Why is Necroing/Bumping bad?

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MVP
90 Night Elf Priest
10780
Your argument makes no sense. It's better to make a new thread about a topic that was never answered, but at the same time, the poster should have already googled for the answer.


That is absolutely correct. Always do a search before creating a new thread.

Finding the old thread is to find the answer. Not to find a thread to bump.

If you cannot find the answer - Create a thread. Don't bump a thread without the answer.


Again, what is the purpose of this message board, since nearly every answer can already be found on WoWhead, EJ, or one of the wiki sites?


For discussion with the entire playerbase and for answering questions.

By the way, the search function on this site blows,


That's fine, but before insisting you are right, try asking more questions.

The answer to the question you could have asked there is where I say "Use google to search for the <term> and add site:battle.net to it", it works much better than the internal site.

ex. If you wanted to find out about exploding llamas in world of warcraft, then:

Search for "llama explosion site:battle.net" on google.
Edited by Snowfox on 12/18/2012 3:43 PM PST
Here's a question:

How much time needs to pass between the most recent post and a new post for you to consider said new post to be a necro?

I would say 1 month personally.

And herein lies the problem. People come into a thread bumped after 5 days, "Really, necro?" That's not a necro.

1-3 months seems to be pretty standard for other sites I visit. Basically with an MMO, I'd consider anything from the last patch (when asking a question about the game), "definitely not a necro." If something changed with a recent patch, then questions relating to pre-patch issues would likely be a necro.
MVP
90 Night Elf Priest
10780
Absolutely wrong. The general forum goes by pretty fast and most people don't tend to look at page 2 of the topics. So if you're not in the front page then your topic won't get any more views. Even if it's a deep insightful topic that warrants extra discussion. As long as someone is bumping once every few hours to get his topic out to a new "audience" that browses the forum at a different time than the last audience that's fine. But yeah bumping it every 5 minutes on the other hand is a little different.


There's a difference between a post bumping a thread and making a bump post.

A bump post is useless information. It's noise, a tee-hee wink that pushes the thread to the top.

A post bumping a thread should have actual information added... something new brought to the discussion.

If people want to bump threads, then add information to that post. Reply to someone in the thread, address their statement. That's fine.

DON'T just say "bump" and think you are anything but an attention-starved child.
12/18/2012 03:41 PMPosted by Snowfox
Your argument makes no sense. It's better to make a new thread about a topic that was never answered, but at the same time, the poster should have already googled for the answer.


That is absolutely correct. Always do a search before creating a new thread.

Finding the old thread is to find the answer. Not to find a thread to bump.

If you cannot find the answer - Create a thread. Don't bump a thread without the answer.

So again, it's better to clutter the forums with a brand new topic, asking the exact same question as someone did previously, yet wasn't answered, even when the context surrounding that question hasn't changed?



Again, what is the purpose of this message board, since nearly every answer can already be found on WoWhead, EJ, or one of the wiki sites?


For discussion with the entire playerbase and for answering questions.

Entire playerbase doesn't post on these forums. Also, if people should just google instead of making a new thread, there shouldn't be questions to answer, as I can't think of anything asked on here that isn't answered on one of the other WoW forums.


By the way, the search function on this site blows,


That's fine, but before insisting you are right, try asking more questions.

The answer to the question you could have asked there is where I say "Use google to search for the <term> and add site:battle.net to it", it works much better than the internal site.

I know how to do the google search for things. I also know that if I want a question answered, that doesn't come up on google, that this is the very last site to visit. That's irrelevant to my points, though.
MVP
90 Night Elf Priest
10780
So again, it's better to clutter the forums with a brand new topic, asking the exact same question as someone did previously, yet wasn't answered, even when the context surrounding that question hasn't changed?


YES. YES That is accurate. Yes is the answer to the question. The answer is "YES".

Please stop rehashing that question.
12/18/2012 03:44 PMPosted by Snowfox
Absolutely wrong. The general forum goes by pretty fast and most people don't tend to look at page 2 of the topics. So if you're not in the front page then your topic won't get any more views. Even if it's a deep insightful topic that warrants extra discussion. As long as someone is bumping once every few hours to get his topic out to a new "audience" that browses the forum at a different time than the last audience that's fine. But yeah bumping it every 5 minutes on the other hand is a little different.


There's a difference between a post bumping a thread and making a bump post.

A bump post is useless information. It's noise, a tee-hee wink that pushes the thread to the top.

A post bumping a thread should have actual information added... something new brought to the discussion.

If people want to bump threads, then add information to that post. Reply to someone in the thread, address their statement. That's fine.

DON'T just say "bump" and think you are anything but an attention-starved child.


This is ironic to me, considering that some of the stickies on this site were "bumped" by the OP prior to becoming stickies.

Sometimes, people bump well-thought out and well-written threads, because as the other person said, they want a new "audience." Some people only read the forums at certain times. Posts pushed to the second+ page after an hour of spam from stupid and irrelevant threads sometimes need a "bump" to get some intelligent discussion going on.

YES. YES That is accurate. Yes is the answer to the question. The answer is "YES".

Please stop rehashing that question.

I wouldn't have had to have rehashed it if you would have just given that answer from the very beginning, instead of beating around the bush when I asked it every other time. It was a yes or no question, yet in every other post, you've said, "Yes, but" type of responses with other things strewn in that were irrelevant to the question.

If you're supporting spam over bumping an unanswered question, which is still relevant, then I realize I need to bow out of this thread at this point, as there is no way we're going to see eye-to-eye on this issue.
Edited by Elementaru on 12/18/2012 3:55 PM PST
MVP
90 Night Elf Priest
10780

Sometimes, people bump well-thought out and well-written threads, because as the other person said, they want a new "audience." Some people only read the forums at certain times. Posts pushed to the second+ page after an hour of spam from stupid and irrelevant threads sometimes need a "bump" to get some intelligent discussion going on.


Like I said, it's how you do it, not what you did.

It's fine to bump a thread by adding something constructive to the discussion there. If your secondary goal is to keep the thread going, that's fine too. Think about it though - which will REALLY stimulate the thread though? Saying "Bump", or bringing a new element into the thread for discussion?
90 Draenei Shaman
16645
Do not "bump" posts.
The act of posting simply to bump a thread is considered spamming. This also includes bumping very old threads for no reason (called "necro bumping" or "necroing").

I don't understand why this is considered spam if the topic is still relevant. Do we really need another thread of the same topic?


It says "for no reason". If the topic is still relevant and you have something to add to it, then you have a reason.
90 Undead Warrior
11290
I need to bookmark this thread and remember to give it a bump in a year or two.

Interesting clarification though, snowfox. I've often wondered why people encourage you to search for old threads and also not necro. seemed funny.

In general it seems to me like actual cases where someone comes to the forum and asks a question, the whole cycle completes on the first page. Except maybe Kralnor.
90 Draenei Death Knight
6380
Snowfox had it right with her first statement. I concur, many times I see a old thread brought back and the OP is no where to be found to respond to the topic because they have already accepted closure to the topic.

To necro a post is just annoying and hopefully soon there will be an automated system to prevent this.
MVP
90 Night Elf Priest
10780
Interesting clarification though, snowfox. I've often wondered why people encourage you to search for old threads and also not necro. seemed funny.


Well, also remember here that bumping/necroing are also pretty much at the very very bottom of the penalty volcano. I think the blues recognize there's some wriggle room with them.

So in this thread I was trying to clarify things... but it's not exactly the same as when I'm speaking out against things like botting or spamming.

Someone necroing a thread in good faith is up there with grammar mistakes. They should be avoided, but it's not the end of the world.

So cluttering the forums with clones of useless topics is a good thing?

Lol, sorry but that's just hilarious.


I'm sorry if you have nothing to add to this discussion but mis-framing the debate.

Perhaps, in time, you'll come to understand the issue at a deeper level.
Edited by Snowfox on 12/18/2012 4:07 PM PST
90 Night Elf Druid
15850
Sometimes, people bump well-thought out and well-written threads, because as the other person said, they want a new "audience." Some people only read the forums at certain times. Posts pushed to the second+ page after an hour of spam from stupid and irrelevant threads sometimes need a "bump" to get some intelligent discussion going on.


There's definitely valid reasons to bring back old posts, if there wasn't the site simply would auto lock threads after noone had posted in them for X days. That said the majority of people who bump and necro are doing it to either spam their personal pet project or simply to troll.
90 Tauren Warrior
10045
It's a no win situation. people complain about how there are so many threads on the same topic, and yet, will be yelled at if they bump one.

Makes no sense to me really.


There's a difference between making a post that hasn't been made in a few days/week and a thread being started when there's already 10 on the front page.
90 Night Elf Hunter
10175
ALERT! ALERT! ALERT! ANALOGY INCOMING!

Let's say two months ago you were at a party. The hot topic everyone was talking about was the way the NFL draft went earlier this year. The party broke up at 4am and everyone left, each going his/her own separate way. There have been plenty of parties since that one two months ago, none of which saw a resurrection of anything related to the NFL draft, and none of which you attended. Then through the door you come to the latest party.

Do you try to continue the conversation about the NFL draft ... a conversation that has died a natural death in the last two months?

/analogy

With the way patches and hotfixes get slung at us willy-nilly, it's likely that every part of the old thread has either been addressed (maybe nothing changed, but it's been addressed) or the patches/hotfixes have made the conversation completely irrelevant because of changes that have been made to whatever the thread was about.

My personal rule is that if no one has posted to the thread in the last 15 days, it's a dead horse and there are other things I need to do besides beating a dead horse. If there is something in the old thread that I'm concerned about, I'll make a new thread and talk about the specific "something" that concerns me. Unless (of course) the issue was resolved with "we hear you, but we're not going to fix it."
90 Draenei Shaman
16645
Snowfox had it right with her first statement. I concur, many times I see a old thread brought back and the OP is no where to be found to respond to the topic because they have already accepted closure to the topic.

To necro a post is just annoying and hopefully soon there will be an automated system to prevent this.


Many topics have relevance that does not require the presence of the OP. The primary prupose of forums is not to merely anwser the questions of individuals. There is no acceptance of closure. Sometimes new issues come up.

There is a mental malady that makes people think old equals dead.
Edited by Knilya on 12/18/2012 4:12 PM PST
90 Human Warlock
6270
So cluttering the forums with clones of useless topics is a good thing?

Lol, sorry but that's just hilarious.


The only way the forum is "cluttered" is if multiple topics on the same thing are all on the front page (CRZ topic starters have been particularly bad with this recently).

If you want to comment on topic X, and the most recent post on it was 6 months ago, you're not cluttering anything by starting a new one.
90 Draenei Death Knight
6380
Snowfox had it right with her first statement. I concur, many times I see a old thread brought back and the OP is no where to be found to respond to the topic because they have already accepted closure to the topic.

To necro a post is just annoying and hopefully soon there will be an automated system to prevent this.


Many topics have relevance that does not require the presence of the OP. The primary prupose of forums is not to merely anwser the questions of individuals. There is no acceptance of closure. Sometimes new issues come up.

There is a mental malady that makes people think old equals dead.


If something new comes up about that issue than it isn't relevant to how it was prior which means it is out of context to the topic.

If something new arises I advise you make a new thread.
MVP
90 Night Elf Priest
10780
12/18/2012 04:12 PMPosted by Knilya
There is a mental malady that makes people think old equals dead.


There's truth to it though. We don't "bump" old news stories... because they are played out the day they are aired. We don't eat old food, because it goes bad.

There's a saying "old code rusts", and it's the same with threads on the forums.

When threads go old, their context goes cold.
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