LFR loot system is deeply flawed.

100 Troll Druid
11200
Question 1: Before LFR loot system, how often were you getting loot? Of the 2-3 items that droped (for which you had to roll against others), how often did you win?


Going to the LFR and being the guy who won THREE teir items and a ring made up for all the crappy times you got nothing.

Both of my toons tasted this experience during Cata.


I'm not following you here - you're saying this doesn't happen in MoP? Because my experience of getting 3 or 4 items in one run begs to differ, and definitely makes up for the 2 or 3 weeks where I got nothing.

I think this system is great. As always, you run the dungeon, you may or may not get loot, but no matter what you're not going to have any drama over what dropped.
100 Orc Hunter
19200
My one complaint with the new loot system is that you Don't have the option to disenchant an item you don't want or need if there is an Enchanter in the raid with you.

Asc
90 Human Paladin
13735
::Doesn't get loot::
This system is flawed!
Crappy luck, you say?
Impossible!
90 Worgen Warlock
7275

Maybe people want to play more than one class did you ever think of that? The best solution to this poor loot system is for if you didn't get a single piece of loot during the entire raid then at the very end you'd get a garenteed loot drop. The item would come from the combined loot tables of all the bosses you killed.

There's still no garentee it'll be for the slot you need an upgrade for.

There's still no garentee that it'll not be a repeat of what you already have.

But it's literally better than just getting 28g for your time investment.

If I wanted gold I'd just do dailies. They're more efficient and less time consuming.


It's not worse than normal raiding. In fact, it's better, since the chance exists for everyone to get a drop off a boss, especially repeats.

If a normal or heroic group ever had the chance for all the mages to receive a sha-touched weapon in the same kill, you'd go bat!@#$ nuts screaming at how unfair things are.

It's rng. Statistically, the same amount of loot drops as the old system, except there's no infighting, and more loot can drop.

If you don't agree that it's better, it's obvious you want to be able to stack the odds in your favor by using friends or guildies, which is why it was changed to being individual rolls and not group-wide. Functionally, the only other change was the possibility for more or less loot. Unless you're forgetting that with four drops, 21 people didn't get loot every boss in DS.
90 Orc Shaman
13550
The sooner you realize that LFR is there to let you see the content and not there to gear you up after a few weeks the happier you will be.


Wrong!

Firstly it's player progression for causals, so yes the loot matters.

Secondly, it's replacing late tier heroic dungeons as a "catch-up" mechanism - this is why 5.2 doesn't have any new heroics and we probably won't be getting anymore dungeons the rest of the expansion.


For the first part, there's no progression in the raid itself, so the only reason the loot matters is to meet the minimum requirement for the next raid. As long as players actually do LFR and do the other things that raiders are expected to do (IE maybe buy some BoEs, craft some gear, buy some Valor gear) then they are reaching that minimum. Therefore the system is fine.

For the second part, that's why they're going to raise the loot % in the 5.0 LFR after 5.2 LFR launches.

Also, there's nothing stopping them from releasing a dungeon here or there. Just not faceroll dungeons that have the full compliment of an upgraded loot list.
Edited by Hyjinx on 1/16/2013 8:09 AM PST
90 Worgen Warlock
7275
We're not getting catch-up dungeons because they're returning to linear progression, as they don't want content invalidated. Nothing says they won't make more dungeons with 463s in them, though. Just none, now.

It has absolutely nothing to do with LFR. Unless you're looking at it from the aspect of LFR is so people can see it- and they want you to see it. Then it does. But as far as "You'll get loot from LFR and not heroics to get to more normals", sorry, no. That's not part of the advancement paradigm.
Edited by Qaira on 1/16/2013 8:16 AM PST
100 Human Mage
13175
Can the loot system be frustrating of course it can but it is way less frustrating than watching 6 people from the same guild roll on something and pass it to the toon they are adding to their normal or heroic mode raid.

I have done Terrace enough times to take over 23 shots at getting my sha touched weapon between coins and weekly rolls. I have the sha crystal and the eye to add a socket from the legendary quest sitting in my bank waiting for when i get one.

The current system removes the "ninja" chance from when the item drops for me. When you see the item you are going for on your screen it belongs to you and you don't have to worry about it being rolled on by people that don't need it to give it to someone they know that does.
100 Orc Hunter
12170
After running a lot of LFR's... I've have yet to get any loot out of those bags, even with using my elder charms. I've seen a ridiculous number of complaints of duplicate loot. After 3 weeks of bags of "28 gold" I'm getting fed up that the effort I put into this, there zero results. I no longer see the point of it.

Blizz -- When will you fix the loot system to go back to the previous system, but refine need/greed per class and specialization. EX: Holy Pallys not rolling need on tank gear ect.


Person with 1 Sha kill and have Shin'ka complains about LFR loot, now thats FUNNY.
90 Worgen Warlock
7275

The problem with "linear progression" is gearing up latecomers is a problematic issue.


Maybe they should exert some effort then, just like the people who started before them.

If you don't want to exert any effort, why should anybody care that you're not progressing?


Players who have already gotten the gear they want, won't what to do those old raids again. Guilds have to force their members to grind old raids for the newcomers. This was why late-tier heroics like ICC heroic dungeons / Hour of Twilight were introduced in addition to tier gear being available for Justice Points.


Except every single previous expansion shows otherwise. For all walks of players except the "I'm only playing 30 minutes this week yet I want to experience the same amount of content someone who plays 30 hours does".

And really, why should we pander to that kind of insipid viewpoint?


With LFR you can do old raids, with other latecomers, to catch up without bothering the rest of the guild. Sure it's the lite version of the raid, but if it's a guild latecomer-gear-up run, you are not exactly experiencing the "real" raiding experience anyway with most of your more experienced fellow raid members having out-geared the content.


You can pug, do gdkps, alt runs, whatever.

LFR is about seeing content if you can't or don't raid period/with enough reliability. It has nothing to do with replacing gear resets.
90 Human Paladin
10690
After running a lot of LFR's... I've have yet to get any loot out of those bags, even with using my elder charms. I've seen a ridiculous number of complaints of duplicate loot. After 3 weeks of bags of "28 gold" I'm getting fed up that the effort I put into this, there zero results. I no longer see the point of it.

Blizz -- When will you fix the loot system to go back to the previous system, but refine need/greed per class and specialization. EX: Holy Pallys not rolling need on tank gear ect.


Person with 1 Sha kill and have Shin'ka complains about LFR loot, now thats FUNNY.


This thread is a necro.
90 Worgen Warlock
7275

How much "effort" is too much? Too much to bother with.

Not everyone is as hardcore and dedicated a player as yourself.


I'm not hardcore, I'm not dedicated. Assuming so is displaying your brazen idiocy and overwhelming ignorance, as well as sidestepping the issue by calling into contention my playstyle, or amount of time played, when neither has anything to do with the crux of the issue.


As a newcomer, while you are grinding old raids, the rest of your guild progresses. It will take ages to catch up, even with them helping you - which BTW isn't all that fun for them; gear-up runs tend to have attendance problems.


And? I started playing the week before BT was released- I still saw Sunwell before Wrath. I raided with a family oriented casual guild the majority of that expansion, so I wasn't raiding 4 days a week or progressing 24/7. I exerted the amount of effort that was required to advance, [iso I caught up[/i].


If it was that "easy", Blizzard wouldn't have resorted to giving out tier gear via JP. Blizzard wouldn't have spend resources making heroics that "causally" drop epics.


There really isn't much difference between an ilvl 200 that is blue or purple, such as those in wrath. Tier gier is no longer bought with JP, as we're back to linear progression and not the failed dungeon resets that have gone the way of obsolence much like rep tabards.


Some people take breaks from the game due to Real Life issues and they entered the expansion late. Or they only recently join the guild coming from a guild that didn't work out and never got anything done.

Does that mean they should never get to play with the rest of the guild? If this is so, they will just quit, no one likes being left behind indefinitely, and that's bad for business.


I entered late. Some of my guildies have switched their mains several times. They're still on the same footing I am, or those who I caught up to are- they exerted that effort required. They didn't sit around, their thumb up their !@#, complaining about the minimal distance everyone else was ahead of them, waiting for a gear reset.

They, and I, did the content, caught up, did the content, and progressed.

The same as people have done every previous expansion, usually without resorting to using the gear resets from catch-up heroics.

If you're impatient and expect to jump from heroics to killing bosses in the third tier of an expansion instantly, without being carried hard (which means everyone else present overgears the encounter), well, how did you get into rpgs, much less mmos to begin with? Something like CoD where you can camp a spawn point or hide in the corner while your team does all the work sounds more up your alley.


PUGs? What do you think LFR is?


Lemme guess, you're one of those people that thinks because someone isn't raiding with people they've known for a decade, their ability to play magically vanishes, they suck, the content becomes obscenely difficult despite remaining the same, and everything takes fourteen times longer.

Pugging a normal mode is no different than doing it with your guild. If the elements themselves are weak, failure will be more likely. If they are strong, then the lack or presence of a bond is irrelevant. It becomes simple mathematics as to whether the encounter will be defeated or not.
Edited by Qaira on 1/16/2013 9:18 AM PST
After running a lot of LFR's... I've have yet to get any loot out of those bags, even with using my elder charms. I've seen a ridiculous number of complaints of duplicate loot. After 3 weeks of bags of "28 gold" I'm getting fed up that the effort I put into this, there zero results. I no longer see the point of it.

Blizz -- When will you fix the loot system to go back to the previous system, but refine need/greed per class and specialization. EX: Holy Pallys not rolling need on tank gear ect.


That is what you have minus the trade, or the option to pass or greed. I think It really hurts the player mentally not to see the rolling option.
90 Pandaren Shaman
12755
12/17/2012 10:57 AMPosted by Straker
You have like four total runs... What the heck bub? You have a 15% chance to get some lewts, keep going and you will get some. I have 4 90s - this guy recieved three tier pieces in one run once. My mage and warrior have yet to recieve one. It is what it is. But don't expect to be fully geared out with only four runs...


LFR needs to go DIAF, the Valor gear is higher rated and its guaranteed you WILL get it .. LFR is like a really badly stacked crap shoot (Stacked in the houses favor) that isnt worth the time or effort you put into it.

After more than 10 weeks of running it on my rogue and getting nothing but gold I refuse to run it on any of my toons. Even ran it on this toon to see if the curse was broken but again nothing but gold.

I have no further desire to subject myself to the indignity of LFR.
Edited by Terrawatt on 1/16/2013 9:26 AM PST
100 Tauren Druid
10175
12/17/2012 09:35 AMPosted by Chawana
The problem is HOW random it is.


This is the confusing thing to me. What would make it acceptably random?
90 Worgen Warlock
7275

LFR needs to go DIAF, the Valor gear is higher rated and its guaranteed you WILL get it .. LFR is like a really badly stacked crap shoot (Stacked in the houses favor) that isnt worth the time or effort you put into it.

After more than 10 weeks of running it on my rogue and getting nothing but gold I refuse to run it on any of my toons. Even ran it on this toon to see if the curse was broken but again nothing but gold.

I have no further desire to subject myself to the indignity of LFR.


Yet you raid normally.

Something seems wrong with your logic.
90 Pandaren Shaman
12755

LFR needs to go DIAF, the Valor gear is higher rated and its guaranteed you WILL get it .. LFR is like a really badly stacked crap shoot (Stacked in the houses favor) that isnt worth the time or effort you put into it.

After more than 10 weeks of running it on my rogue and getting nothing but gold I refuse to run it on any of my toons. Even ran it on this toon to see if the curse was broken but again nothing but gold.

I have no further desire to subject myself to the indignity of LFR.


Yet you raid normally.

Something seems wrong with your logic.


No I don't.
Making Assumptions is bad mmmmmkay.

You could have found this out by trolling my armory .. Im rather surprised you didnt.
Edited by Terrawatt on 1/16/2013 9:36 AM PST
90 Draenei Shaman
0


The problem is HOW random it is.
Of course, seeing as you're actually getting stuff, you can't really relate...

People like you really do make me a little sick. :|


Random is random. If it weren't...it wouldn't be random. We all see runs of bad luck.

Now, you might make the argument that maybe the chance of loot is a touch lower than it should be, and it might very well be. Most of us would like a reasonable chance of a full tier set before the next patch. Is this happening? Dunno. I'd like to complete my 4pc, but it wouldn't be the first time it never happened in a tier.

Oh, and don't even tell me I can't relate. Though we aren't formally raiding this tier, I've done plenty in the past. I almost never got everything I wanted from any particular tier. That's pretty much the nature of the raiding game, skippy.

Oh, and what makes me sick is the constant whining of self-entitled wankers on the forums. Guess where you fit in?
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