What 90% casual Mistweaver can heal?

100 Pandaren Monk
10220
I believe that only 10% of Mistweaver have item level > 490. They can still top the meter after the great nerf in patch 5.1 and hot fix.

However, the other 90% Mistweaver don have such good gear, we have work to do, just a casual raider, sometime can't even run a raid per week. We cannot gain as much experience as the hard core Mistweaver to become skillful in healing.

I believe most of the subscribers of WoW are not hard core, but casual raider take the most. Bliz, u should always consider the prob of the majority, don make Mstweaver too hard to heal in raid, of course, don make Mistweaver too easy to heal like in patch 5.0 which is really a joke.

Even the hardcore Mistweavers like Mist (who had written a very constructive post on Mistweaver state) also face the prob, how about me and other casual Mistweaver, pls take care of us. We can't spend so much time to train our healing, we need to work and to pay for the subscription. We play game for fun. Mistweaver is the best and fun healers before the great nerf in hot fix patch 5.1. We can fistweave and mistweave pre-nerf. Now, we can't do like that. Are u really want us to give up and play other class? Or u want us to say bye bye to WoW?

Honestly, WoW is the best MMORPG I have ever played as Bliz u really work hard to meet the needs of us.

Please don nerf us so hard, please take a look on casual Mistweaver.

Any casual Mistweaver pls post ur prob face during healing, let Bliz know what the prob we faced, I believe Bliz will do their best to solve our prob.

My main prob is the great mana inc, I can't do well in AOE healing while raiding in MSV, HOF is worse. SCK use so much mana, uplift din heal much as rm nerf. EM nerf so much, I can't heal tank effectively.

In my guild, we have 3 healers, but all is casual, not that skillful. We try many weeks, can just down stoneguard only.
Edited by Xiongxiong on 12/9/2012 5:51 AM PST
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
8850
http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-ktg7tq6ehp6lnwh4/sum/healingDone/?s=5771&e=6176
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90 Blood Elf Priest
6590
http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-ktg7tq6ehp6lnwh4/sum/healingDone/?s=5771&e=6176


He has a 496 weapon and garalon is a fight that caters to mistweavers. They are in a fairly clunky place atm. No one doubts they can put out good numbers. It's just they have to work 3x as hard as most other healers.
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100 Pandaren Monk
10220
I have stated casual Mistweaver, not hardcore. Casual mean item level around 463 to 480, they mostly equip only blue gears from H dungeon.

Brewza has almost full set of epic gears except bracer and trinket.

Brewza has finish MV normal and HOF normal, he is absolutely not casual raider.

If u want to post log, post the casual raider who din even done MV normal like me, only 1/6

And for log, Bliz have all logs, we actually don need to post to them, they already known.

What they don know is the voice from players. If we just keep our mouth shut, buff will be slowly happened.
Edited by Xiongxiong on 12/9/2012 6:21 AM PST
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100 Pandaren Monk
10220
Saih,

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-ktg7tq6ehp6lnwh4/sum/healingDone/?s=5771&e=6176


http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-ktg7tq6ehp6lnwh4/sum/healingDone/?s=2961&e=3309

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-ktg7tq6ehp6lnwh4/sum/healingDone/?s=3758&e=4160

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-ktg7tq6ehp6lnwh4/sum/healingDone/?s=7068&e=7497

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-ktg7tq6ehp6lnwh4/sum/healingDone/?s=8374&e=8820

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-ktg7tq6ehp6lnwh4/sum/healingDone/?s=13325&e=13839

Brewza HPS is lower than u, Saih, in all these fight, he only better than u in ONE fight only!

These logs have proved that Mistweaver is not that good in HOF, only op in Garalon.
Edited by Xiongxiong on 12/9/2012 6:51 AM PST
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90 Troll Shaman
13250
A class is based off the playstlye of the most elite players otherwise things get out of wack quickly and class stacking becomes and issue.

Normal modes are tuned for 470-80 gear or so which is plenty for the content.
Edited by Harpoa on 12/9/2012 6:57 AM PST
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90 Blood Elf Priest
6590
12/09/2012 06:55 AMPosted by Harpoa
A class is based off the playstlye of the most elite players otherwise things get out of wack quickly and class stacking becomes and issue.


Yes but making anything below that elite playstyle subpar is not okay. the mistweaver skill curve is incredibly steep.

with the top players being amazing and anyone who doesn't play 100% 100% of the time and messes up even a little becoming horrible.
Edited by Keirisonis on 12/9/2012 7:07 AM PST
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90 Troll Shaman
13250
12/09/2012 07:06 AMPosted by Keirisonis
Yes but making anything below that elite playstyle subpar is not okay


So should it be based around the 50th percentile and reward poor play?

How do you then tune encounters to not be steamrolled on day 1?

And i no way am i trying to argue one way or the other with class balance, as that is for the devs to figure out. Just overall game design.
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100 Pandaren Monk
10220
A class is based off the playstlye of the most elite players otherwise things get out of wack quickly and class stacking becomes and issue.

Normal modes are tuned for 470-80 gear or so which is plenty for the content.


I agreed. I always look for help from the elite players. They play the best.
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90 Blood Elf Priest
7695
I hear what you're saying dude but I kinda feel like the only way the could make it easier would be to dumb it down a lot.. I think its nice to have a harder healing class for even the casuals that wanna play something a little gear dep/skill capped. We already have plenty of easy mode classes so why not leave one that requires more skill or feels like it rewards gear upgrades to a greater degree?
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100 Pandaren Monk
10220
Most ppl like to top the meters. Ppl like to compare. Bliz will never make a class always top the meter or always at the bottom, they will tune over time so that they earn more money and attract more ppl to play the game. A game is to satisfy our cravenness in winning as in real world, to win is hard, but in game, it is much easier.

If we always lose in a game, we will give up. If we always win the game, we will give up too as it is boring. Only always lose and win is EXCITING. That's why Bliz always nerf and buff class so that most ppl continue to play WoW.
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90 Blood Elf Priest
6590
So should it be based around the 50th percentile and reward poor play?

How do you then tune encounters to not be steamrolled on day 1?

And i no way am i trying to argue one way or the other with class balance, as that is for the devs to figure out. Just overall game design.


By rewarding stellar play without making casuals suffer needlessly. A good example is a paladin. You can do a mediocre to decent job without being a pro, but only the best paladins can work every tool they have.

That way, if you're still learning, you aren't looking like an absolute fool, but improvement is still helpful. Every other class isn't punished quite as severely for having bad gear/not playing perfectly.

I'm not saying that i know how to do the dev's job. I can honestly say i don't. But anyone can tell the current class model is not okay.
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100 Pandaren Monk
10220
12/09/2012 07:19 AMPosted by Lynks
I hear what you're saying dude but I kinda feel like the only way the could make it easier would be to dumb it down a lot.. I think its nice to have a harder healing class for even the casuals that wanna play something a little gear dep/skill capped. We already have plenty of easy mode classes so why not leave one that requires more skill or feels like it rewards gear upgrades to a greater degree?


I agreed what u say. I like challenging but not most ppl play game for challenging, but just for fun. In patch 5.0, Mistweaver is the most fun healer compare to other class healers, but now, Bliz take one of the great fun from it.
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90 Human Monk
12335
You've logged out in your dps gear so I couldn't look at your gear. My own gear was substantially lower when the nerfs hit, I had i463 gloves, helm, shoulders, chest and trinket in addition to the rep/lfr items I'm wearing now - I only got the epics I'm now wearing in those slots in the past 1-1.5 weeks.

My recollection of events goes something like this:

pre-nerf:
- I decided to have another crack at changing from my shaman to my monk for raids, I cast renewing mists on cooldown, sck a fair bit, used tft / chi brew and cast a of of uplifts and did a ton of raid healing without even playing well or knowing the class very well

- first nerf: uplift and EM did less, and I suddenly had a ton of mana, so changed all my gems from spirit to int and swapped in an int trinket instead of spirit. not as much raid healing, but still plenty

- next nerf: whoah where'd my mana go! swapped gems and trinket back to spirit, hardly ever use sck, had a bit of mana problems but not too bad if I was careful - then got a bunch of upgrades last week via LFR, main raid + extra rolls and crafted. I still don't sck much, all I've basically been doing is casting renewing mists on cooldown, using uplift a lot, my level 30 chi dump a little here and there and building most of my chi with soothing mists, using some of it with EM where warranted. Not really having mana issues now thanks to the spirit boost from upgrades, and raid healing is pretty good. I do feel a bit weak in the cooldown department (actually swapped back to my shaman for our heroic garajal kill just to be sure we had the healing throughout cooldowns available, but as it turned out it would've been fine with my monk)

I realise my gear is a little higher than you're describing now, but even before I got those upgrades it wasn't as bad as you're suggesting, at least not for me. I raid a lot more than you, but am far from being a brilliant player - lazy player would better describe me

As I said, I can't see your gear and maybe even a week ago when I had all those blues I could've been in a better spot than you gear-wise, but it's hard to believe it's as bad as you're saying
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85 Human Priest
15225
I'm sorry you get so many teenagers (or those who aspire to be like them) replying to your post thinking they are cute or witty, posting utterly inane things. Alas, it is pretty much common place on these forums.

But really, it does seem this class was balanced for those players who wear the top quality gear. From what I see, you need around 15k in combat regen in a fight to be able to really get back into a good place and be able to heal a fight well without relying entirely on poor mechanics like Healing Orb/Chi Torpedo.

I believe these nerfs were knee jerk reactions, not fully tested. Blizzard has stated before they like to wait things out, allow the players to find their own solutions to issues, make changes gradually. This is clearly not the case and reminds me a lot of Burning Crusade class changes that regularly updated classes the class developer and his girlfriend played.

However, I also don't believe monks are going to be buffed any time soon. There may be some minor buffs 4 months down the line, but what we are now is what we are going to stay sadly.

Your options are to leave the game, create a new character, or to stick out being a poor healer until gear becomes obtainable enough that you are again balanced enough to compete.

Most monks seem to be taking the second option but a few are taking the final.
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90 Blood Elf Monk
10810
Xiong -

We can still both Fistweave and Mistweave, we just can't be as reckless with either one as we could prior to the changes.

Learn how (and when) to use Healing Sphere, though don't lean on it, because it's probably going to get nerfed. Battlegrounds are an excellent place to practice your touch, so to speak.

I also recommend Fistweaving in only a limited fashion at lower gear levels. Just enough to do a Blackout Kick once every 25s or so (it's 30s actually, but I tend to refresh it sooner), and just auto-attack. I use Jab, if necessary, to maintain that buff, but that's about the only time I do. If I need Chi right now though, I won't hesitate to Jab for it, but if I play correctly, that generally isn't a need.

Otherwise, I keep ReM on CD, and use a combination of Soothing Mist, Healing Sphere, Uplift, Torpedo, and my Chi dump for heals. I do use Surging Mist somewhat frequently as well, though that depends more on group quality than my own spell selection tendencies. Also, don't forget about Thunder Focus Tea.

Once you get these things down, you can start to stretch into the more complicated ways of playing a Mistweaver, though it isn't even really necessary to do so. That's your choice to make, when the time comes.

As far as your group's progression goes, there are many factors that go into that, most of which don't really have anything to do with you personally. The overall skill and coordination of your raid group as a whole is largely what determines whether or not you kill bosses, not the classes present.

I posted this on my monk, so you can eyeball my gear level, if you like. I have some good pieces, but I wouldn't consider my gear to be *good,* since I am missing 2/5 of the most important pieces (head and weapon).

'mêss
Edited by Hawtmêss on 12/9/2012 10:26 AM PST
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90 Blood Elf Monk
10810
12/09/2012 09:48 AMPosted by Nimbis
But really, it does seem this class was balanced for those players who wear the top quality gear. From what I see, you need around 15k in combat regen in a fight to be able to really get back into a good place and be able to heal a fight well without relying entirely on poor mechanics like Healing Orb/Chi Torpedo.


Sorry for the back-to-back posts, but I can't let this go by - your first sentence is true (and it's necessary), but the rest of the paragraph is patently false.

'mêss
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96 Tauren Monk
16945
We'll be seeing 5.2 hit the PTR fairly soon. I don't think we'll have to wait too long to see changes made to the class. GC admitted that Mistweaver is really difficult to balance and they haven't done so yet.

So. We'll see. I've got my shaman on the backburner in case they don't do anything to make MW fun again in 5.2. I can easily do all of current content as a MW but I can't say I'm having fun with how the class plays anymore.
Edited by Mist on 12/9/2012 10:31 AM PST
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