Is Shadow even worth it?

85 Blood Elf Hunter
3085
I've been running an alt as Shadow off spec Holy.. and since I got Chakra: Chastise, Holy DPS is So overpowered, I'm level 76 with Mind Seer and im even out DPSing Blood DKs as Holy.

My Shadow spec doesnt even compare, i've perfected the rotation and all. Does this balance out towards end game or wtf is going on?
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90 Troll Shaman
0
by that logic, hunters wouldn't be so poor in endgame content because they're so amazing at leveling content.

Basically: Shadow's awesome. Holy will absolutely NOT out DPS Shadow in any way.
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85 Blood Elf Hunter
3085
I'm hoping so because I really enjoy Shadow, i'll try again at 80+
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90 Orc Hunter
12620
Shadow dps is hybrid dps done right.

It's not underpowered and yet still does competitive damage against balanced pure dps.

Trust me shadow is doing great at 90, its just there seem to be not a lot of you. ;p
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85 Blood Elf Hunter
3085
Not saying my Shadow DPS isnt good, im saying Holy is sooo much better at this level atleast.. lol you have to play it to see what i'm talking about.

I believe after I unlock mastery the true dps spec will take over, thanks for the information
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90 Undead Priest
0
The problem with what you're doing right now is that mobs die in 5-10 seconds. Shadow DPS comes primarily from DoTs, which take 15-18 seconds to do their full duration damage.

Once you start attacking something that takes more than 30sec to kill you will find your Holy "DPS" to be a joke.
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1 Gnome Priest
0
Before 90, some healing specs and even tank specs are able to do more damage in PvP or PvE than ordinary DPS specs. When you get near 90, your damage relative to pure DPS specs will drop sharply.

Some specs remain semi-viable at 90, like shockadins (Holy Paladins that gear to DPS), but they will be behind the DPS specs.
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My Shadow Priest is L87, and from L85-7 she's been killing stuff by DoTing up everything in range and then just keeping PW:S up while maintaining DoTs and using procs. It's awesome, and the only of dying is from forgetting to keep PW:S up and hitting PoM every so often. Shadow is a very good spec from 85 on up.
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Soloing is still easier with Shadow than it is with Holy.

The buff to Chastise was nice, but you're still limited to mostly single target and you have to stand there and chain cast. When doing stuff like dailies as Shadow, you can multidot guys and burn them down all at once, which you can't really do as Holy.

And of course, in group content, Shadow is still much higher dps than Holy.
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90 Troll Priest
11525
Shadow dps is hybrid dps done right.

It's not underpowered and yet still does competitive damage against balanced pure dps.

Trust me shadow is doing great at 90, its just there seem to be not a lot of you. ;p


Shadow is a below-average DPS spec. Our single target is horrendous at the moment, but our DPS abilities with multiple targets or with adds + ToF hide a lot of the issues with the spec at the moment.

Blizz took until 5.1 to get their heads out of their asses and buff Mind Sear back to competitive damage, I'm hoping they buff Mind Blast and Mind Flay too so we can become competitive on single target fights.

There are a lot of Shadow Priests around too. Most of us spend our time on Howtopriest.com and not over here because of the amazing information that the Shadow theorycrafters discuss on the site.

With all of that being said, Shadow does provide some great utility at the moment. We have the ability to do what most other classes can utility-wise (mana regen, off healing, silences, ccs, etc) only slightly worse than every other DPS class who has maybe one or two of each of those - think Boomkins/Ele Shamans w/better off-healing (debatable), melee classes and mages have a better silence, etc.
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90 Blood Elf Priest
5620
Shadow dps is hybrid dps done right.

It's not underpowered and yet still does competitive damage against balanced pure dps.

Trust me shadow is doing great at 90, its just there seem to be not a lot of you. ;p


were doing great? i didn't get the memo....
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were doing great? i didn't get the memo....
Raidbots suggests (looking at all parses, 80th percentile, so not the best parses but good enough to assume decent player skill) that Shadow is low-median in normal content and high-median in heroic content. That suggests that 1) Shadow is doing just about what it should be doing, and 2) it has a high skill cap and takes some level of skill to get results from. This is reflected in its rank when you look at the 'top 100' parses, which is quite good.
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90 Human Monk
10330
Shadow is perfectly fine in PvE. They do competitive DPS while offering utility in the form of healing cooldowns and abilities like Halo.
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90 Troll Priest
14125
by that logic, hunters wouldn't be so poor in endgame content because they're so amazing at leveling content.

Basically: Shadow's awesome. Holy will absolutely NOT out DPS Shadow in any way.


holy currently can out dps shadow on pure single target fights like feng (reg, or doing shield last), vizier and bladelord. holy has a strong cooldown (PI+mindbender) which can be combined with procs/pots/skullbanner/bloodlust for significantly higher burst than shadow. holy also gets much, much more out of a stormlash totem than shadow.

holy has lower execute damage, due to not getting the double SW:D or the accelerated resource generation, but as long as your raid isn't all dead in execute range (and thus artificially emphasizing classes execute damage) you will still come out on top as holy dps.

of course, on any other fight where you can cheese twist of fate + SWDeath, holy dps is not comparable to shadow.
Edited by Snaxattax on 12/10/2012 4:38 PM PST
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90 Draenei Shaman
13665

were doing great? i didn't get the memo....
Raidbots suggests (looking at all parses, 80th percentile, so not the best parses but good enough to assume decent player skill) that Shadow is low-median in normal content and high-median in heroic content. That suggests that 1) Shadow is doing just about what it should be doing, and 2) it has a high skill cap and takes some level of skill to get results from. This is reflected in its rank when you look at the 'top 100' parses, which is quite good.


Keep in mind most classes have multiple dps trees. It doesn't matter if shadow is ahead of frost for example if no one actually specs frost because fire or arcane is better. There's not a lot of evidence to suggest it's particularly under-tuned, but it's middle of the pack at best.
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90 Blood Elf Priest
5620

were doing great? i didn't get the memo....
Raidbots suggests (looking at all parses, 80th percentile, so not the best parses but good enough to assume decent player skill) that Shadow is low-median in normal content and high-median in heroic content. That suggests that 1) Shadow is doing just about what it should be doing, and 2) it has a high skill cap and takes some level of skill to get results from. This is reflected in its rank when you look at the 'top 100' parses, which is quite good.


All the top 100s are people who got lucky procs which i can assure you does not happen often. Just for future reference top 100 is very unreliable for classes that have dependency on procs

12/09/2012 02:07 PMPosted by Monica
Shadow is perfectly fine in PvE. They do competitive DPS while offering utility in the form of healing cooldowns and abilities like Halo.


do you know how halo works? or how about the fact that Affiction(hell any warlock spec) offers health stones which heal for a lot more and are better overall have a spec that outdps us by almost 10k. Just another note, Priest use Halo for dps not for raid heals so if u need it for a pinch, chances are it wont be up.
Edited by Turmoyl on 12/11/2012 1:24 AM PST
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90 Pandaren Priest
10790
Shadow Priest damage on single target is just bad atm. Stop looking at overall parses and look at single target boss fights. We are towards the bottom on basically every single one right now. Like Nathyria said, other classes have other specs they can go to for DPS that are higher damage, SP do not have that luxury. We are stuck, as we dont have a secondary stat that jumps out at you right now as the one to go for (as in none that are much more significant than another), this is leading to lackluster DPS growths with gear upgrades compared to other classes. Not to mention our burst is awful, we have no real CD's to pop unless you spec into PI which would be a bad choice on most fights. Halo is a joke as its damage is so random because if you dont get to that sweet spot of 25 yards (which on some fights is very difficult) it is essentially useless. Basically we dont do enough burst, our t14 bonuses are awful, we have no CD's... but hey i guess we got mind sear buffed? I suppose that makes us "fine" in PvE.
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90 Human Priest
13990
To the OP: Shadow far outshines Holy DPS...

To the discussion that as come of it...

Shadow single target is really really sketchy/bad.

We even lose on some multi target fights like Wind lord and the like.

However, I think if our single target gets a buff, our multi target damage will go up sufficiently to put us on par with those who have insane cleave capability.
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