Can we please get a response on Boomkins

90 Troll Druid
8670
Straight dps on boss fights is not necessarily a problem. But we have some very big problems in certain situations. I'm doing challenge mode runs now and our aoe is so bad for this. Nature's grace is such a limiting mechanic and hurricane strands us in an eclipse without nature's grace up. Shrooms are underpowered and barely worth using but have to be used since hurricane can't be used on the move.

The other problem is movement aoe, same problem. Nature's grace runs out and lunar shower is a pretty poor mechanic for movement as well.

It all comes back to the fact that eclipse is too reliant on nature's grace for good dps. I know this can't change within this expansion too much. But it would help if we were less reliant on hurricane for aoe. A buff to shrooms (or as I have advocated before a mechanic change where shrooms proc a short duration dot of the eclipse you're in to help proc starsurge and cycle eclipse, thus reducing nature's grace problems and keeping us cycling).

I would love a buff to wrath as well, as our single target is nothing to write home about and it hits weaker in solar than even starfire hits in solar. This is something that would be nice, but aoe and movement dps is a much bigger concern to me. Any response as to whether dev's share our concern would be extremely appreciated. Thanks for reading.
Reply Quote
90 Worgen Druid
9355
We've been saying this for a while now. It falls on deaf ears, don't hold your breath expecting anything to change for the better.
Reply Quote
90 Troll Druid
8670
Well I really hope we get a response this time, even if its just to say that they think we're fine. Some kind of feedback would be nice.
Edited by Halfatree on 12/13/2012 2:17 AM PST
Reply Quote
90 Night Elf Druid
0
I have been bringing up the issue of our AoE and movement DPS since the MoP beta.

Hurricane is possibly the most boring spell that exists (I mean they even got rid of volley for hunters which works in the same way).

As far as movement DPS goes, there are a good number of people who do not like the lunar shower mechanic.

I would love to go back to weaving sunfire's in between exploding my shrooms. That was entertaining. Hitting hurricane over and over is certainly not.
Reply Quote
100 Tauren Priest
14975
A lot of classes are in the same boat so I wouldn't expect much to change. Blizz has said that they want ranged classes to do less dps while moving. Shadow priests can really only spam SW pain while moving unless they get procs. That's pretty similar to boomkin with sunfire / moonfire and starsurge. Along those same lines shadow priests can can't mind sear while moving (and it's also pretty boring).

Blizz should definitely buff shrooms though, for both boomkin and resto. I never use them on my druid.
Reply Quote
90 Troll Druid
8670
Ya, but even shadow priests got an aoe buff/fix (mastery applying to mind seer) and movement doesn't affect you to the extent that it isn't about movement dps, but the fact that movement affects our dps once we come to a stop. Nature's grace is ticking as we're moving, and it's a pretty big deal when it runs out. It lasts 15 seconds and already doesn't carry over to the other eclipse, as any movement or having to camp solar eclipse for aoe has us losing dps afterwards.

I'm not saying shadow priests don't need help too, but I am hoping for a blue response to the concerns that us moonkins have had since beta (if you have your own concersn, by all means start another thread).

To reiterate, hurricane and movement affect our dps too much because we lose out on nature's grace uptime. Hurricane has some big problems in that it's not sustainable mana wise, causes the aforementioned dps loss by forcing us to camp one eclipse and losing nature's grace and it's static, so we have to recast it if the tank needs to reposition the mobs. Even if the tank doesn't need to reposition, we can't match the aoe output of many classes and we still lose out on single target dps afterwards. It would just be nice to get some kind of fix that promotes eclipse cycling as our single target dps does. An extension of nature's grace could fix our movement dps a bit, but I think aoe needs something more drastic, maybe with more of an emphasis on using mushrooms and multi dotting, with hurricane used sparingly.
Edited by Halfatree on 12/13/2012 10:18 AM PST
Reply Quote
90 Troll Druid
8670
Doing challenge modes today again and I'm reminded how bad we are on aoe. Single target isn't bad but takes a deep plunge after cds are down. It's pretty sad how far down we can be. Still viable, got a few gold runs, but to be so far back of the other dps on some pulls is really disheartening.
Reply Quote
90 Worgen Druid
11265
eclipse downtime and natures grace are a big issue right now. say its imperial vizer. and you just reached solar eclipse, natures grace procs, but he casts attenuation, so you dot him up with the haste buff but by the time you are done running around you can make no use of the buff cuz its about to/or already has worn off. so your new dots suck.

or, say you never reached eclipse, and he hits attenuation, now you will spend even more of a window dps running around and starting up again in underpowered mode. while everyone else is still continuing as no changes.

suggestion: change natures grace to what it used to be, initiated by dot applications that is, but make it so that the dot that initiates it benefits from it still. if thats all programmably possible.
Reply Quote
90 Troll Druid
8670
That would be nice but I don't think its enough. I think a few things could be done... buff ng duration significantly or change the way we aoe or just buff all solar damage. Given how weak solar is for single target I don't think this would be overpowered. If they don't wanna do that and they don't wanna change the mechanics of our aoe, why not just buff mushrooms and reduce our reliance on hurricane? Multi dotting and shrooms are much more reliable than hurricane on moving targets and relying on staying in one eclipse. (buffed shrooms would allow us to multi-dot/proc starsurges and cycle through eclipses while still doing more damage for aoe in solar).

I don't know what I expect, but I'm not gonna give up on this, the last reply we got didn't address any of the issues many of us have brought up.
Reply Quote
90 Troll Druid
7605
What's especially annoying is the fact that we are one of very few specs who have to abandon their single target rotation entirely to produce decent aoe results. Because of this, weaving in our cds for optimal interaction with our aoe is just clunky and frustrating beyond belief (wind guy). Even reverting back to our single target rotation after an aoe phase is hurt signficantly when you have to go 200 eclipse energy to get to the other end without Nature's grace up.

So many fixes have been proposed to this, but Blizzard apparently feels it's alright for a class with one of the worst mobility in the game to also have the clunkiest aoe.

And with how bad Astral storm is compared to hurricane atm, I don't see why they went to the trouble of adding it as Hurricane's lunar counterpart at all. Currently, I find it does approximately 33% less damage than Hurricane. Which at my level of mastery barely makes it worth using over an UNECLIPSED Hurricane, a fact which isn't helped by the fact that this expac is seeing us shun the hell out of Mastery. And possibly because Blizzard thought it would be funny, it costs 1.6x the mana of Hurricane. For all it's worth, I'd rather they hadn't introduced it all into the game, as that way, we'd at least have hurricane up over astral storm when we used CA for our 15 seconds of 'best of both worlds'.

Anything like-

1)Major Glyph - Hurricane.

Your Hurricane and Astral Storm have a 1.5 second cast time and no longer need to be channeled. However, they deal X% less damage, and have a 10 second cooldown.

or even

2) New passive Ability: Eye of the Storm.

Your Astral storm/Hurricane criticals generate 5 Lunar/Solar energy, and leave a 5 second Moonfire/Sunfire on targets.

- would be an easy fix to one of the most horrible systems of gameplay since Burning Crusade's 1 button steady shot macro spam on a BM hunter.

Also silly is the fact that just 5 months ago, any spec would've been hard-pressed to come close to us in sustained aoe.
Edited by Velaniz on 12/15/2012 3:22 AM PST
Reply Quote
90 Troll Druid
11620
Why not tie Nature's Grace directly to Eclipse? While in Eclipse, you gain 15% spell haste. When you leave Eclipse, you lose the spell haste. Increasing the damage of Wrath, Starfire, and Starsurge by 5% would probably be enough to compensate for the less hardcasts overall. But this will increase Multi-DOTing and AOE capabilities beyond 15sec. This doesn't change AOE or movement, but it's less punishing to do so.
Edited by Cyous on 12/15/2012 12:21 PM PST
Reply Quote
90 Troll Druid
8670
@Cyous: I think that makes it a little too easy to camp in one eclipse and like you said doesn't change aoe very much (I still think it's interesting but hear me out on my idea). I'd still like something to promote shrooms/multi-dotting over hurricane while not losing out on single target dps afterwards for doing so.

To do this, while still keeping in mind nature's grace, maybe we could get a mushroom damage buff and have a new mechanic that added time to nature's grace. In the case of mushrooms, maybe if they hit x # of targets, 5 seconds gets added to nature's grace. For movement (and multi-dotting), for each stack of lunar shower and each hit afterward, (or maybe just for each hit at 3 stacks) we gain one second on nature's grace.

To me that seems like rewarding gameplay that makes you think on the fly while still making nature's grace important and something you have to think about. Hurricane might still have a place but you pay the price of losing out on nature's grace by not using dots and shrooms.

Honestly there are so many interesting solutions that they could implement for some of the problems we're having, I just wanna know that they acknowledge that we do have problems and that they might be thinking about them.
Edited by Halfatree on 12/15/2012 10:19 PM PST
Reply Quote
90 Night Elf Druid
15215
I think they can somehow tie it to Lunar Shower. I.e. Lunar shower affected dots are always buffed with NG? That way, MF/SnF spam is only a matter of being in eclipse, and not NG.

Also, a passive effect to astral storm / hurricane be added: puts a stop on your nature's grace buff while it is being channeled.

Boom, now, we don't have to worry about overriding NG-buffed dots while moving, and also, AE is immediately less clunky, since we don't lose Nature's Grace at all during hurricane (or rather, your NG duration remains identical to where it was when you started channelling.

It isn't that hard - but they just don't want to give us a response at all... what can we do?
Reply Quote

Please report any Code of Conduct violations, including:

Threats of violence. We take these seriously and will alert the proper authorities.

Posts containing personal information about other players. This includes physical addresses, e-mail addresses, phone numbers, and inappropriate photos and/or videos.

Harassing or discriminatory language. This will not be tolerated.

Forums Code of Conduct

Report Post # written by

Reason
Explain (256 characters max)

Reported!

[Close]