Unholy Death Knights: Post your numbers here

90 Worgen Death Knight
16910
Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, is it not?

Inspired by Lhivera’s numbers thread dedicated to Fire Mage numbers in 5.1, I’ve decided it’s time for Unholy Death Knights to showcase some of their parses in raid content.

There’s been a great deal of debate within the Death Knight community as to how strong Unholy truly is, and why it isn’t seeing nearly as much representation in T-14 content compared to Frost.
While there’s been plenty of conjecture as to the reasons behind this (i.e. comparing Unholy’s mechanics versus those of Frost), I feel we’d still be served well by some actual log data of spec performance in raids.

Below, I’m asking Unholy Death Knights to post recent parses of successful boss kills. It might even be beneficial to post logs that have you competing with a Frost Death Knight for a numbers comparison of the two specs.

Things to take into account when posting:

*Gear/Upgrades. What weapon were you using? What is your average item level? Did you attain significant upgrades between the parses you’ve posted?

*Gear differences. If you’re trying to compare your performance to that of another Death Knight’s, account for gearing differences between the two of you.

*It might also help to post logs from several weeks ago and compare how your numbers have improved (if at all) since then.

Come one and all!

P.S. Please lets not turn this into a thread that debates flaws/issues we may see in the spec- there’s plenty of time for that later.
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90 Human Death Knight
14215
Not going to get very much back on this. Unholy representation in heroic raids is abysmal. There are several fights in 10 man with less than 10 unholy dks on WoL.

Even if frost and unholy are essentially equal, Blizzard screwed unholy by giving frost a 3-4% gain from the tier 2 piece over unholy (frost strike+obliterate are 60% or more of a frost dk's damage, while scourge strike is maybe 25% for unholy).

I do relatively okay in my raids, but I really can't know how well I'm doing since I'm stuck with a blue weapon still after 7 elegon and 3 sha kills (all with coins used--not even counting lfr).

This is my log from Wednesday where I rank in the top 100 on most fights as unholy: http://worldoflogs.com/reports/ki61uhm1v8eznzxl. But I certainly didn't do anything special and a similar rank for frost is 20-30k higher (but a lot of that is simply gear, there's way more better geared frost dks atm).
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90 Draenei Shaman
4790
Yep, nobody plays unholy.

Sims predict it's only 5% behind frost on single targets, but it's such a complete pain in the butt to play, with its punishingly long rampup, no mobility, weak cleave, terrible AE, and no burst, that nobody wants to use it. I personally would only spec unholy if it was overwhelmingly superior to frost.

There are no real fights that play to Unholy's strengths, either. It somehow even loses out on fights with important execute phases like Elegon, although that is probably at least partially sample bias.

I see that you asked us not to turn this into a discussion about Unholy's flaws, so I feel bad about even going this far and I'll stop talking here.

Edit: Actually I was wrong, Unholy does extremely well on Elegon, there just aren't enough samples to show up in 10man, even though it's highly performant in that particular fight. My guess is that most players choose Blood for their offspec as it is more frequently useful rather than speccing Unholy for the 1-2 execute or sustained AE encounters per tier where Unholy outperforms Frost.
Edited by Slant on 12/7/2012 2:42 PM PST
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90 Worgen Death Knight
16910
12/07/2012 02:18 PMPosted by Nellise
Not going to get very much back on this. Unholy representation in heroic raids is abysmal.


Remember, numbers for Frost Death Knighs are also valuable if they can be compared in conjunction with that of an Unholy Death Knight's.

Slant, we'll definitely have time to discuss the spec itself in due course- probably in an adjunct thread I'll create once we get some more parses. For now, I encourage you to put up any you currently have access to.
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90 Worgen Death Knight
16910
Here's a sample log I'd like to provide: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/bdb00wzvugbrmrr7/sum/damageDone/?s=9045&e=9393

Heroic Wind Lord Mel'jarak 25 kill. Crones is Unholy and using a 502 Starshatter compared to my 496 1hers as DW Frost (keep in mind though, that I'm using a Sha Touched weapon with the gem).
He has a 498 equipped ilvl, compared to my 496- the biggest difference is probably our bracers, but that's about it.
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90 Human Death Knight
13165
I do find it funny ranking in at fight no matter how poorly I do, or even if I died, simply because I am unholy.

However, at this point, unholy dks and dks in general have thrown so much data, suggested so many things, gone blue in the face, that at this point nothing will change.

We tell them our ramp up is horrible.

They give us more strength.

We tell them we have a harder time maintaining diseases than frost. We get.. oh hell I don't think they cared about that concern.

Its obvious the DK class lead is more concerned about keeping pvp mages and blood tanks happy than making the class have 3 viable trees.

And if youre reading this mr dk class lead, prove me wrong. I dare you.
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90 Worgen Death Knight
16910
I do find it funny ranking in at fight no matter how poorly I do, or even if I died, simply because I am unholy.

However, at this point, unholy dks and dks in general have thrown so much data, suggested so many things, gone blue in the face, that at this point nothing will change.

We tell them our ramp up is horrible.

They give us more strength.

We tell them we have a harder time maintaining diseases than frost. We get.. oh hell I don't think they cared about that concern.

Its obvious the DK class lead is more concerned about keeping pvp mages and blood tanks happy than making the class have 3 viable trees.

And if youre reading this mr dk class lead, prove me wrong. I dare you.


This is neither helpful, nor remotely connected to what this thread asks for. I intend to create a separate thread discussing Unholy's mechanics- when I feel we have enough player provided parses.
Please don't slow down that process.
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90 Human Death Knight
13165
Ok then. Here are 2 of my unholy 25 and 10 man normal parses with a 488 ilvl and a 484 starshatter:

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-6joa0sl2u9py03g1/sum/damageDone/?s=2236&e=2672#Dreagan

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-fsm7nyw2o6thcdi9/sum/damageDone/?s=1304&e=1639#Dreagan
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90 Orc Death Knight
13765
http://worldoflogs.com/guilds/222328/

Have been Unholy for the majority of my past 3 weeks logs. Unfortunately we're lacking a second DK atm, so I can't do a direct comparison.

I'm using a 502/510 Starshatter, average ilevel is 499 I believe. Rocking around 7660 haste.
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90 Worgen Death Knight
16910
Here's our first EU DK parse:

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-jfzwxopikp9qplxl/sum/damageDone/?s=1179&e=1507#Jarg

Quoting him:

Rank 13 on feng 25 normal with lfr weapon and 4 normal level items (everything else below that, had chest/legs/gloves/rep ring). Number 2 on the log is a 2h frost dk with much better gear
Edited by Magdalena on 12/8/2012 8:53 AM PST
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90 Orc Death Knight
17020
Here are a few good fights that I had this week.

Elegon 25n
http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/0qkd1ww5u04ydkv9/sum/damageDone/?s=10168&e=10646

(489 ilvl with 489 starshatter at the time vs frost dk with 490 ilvl with 489/476 weapon setup. I had 2 piece, he doesn't.)

Elegon 25n from 3 weeks ago (20k dps improvement from top 2, don't remember gear setup)
http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/uf2adoo4tbj86l98/sum/damageDone/?s=6785&e=7312

Empress 25 first kill
http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/0qkd1ww5u04ydkv9/sum/damageDone/?s=2387&e=2960
(see gear from above)

Spirit Kings 25n
http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/0qkd1ww5u04ydkv9/sum/damageDone/?s=8645&e=9056

(see gear from above)

Feng 25 heroic first kill
http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/0qkd1ww5u04ydkv9/sum/damageDone/?s=6872&e=7351
(my gear is the same, other frost dk has same ilvl, weapon setup 489/476 vs my 489.Both have 2 piece.)

Think this is all I have for now.
Edited by Nangz on 12/8/2012 9:37 AM PST
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90 Undead Death Knight
8890
Heh, can this thread survive long enough to collect all the information needed?
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80 Human Priest
3225
12/10/2012 05:38 PMPosted by Skaven
Heh, can this thread survive long enough to collect all the information needed?


Nope
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90 Orc Death Knight
12740
These parses are older and I've had to go frost due to the sha not dropping the axe. If the axe drops and this thread is still going, ill post my unholy numbers with a sha weapon.

http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w2t9r7w3i9ijifah/sum/damageDone/

http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-1f1gf2ewfdofs6is/sum/damageDone/

http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-2o2jibvlasya58gs/sum/damageDone/

My ilvl for all those attempts was 492-494, using a 489 starshatter that I upgraded to 497 (the top link has the 497 starshatter, the other 2 links are the 489 version). Also, the comment about unholy having bad AoE is not true at all. Unholy's sustained AoE is phenomenal.
Edited by Rothulean on 12/10/2012 10:19 PM PST
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90 Worgen Death Knight
16910
Here's another EU log provided by Aoha: http://worldoflogs.com/reports/y2iy8erq3s26juu6/analyze/dd/source/?s=11118&e=11322

This dates back to roughly a month and a half ago, with an average ilvl of 480 and a normal Starshatter being used.

Could I also repeat my request for people who have nothing useful to contribute to please find another thread to troll?
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90 Orc Death Knight
16140
http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-4uwwvmep0yhzgbrp/sum/damageDone/?s=2902&e=3188#Semmi

Spiritbinder Garajal 25 man heroic. Done on the day 5.1 came out (11/27). 4 piece used with a 504 (496 upgraded twice) Shin'ka axe, with the 500 strength gem. Overall ilevel for this I believe was 497. I basically took the role of a multi-DoT class going into the spirit realm. I had Symbiosis from a Druid, and proceeded to abuse plague shrooms to spread diseases to as many adds as possible, while running around with Unholy Blight to spread even more diseases.

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-qr4tg4pns3uksihb/sum/damageDone/?s=8631&e=9239

Spirit Kings 25 man heroic, done 11/15. 4 piece used with a 489 Starshatter. IIRC my ilevel was about 495. I attacked from behind on Qiang and only moved in front when he was about to swing (I got the rhythm down on his swing timer).

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-qr4tg4pns3uksihb/sum/damageDone/?s=12763&e=13254

Elegon 25 man heroic, done 11/15 with the exact same gear setup as Spirit Kings. Roiling Blood was used here to spread diseases onto as many adds throughout the fight as possible (inflated numbers since those orbs continue to take damage after dying).

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1u5gl6s5y2hx26u/sum/damageDone/?s=48&e=507

Protectors of the Endless 25 man normal elite mode, done on 11/20. This was done with a 496 ilevel and heroic Starshatter. No padding was done with diseases.

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1u5gl6s5y2hx26u/sum/damageDone/?s=1617&e=2025

Tsulong 25 man normal, same day, same gear. Target switching (or opening on new targets as often as you have to) is absolutely horrible on this fight for Unholy.

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1u5gl6s5y2hx26u/sum/damageDone/?s=9568&e=9949

Garalon 25 man normal, same day, same gear. Mainly stuck on his body, only hitting the legs with diseases from Unholy Blight or plague shrooms from Symbiosis.

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1u5gl6s5y2hx26u/sum/damageDone/?s=10807&e=11255

Wind Lord 25 man normal, same day, same gear. Plague shrooms were used for initial AoE disease application as a replacement for Unholy Blight, as I had taken Roiling Blood.

The recurring issue I seem to be having is that I can't drop Unholy Blight all that often for Roiling Blood without getting Symbiosis to use plague shrooms as a UB replacement (similarly, I use Unholy Blight often as a second Outbreak) due to how bad Unholy is with target switching, though my numbers manage well enough.
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90 Night Elf Death Knight
20525
moral of the story, should outbreak be buffed( ie lower CD ), or the glyph of outbreak not be so punishing with runic power cost.

thoughts?
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90 Orc Death Knight
12740
Or give Unholy DKs disease swap.
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90 Worgen Death Knight
16910
12/11/2012 10:54 PMPosted by Sostra
moral of the story, should outbreak be buffed( ie lower CD ), or the glyph of outbreak not be so punishing with runic power cost.


I'll be starting a separate thread for recommendations once we get a few more logs.
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90 Night Elf Death Knight
20525
12/11/2012 11:51 PMPosted by Magdalena
moral of the story, should outbreak be buffed( ie lower CD ), or the glyph of outbreak not be so punishing with runic power cost.


I'll be starting a separate thread for recommendations once we get a few more logs.


could always get a little out there with ideas and have summoned minions have a 20 sec CD " vile spew " which does an aoe attack like bloodboil which also spreads diseases around the pet.

or a targetted aoe like D&D that spews diseases into a targetted location.

or make D&D also place diseases on targets inside.

or make outbreak aoe diseases with a glyph.

or have desecrated ground also apply diseases to targets inside it.

theres a million ways to help disease application. blizz putting anything into action is the only hard part. coming up with ideas is the easy part.
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