

Explain to me how responding with "we banned the offending player" is a violation of privacy. Where is there a leak in personal information in that statement?

That is all it would take. A reassurance that our efforts aren't just being wasted. Tickets saying "we will look into the issue" and a tool that responds "thanks for your report" is not a reassurance. There is no way for us to know whether you even did anything or just threw it straight into a shredder with every other report you get. When we see the trolling and abuse continue from the same players after reports, it is a good sign that you aren't doing anything.


I can explain... You report a co worker for saying something or doing something that broke the companies rules.. the company will investigate it and then handle it per their polciy.. that policy does not include notifying you of what they decided to do. Now you may see the employe no longer coming to work, but a company will never come back to you and say oh by the way yes so and so broke the rules and we sent him home on a 2 week suspension. The Employee disciplined might reveal that information, but the company is not at liberty to do so.

It is really none of your buisness how another player was disciplined

I turn it around would you want me to know how you were disciplined?
84 Night Elf Rogue
785
Also, as harsh as this is going to sound, some people need to buck up and get some thick skin. Yes, there is racism. Yes, there is sexism. That doesn't make it okay, but those jokes have been around since cavemen and will probably be around until we discover an alien species to hate more than ourselves... and the sexism will probably stay even then. Point being, it's there. Either deal with it, learn to laugh at the harmlessness of most of it, or just start using your /ignore list.

Edit: Wow, I really can't use a synonym of boobs anymore. Awesome. Lol.


I don't really play much anymore, part of it is due to the horrendous playerbase. I'm using my own ignore feature: I ignore WoW.


if you don't play anymore, why do you bother making a thread?

how bored are you?
84 Night Elf Rogue
785
I must strongly disagree with this sentiment. Just letting it slide simply allows the in-game environment to become more toxic. We've provided the tools to allow each realm population to help shape its environment. It's important to use them, and use them consistently.
Players are not going to bother to use the tools if there is no ackowledgement that you are even looking at the reports. As far as we know, the reports go to null();

Explain to me how responding with "we banned the offending player" is a violation of privacy. Where is there a leak in personal information in that statement?

That is all it would take. A reassurance that our efforts aren't just being wasted. Tickets saying "we will look into the issue" and a tool that responds "thanks for your report" is not a reassurance. There is no way for us to know whether you even did anything or just threw it straight into a shredder with every other report you get. When we see the trolling and abuse continue from the same players after reports, it is a good sign that you aren't doing anything.


what's your problem with trolling? it's part of the internet and will continue to be part of it forever.

so many QQ babies on this forum its laughable.

EDIT: just noticed a 'trolling' option to click when you press dislike on a post.

Is trolling illegal or against Blizzard rules??
Edited by Likeadiamond on 12/6/2012 12:17 AM PST
12/06/2012 12:16 AMPosted by Likeadiamond
Players are not going to bother to use the tools if there is no ackowledgement that you are even looking at the reports. As far as we know, the reports go to null();

Explain to me how responding with "we banned the offending player" is a violation of privacy. Where is there a leak in personal information in that statement?

That is all it would take. A reassurance that our efforts aren't just being wasted. Tickets saying "we will look into the issue" and a tool that responds "thanks for your report" is not a reassurance. There is no way for us to know whether you even did anything or just threw it straight into a shredder with every other report you get. When we see the trolling and abuse continue from the same players after reports, it is a good sign that you aren't doing anything.


what's your problem with trolling? it's part of the internet and will continue to be part of it forever.

so many QQ babies on this forum its laughable.


So many superior beings on this forum, it's questionable.
They use the penalty volcano approach... which is to say they start by being fairly forgiving, and the more someone screws up.. the more punitive things get... until that player is no more.

However there are (roughly) 10 million players. You're going to have some bad applies... it's unavoidable unless you make things so strict that nobody can have any fun at all.


So 5.1 Does have a reason! I knew it!

Seriously I agree with ya though, so many people means all kinds are in game.
Humans suck...
84 Night Elf Rogue
785


what's your problem with trolling? it's part of the internet and will continue to be part of it forever.

so many QQ babies on this forum its laughable.


So many superior beings on this forum, it's questionable.


lol, i think they only become "superior" once they've logged into battlenet.
90 Gnome Rogue
7420
Blizzard can't control the person behind the Computer for whatever choices they make its up to them.I had to deal with outburst of random insults from people all the time in the game.Most of them might have anger issues that they can't seem to control at times even I realize when I encounter some players who had a short fuse to insult someone for no reason.
100 Draenei Shaman
16140
If you inadvertantly broke the rules would you want the person who reported you to know that you were one Punished and two with how you were punished? I doubt it..


No but I'd at least want them to see that I'm not in game for a time.

Nothing like reporting some dude daily for weeks on end, and yet he logs in every single day without fail.

I turn it around would you want me to know how you were disciplined?


Individual basis doesn't mean crap.

When you report the same say, five, individuals daily for <insert random offense here> and NOTHING happens, you end up giving up because it becomes obvious that a) no one else cares or b) Not even Blizzard gives a crap.

This one guy with a racist name has had it since I transferred here back in March. He's still got it. Not only is his name racist, but it contains a word that's gotten people forum vacations here as well. There's some guy over on my old realm that spews racist, sexist and various vulgar comments in Trade chat... he's like 15 or some crap(friend of mine's boyfriend's sister is dating him apparently.. she tells me that he's *oh* so pleasant to be around irl too).. and yet, he keeps playing. Keeps spewing crap. He's been forum banned, but that's it.

12/06/2012 12:16 AMPosted by Likeadiamond
Is trolling illegal or against Blizzard rules??


Yes.

12/06/2012 12:40 AMPosted by Kuteness
Blizzard can't control the person behind the Computer for whatever choices they make its up to them.I had to deal with outburst of random insults from people all the time in the game.Most of them might have anger issues that they can't seem to control at times even I realize when I encounter some players who had a short fuse to insult someone for no reason.


No, they can't, but if I acted like this in any other social function, I'd have been thrown out. Ages ago.

Most normal people don't tolerate this in real life. Why on Earth it should be tolerated here as well is beyond me.
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