Mastery or Haste as Arcane?

80 Orc Death Knight
0
Well, I suppose the days of stacking crit and hoping for Pysoblast procs are over. I Reforged and re gemmed everything to haste thinking that'd be best for arcane. I'm just not happy with the DPS drop off though. It doesn't even compare to the DPS I was doing as fire. So maybe I'm doing it wrong. I tried scorch weaving and ABing.

Has there been a cycle and secondary stat deemed best for arcane yet? I really don't care about what's better for certain bosses and whatnot, because then the thread just gets trolly and confusing. On a single target, no movement, what's the best way to go? Any input would be much appreciated.

Enjoy DPSing with 2 fingers for the next few months.
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mastery is best.

i think people only stack into haste so they can play arcane and frost without having to regem and reforge.

it is more challenging to do good dps as arcane then it is fire btw.
Edited by Raw on 12/7/2012 8:54 PM PST
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100 Human Mage
15010
12/07/2012 08:53 PMPosted by Raw
mastery is best.

Mathematically haste is superior until high levels of haste (as well as frost armor being better than mage armor.) They're close enough though that you can play with mastery stacked without seeing much of a loss in DPS.
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90 Undead Mage
14685
Both www.wowreforge.com and Ask Mr Robot weights are the same for Arcane:

Crit - 1.67
Haste - 2.2
Mastery - 2.49

There is a haste cap you need to achieve which is 3056. I don't know what it is for, can only assume for an extra bomb tick.

So after you haste cap, mastery is valued at a better stat. I personally prefer Mastery as if you need to move even if it is only for a second or two, your mana will regen back to close to 300k.
If you stack haste and you need to move, any time spent moving while at 300k is wasted dps.

p.s. If you don't know, stacking haste also increases your mana regen.
p.s.s. If you are new to arcane, haste might be pointless for you as the casts / rotation might be too fast for you too keep up with.
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90 Blood Elf Mage
4445
i like haste > mastery
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90 Blood Elf Mage
5810
i used to play arcane when i first started playing mage back in Cata- Dragon soul
i dont know if it is still applicable now..

the reason there is a haste cap for arcane, is that when you time warp your cast for arcane blast will be one second... it the cast time is less than one second, it wont be beneficial...

go search in the net, there are tons of theory crafter on this issue
imho, hit cap -> haste cap -> mastery

cheers
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90 Human Mage
10625
going for haste cap would be pointless until higher ilvl can be achieved as arcane debuff doesnt reduce casting time nemore.

ive played around with both builds n I have felt like full mastery build pumped out more dps then haste build
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90 Human Warlock
0
Must have is the gem of max mana in your head enchant in cata that was good for 20k more on full stacks <5-11k on players> Depending on your talents but with recent patch taking the sting of arcane eating mana and watching your damage rollercoaster the extra 2% mana helps TONS anyhow . Mastery PURE mastery your an artillery piece in arcane spec not a run n gun fire or a burst frost you do OMG shots in steady succession with growing power thats what made them great and to me fun and easy your damage is steady and predictable :) Haste will only give you an extra tick or 2 on NT or missles , Casting ab faster sounds nice but eats mana making your damage plummet. Arcane is the nerd spec i call it fave spec too as for haste steal it from other players since SS wasnt nerfed in cost for arcane. I have Dungeon crawled through Cata heroics with full twinked Arcanes making my chaos bolts look like garbage with just AB or a missle clump also remember to USE Nether for bomb mastery only helps NT alot hit a ton of targets watch the comedy of them killing each other glyphed fireblast is handy for aoe as well.

But really ignore the ramble and remember Mastery = Increased damage by % when your mastery is past 50% in pvp you have essentialy nullified resil. Hitcap >-- Mastery >--- Int/spellpower for arcane its simple pure math if you wanna use freezes/talents crit to 25% then ALL mastery the entire point of arcane is Nuke cannon...some great youtube vids of arcanes just decimating bgs...although nothing beats the 10 destro event lol
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100 Blood Elf Mage
11840
They seem to be fairly close. Don't forget that haste regens a pretty decent chunk of mana. During lust it's kind of crazy how much regen I have. I don't have a lot of stats to play around with in this gear but haste seems to be doing a tiny bit more than mastery (frost armor, full haste reforge, lose about 20% mastery going to haste). Seems to be personal preference but there's also other advantages to going for haste that include being able to keep your arcane charge buff up with a shorter cast time if you have to move or whatever, and also a shorter cast time on rune of power if that is what you are using. Also a shorter gcd and more ticks for NT is nice as well. I think more testing will be needed, but I will be testing out a haste build for the week after going a few days with mastery.
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90 Human Warlock
0
For me the pure raw Damage is king dps meters said I would do meh but damage done was happy heh
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100 Human Mage
15010
The stat weights from ask mr robot and wow reforge we're taken from simc prior to 5.1. The buff to arcane actually put haste slightly ahead of mastery.
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90 Blood Elf Mage
12660
mastery is best.

Mathematically haste is superior until high levels of haste (as well as frost armor being better than mage armor.) They're close enough though that you can play with mastery stacked without seeing much of a loss in DPS.

There is no way 7% haste is better than 10% mastery, even if you're going with a haste build.
Edited by Yukiatsuruko on 12/8/2012 1:38 PM PST
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100 Gnome Mage
14220
12/08/2012 03:03 AMPosted by Halfawake
They seem to be fairly close. Don't forget that haste regens a pretty decent chunk of mana. During lust it's kind of crazy how much regen I have. I don't have a lot of stats to play around with in this gear but haste seems to be doing a tiny bit more than mastery (frost armor, full haste reforge, lose about 20% mastery going to haste). Seems to be personal preference but there's also other advantages to going for haste that include being able to keep your arcane charge buff up with a shorter cast time if you have to move or whatever, and also a shorter cast time on rune of power if that is what you are using. Also a shorter gcd and more ticks for NT is nice as well. I think more testing will be needed, but I will be testing out a haste build for the week after going a few days with mastery.


My understanding is that the added regen from more haste is essentially nullified by the fact that you are now casting more spells in the same amount of time. Is this incorrect?
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90 Orc Mage
11910
I was told haste doesn't scale well thus the higher haste you have eventually devalues and the more valuable mastery becomes.

This kind of reminds me of diminishing marginal returns, lol.
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91 Blood Elf Mage
6155
12/08/2012 01:38 PMPosted by Yukiatsuruko

Mathematically haste is superior until high levels of haste (as well as frost armor being better than mage armor.) They're close enough though that you can play with mastery stacked without seeing much of a loss in DPS.

There is no way 7% haste is better than 10% mastery, even if you're going with a haste build.


So sick of reading this. 7% haste does not = 7% mastery does not =7% crit. All these stats scale differently, which is why the armors have different values. 7% haste is roughly 3k haste. 5% crit is roughly 3k crit. 10% mastery is roughly 3k mastery.
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