Why are mage nerfs always stupid?

90 Human Mage
3900
I get it, using glyph of fire blast to blow up frost bomb in PvP might have been too strong. However, of all the suggestions provided to fix the issue of frost bomb doing too much damage to frozen targets, this is probably one of the stupidest, because it effects PvE.

Plenty of mages use this glyph in PvE, because of it's utility. Being able to control when your frost bomb explodes in PvE is very useful, but now this glyph is probably off the table for frost in PvE.

This just seems like another knee jerk, reactionary nerf.
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Hopefully the DPS remains the same as the other bombs.

If not, then we have a problem.
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90 Undead Mage
7530
12/11/2012 08:43 PMPosted by Arbiter
Hopefully the DPS remains the same as the other bombs.


No, it's halved when detonated with the glyph.

It's a really stupid way to go about game balance, it's like Ghostcrawler had a headache and gave the intern the keys to the server room again...

End result, no one takes Frost Bomb in PvE, PvP Mages continue Frost Bombing their targets and waiting two seconds then Deep Freezing.
Edited by Sethmann on 12/11/2012 9:01 PM PST
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12/11/2012 08:59 PMPosted by Sethmann
Hopefully the DPS remains the same as the other bombs.


No, it's halved when detonated with the glyph.

It's a really stupid way to go about game balance, it's like Ghostcrawler had a headache and gave the intern the keys to the server room again...

Just another PvP nerf affecting PvE then.
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80 Human Priest
3225
12/11/2012 08:59 PMPosted by Sethmann
End result, no one takes Frost Bomb in PvE, PvP Mages continue Frost Bombing their targets and waiting two seconds then Deep Freezing.


Yeah and then the deep and bomb gets dispelled...

Please don't try to play this off as having no impact on pvp. You are flat out wrong..
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90 Undead Mage
7530
12/11/2012 09:08 PMPosted by Primiez
Please don't try to play this off as having no impact on pvp. You are flat out wrong..


It will have 0 effect on Burst during a Deep Freeze, but I hear it will impact pressure outside of the Deep Freeze.
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90 Troll Mage
13035
Firstly, this is annoying for my frost AoE rotation. Now I have to time my Nova and Pet freeze with the duration of frost bomb before it explodes for max damage, sometimes the mobs aren't even alive long enough for it to happen.

I hope it gets changed to player only, really tired of PvE frost getting !@#$ on by PvP nerfs.

Second off why would detonating my own spell cause it to do less damage anyway? Terrible design.
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1 Gnome Priest
0
If all Frost Mages were taking the Fireblast glyph to choose when to detonate the Frost Bomb, then having to choose that glyph wasn't really a "choice". Blizzard wants to move away from compulsory glyphs.

12/11/2012 10:08 PMPosted by Konnery
Firstly, this is annoying for my frost AoE rotation. Now I have to time my Nova and Pet freeze with the duration of frost bomb before it explodes for max damage, sometimes the mobs aren't even alive long enough for it to happen.


Looks like you think having to use Frost Bomb was also compulsory. The entire point of the talent trees was that so every tier gives you an interesting decision. Do you think it's still worth it to use Frost Bomb because of the timing issue if you use it without the glyph?

If after this nerf Frost Mage players still won't consider the other two abilities on the tier, then that means Frost Bomb is probably still overpowered relative to the other two abilities on the tier.
Edited by Wowthinker on 12/12/2012 11:25 AM PST
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90 Worgen Mage
11090
If all Frost Mages were taking the Fireblast glyph to choose when to detonate the Frost Bomb, then having to choose that glyph wasn't really a "choice". Blizzard wants to move away from compulsory glyphs.

Firstly, this is annoying for my frost AoE rotation. Now I have to time my Nova and Pet freeze with the duration of frost bomb before it explodes for max damage, sometimes the mobs aren't even alive long enough for it to happen.


Looks like you think having to use Frost Bomb was also compulsory. The entire point of the talent trees was that so every tier gives you an interesting decision. Do you think it's still worth it to use Frost Bomb because of the timing issue if you use it without the glyph?

If after this nerf Frost Mage players still won't consider the other two abilities on the tier, then that means Frost Bomb is probably still overpowered relative to the other two abilities on the tier.


The choice of the tier is based on the number of enemies you are fighting, in 5-6+ situations, every mage spec should be grabbing frost bomb. Now however, in those same situations, the mage specs cant utilize shatter as easily, and fire will have to remove a glyph every time they swap to frost bomb.
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90 Troll Mage
15740
According to a bit of testing, inferno blast does not halve the damage so it will only be affecting frost in pvp. PVE should not be affected in any way since frost does not use fire blast unless its to spread living bomb.
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90 Worgen Mage
11090
12/12/2012 11:38 AMPosted by Hiroran
According to a bit of testing, inferno blast does not halve the damage so it will only be affecting frost in pvp. PVE should not be affected in any way since frost does not use fire blast unless its to spread living bomb.


Does that apply to pvp inferno blast? Because then fire mages will be the new pvp spec of choice. And frost can use fire blast to detonate a frost bomb right as a frost nova/pet freeze goes out, will lower dps slightly, more about a usability thing now.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
15610
12/11/2012 08:59 PMPosted by Sethmann
End result, no one takes Frost Bomb in PvE, PvP Mages continue Frost Bombing their targets and waiting two seconds then Deep Freezing.


Or it doesn't affect pve at all because you can still precast it just like you described in pvp.
Sorry they raised the skillcap a little bit on you.
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90 Pandaren Priest
9520
Can't usef frost bomb with fire. Period.

Revamp the class. Just start over. This is getting ridiculous.
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90 Gnome Mage
14010
If after this nerf Frost Mage players still won't consider the other two abilities on the tier, then that means Frost Bomb is probably still overpowered relative to the other two abilities on the tier.


No it isn't. It is balanced to do the same damage as the others but frost bomb is chosen because the other two bombs do not fit the frost theme nor rotation of frost. Frost bomb has a cast time so it fits into the casting rotation with frost bolt. Frost mages should use frost spells, not fire spells, lock spells, druid spells.
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90 Troll Mage
15740
Can't usef frost bomb with fire. Period.

Revamp the class. Just start over. This is getting ridiculous.


False, it does not affect fire as fire does not use fire blast. Fire uses inferno blast and they actually have a seperation.
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90 Worgen Mage
11090
Can't usef frost bomb with fire. Period.

Revamp the class. Just start over. This is getting ridiculous.


False, it does not affect fire as fire does not use fire blast. Fire uses inferno blast and they actually have a seperation.


So every pvp mage is now fire.
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90 Human Paladin
5640
12/12/2012 12:12 PMPosted by Magnata
If after this nerf Frost Mage players still won't consider the other two abilities on the tier, then that means Frost Bomb is probably still overpowered relative to the other two abilities on the tier.


No it isn't. It is balanced to do the same damage as the others but frost bomb is chosen because the other two bombs do not fit the frost theme nor rotation of frost. Frost bomb has a cast time so it fits into the casting rotation with frost bolt. Frost mages should use frost spells, not fire spells, lock spells, druid spells.


Wrong. Talents are meant to be a choice for each and every spec. Frost DKs don't exclusively use remorseless winter because it's "frosty." If you like to pick out frost bomb for RP reasons go for it, but don't expect it to be the hands down #1 option for frost 99.9% of the time and go unchanged.
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90 Dwarf Hunter
16040
12/12/2012 12:58 PMPosted by Harcken
Wrong. Talents are meant to be a choice for each and every spec. Frost DKs don't exclusively use remorseless winter because it's "frosty." If you like to pick out frost bomb for RP reasons go for it, but don't expect it to be the hands down #1 option for frost 99.9% of the time and go unchanged.


But it has frost right there in its name, of course i'm going to take it for my frost spec.
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90 Night Elf Druid
11805
if you keep whining im sure they will buff you again just like they recently buffed fire.
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90 Human Mage
3900
12/12/2012 01:07 PMPosted by Formless
if you keep whining im sure they will buff you again just like they recently buffed fire.


Whoa, a druid complaining about another class? I've never seen that before.

This thread isn't about mages being nerfed; it's about how, in the short span of MoP, blizzard has progressively made mages less and less enjoyable. Glyph of fire blast is now detrimental to use in conjunction with frost bomb. Does that make any sense to you? Especially when there were plenty of other suggestions proposed for fixing Frost Bomb, that wouldn't ruin glyphs or make the play style less intuitive.

I mean seriously, if you don't have anything intelligent or insightful to add to this discussion, just don't say anything.
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