i am sick of class bias, blizzard.

1 Blood Elf Paladin
0
for the record, i main a paladin, ret main spec, prot off spec.

when cata launched, ret was in a pretty terrible state. our mastery sucked. it took FOREVER for you to fix it. it didnt even become "normal" till firelands/ds.

and now, in one day of complaints, fire mages get buffs.

now dont get me wrong, im happy you reverted the critical mass nerfs which were uncalled for. but where were you devs when the qq on the paladin forums was everywhere? I was a weak link in my raids for quite some time until you fixed rets mastery.

basically my question is, why are you so quick to change things now, when other classes who have begged for changes, have been ignored? im talking about the rogues, the monks, and others.

why are you so quick to fix mages, yet ignore other class balance issues? this isnt fair.
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90 Troll Mage
15205
Or maybe the blizzard happened to agree with the complaints from an objective standpoint.

Please note I am not saying they did, just that its a possibility a person should consider before getting upset with a person/group.

It could be that they thought they overnerfed after looking at the difference and decided to increase it just a bit.

Its very possible that they were happy with how pallies were.

many mages would point to the lvl 90 talents they have as a reason that blizzard isn't biased towards them as they wouldn't put something that they think is terrible (I love the lvl 90 talents).

Once again i am not saying any of this is true just thats is a possibility before you go on about how blizzard is out to get everyone but mages.
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90 Pandaren Monk
18100
Fire was overnerfed that was obvious. I'm still waiting for them to just slap the CD on pyro like they were going to before. That way fire can scale as much as it wants without suddenly hitting the RNG jackpot and leading the fight by 20%.
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90 Blood Elf Mage
11670
basically my question is, why are you so quick to change things now, when other classes who have begged for changes, have been ignored? im talking about the rogues, the monks, and others.

why are you so quick to fix mages, yet ignore other class balance issues? this isnt fair.

Remember Cata, when Fire mages went unfixed for two whole raid tiers, with mages feeling forced to spec into Arcane? (which wasn't all that awesome, a bit above average is all. The other two specs were just so bad.) That's why they did this. Kinda disproves your notion of "so quick to fix mages", too. And they didn't revert the nerf, they just made it marginally less harsh.
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90 Blood Elf Mage
6075
why are you so quick to fix mages, yet ignore other class balance issues? this isnt fair.


We were hit with a massive nerf mid progression mid raid week.
If fire was lagging behind the whole time, fine. Just like frost.
But modifying a spec that hard in a hotfix in the middle of progression is rough to say the least.
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90 Human Paladin
14125
You see, this is how it went down for Paladins.

http://www.nerfnow.com/comic/image/828
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12/10/2012 10:01 PMPosted by Warping
why are you so quick to fix mages, yet ignore other class balance issues? this isnt fair.


We were hit with a massive nerf mid progression mid raid week.
If fire was lagging behind the whole time, fine. Just like frost.
But modifying a spec that hard in a hotfix in the middle of progression is rough to say the least.


WAaaaaahhhhhhh. Other classes get hot-fix !@#$% slapped mid-week/mid-progression and usually have to deal with it staying that way for months, if not longer. Why is it that mages are treated with kid gloves? Explain how it is that frost continues to dodge the nerfbat in pvp and instead their ridiculous control & survival tools get moved baseline? Why is it that every attempt made by Blizz to address balance problems with mages immediately get reverted when the qq storms hit?
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90 Blood Elf Mage
11670
WAaaaaahhhhhhh. Other classes get hot-fix !@#$% slapped mid-week/mid-progression and usually have to deal with it staying that way for months, if not longer. Why is it that mages are treated with kid gloves?

Except when they aren't? The selective memory on these boards is, as always, fascinating.
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100 Dwarf Hunter
17105
12/10/2012 10:01 PMPosted by Warping
why are you so quick to fix mages, yet ignore other class balance issues? this isnt fair.


We were hit with a massive nerf mid progression mid raid week.
If fire was lagging behind the whole time, fine. Just like frost.
But modifying a spec that hard in a hotfix in the middle of progression is rough to say the least.


But something had to be done leading the pack by 20% even on fights not designed to play at your strengths was kinda ridiculous
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90 Blood Elf Mage
6075


We were hit with a massive nerf mid progression mid raid week.
If fire was lagging behind the whole time, fine. Just like frost.
But modifying a spec that hard in a hotfix in the middle of progression is rough to say the least.


WAaaaaahhhhhhh. Other classes get hot-fix !@#$% slapped mid-week/mid-progression and usually have to deal with it staying that way for months, if not longer. Why is it that mages are treated with kid gloves? Explain how it is that frost continues to dodge the nerfbat in pvp and instead their ridiculous control & survival tools get moved baseline? Why is it that every attempt made by Blizz to address balance problems with mages immediately get reverted when the qq storms hit?


Why did you bother with that post?
It didn't accomplish much apart from making you out to be a douche.
Or are you illiterate?
Or just plain trolling?
Or just plain bad?

We were hit with a massive nerf mid progression mid raid week.
If fire was lagging behind the whole time, fine. Just like frost.
But modifying a spec that hard in a hotfix in the middle of progression is rough to say the least.


Note the part where I refer to the severity of a nerf.

Oh and your hyperbole about us not getting nerfed is funny.
I took that into consideration when I made this post.
I like people with humor.

But something had to be done leading the pack by 20% even on fights not designed to play at your strengths was kinda ridiculous

Give me one fight, in this tier (You can even include top 100 parses) where we have out DPS-ed the next contender by 20% in a non cleave fight.
You won't find any.

Combat rogues were ahead of fire mages pre 5.1 mistake buff.
Affliction warlocks were only marginally behind fire pre 5.1 overall.
Edited by Warping on 12/10/2012 10:36 PM PST
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100 Undead Mage
9315
Explain how it is that frost continues to dodge the nerfbat in pvp and instead their ridiculous control & survival tools get moved baseline?


You do realize that over half of the roots and control that Frost had was removed in 5.0, right? And that the only thing that wasn't baseline before, that is baseline now is Deep Freeze (seriously, what Arcane or Fire PvPer didn't take shatter?) right?

So how bout actually being realisitic with your rage, focus on reality.
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90 Human Monk
10330
This isn't entirely accurate. It isn't like Blizzard was quick to "fix" a broken spec; Rather, they haphazardly installed a severe nerf mid-tier, without extensive testing. Imagine logging onto your character and seeing a significant reduction in your primary stat, and your main cooldown cut by half. If anything, mages got a raw deal. (Note: Fire needed a nerf, but they went about it poorly).

This is actually a good action. It is a very, very slight reduction of the nerf that fire received. It won't make fire #1 again. It won't make it OP. It will lessen the significance of the crit nerf slightly, though. Blizzard even said that they'd be watching fire and adjust accordingly. This action was expected.
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100 Orc Shaman
13430
You see, this is how it went down for Paladins.

http://www.nerfnow.com/comic/image/828


TO

THE

GROUND!!!
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72 Blood Elf Monk
5865
hehe anyways they did the same mistake for our mastery us WW monks are still awaiting a change into our masteries :D
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90 Worgen Warrior
10150
12/10/2012 10:01 PMPosted by Warping
why are you so quick to fix mages, yet ignore other class balance issues? this isnt fair.


We were hit with a massive nerf mid progression mid raid week.
If fire was lagging behind the whole time, fine. Just like frost.
But modifying a spec that hard in a hotfix in the middle of progression is rough to say the least.


I think the best response would be that the buff is almost nonexistant. I mean is it not only .05 %? From 1.25 to 1.30? I am not really sure what this part of the buff signifies...the number is almost irrelevant. I suspect further buffs to fire will be coming down unless gear scaling further corrects this. I dont think the timing of the nerf is all that concerning, given that ret paladins were similarly hotfix nerfed in Cata when Gurtharak tentacles were found to be putting out too much damage. That was an equally harsh, if not worse nerf for rets...done via hotfix...so the timing is really insignificant, unless you consider the mage class above the same level of treatment that other classes have received. I cannot tell you how many times I respecced my hunter in wrath and cata as they tinkered with survival and MM.

I also do not recall any mages complaining in Cata when they buffed fire up amazingly and people respecced and reforged to go from Arcane to Fire....I guess it is only a problem when the reforging and respeccing occurs because of a nerf to the FOTM spec and forces people to go to a less favorable spec. Funny how that works.
Edited by Oaklander on 12/11/2012 1:58 PM PST
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90 Blood Elf Mage
6075
That was an equally harsh, if not worse nerf for rets...done via hotfix...so the timing is really insignificant, unless you consider the mage class above the same level of treatment that other classes have received. I cannot tell you how many times I respecced my hunter in wrath and cata as they tinkered with survival and MM.

I also do not recall any mages complaining in Cata when they buffed fire up amazingly and people respecced and reforged to go from Arcane to Fire....I guess it is only a problem when the reforging and respeccing occurs because of a nerf to the FOTM spec and forces people to go to a less favorable spec. Funny how that works.


It wasn't as significant percentage DPS loss wise.
Mages didn't complain about switching from arcane to fire because arcane was mind numbingly boring.
Gear wise; the changes happened over a new tier, so it was fairly easy to gear for fire.

I guess, you shouldn't make assertions and throw FOTM out when talking about raiding or even PVP for that matter.
Or post on alts.
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100 Human Paladin
9930
You see, this is how it went down for Paladins.

http://www.nerfnow.com/comic/image/828


Hmmm... That must have been Ghostcrawler with the "To Do List"
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100 Human Paladin
9930
12/10/2012 10:39 PMPosted by Monica
This isn't entirely accurate. It isn't like Blizzard was quick to "fix" a broken spec; Rather, they haphazardly installed a severe nerf mid-tier, without extensive testing. Imagine logging onto your character and seeing a significant reduction in your primary stat, and your main cooldown cut by half. If anything, mages got a raw deal. (Note: Fire needed a nerf, but they went about it poorly).


It did happen, I logged on after installing Cata and Paladins were almost unplayable. And we stayed that way for most on the expac. Why did it not get fixed in a timely manner? Because the devs have Paladins right where they want us.
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90 Undead Mage
15575
why are you so quick to fix mages, yet ignore other class balance issues? this isnt fair.

I don't think they have even come close to fixing mages. I think that every spec still has problems, wether in an overpowered or underpowered sense, and that a lot of their class abilities are not fun to use.

I'm sorry you feel that your class is being ignored, but I would really rather that Blizzard would take more time with changing the mage class. Presumably, it would result in the changes being thought out better. I don't want another cycle of being over-buffed, then having an over-nerf hotfixed in. Then having some minor buffs being added back and watching every other class go nuts over it. That isn't fun.
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90 Blood Elf Mage
6075
12/11/2012 08:20 PMPosted by Thadium
I logged on after installing Cata and Paladins were almost unplayable.

They don't tend to do mechanical changes, at all in patches.
They tend to play with numbers.

I'm assuming that is what you mean by that.
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