My thoughts on purge of Dalaran (spoilers)

100 Human Paladin
9400
I'm not going to lie and say I felt good while doing it, but it at least brings me comfort knowing that I was able to ignore the cowering unarmed civilians and focus entirely on the hostiles. Plus, the note I received in the mail about the chaos it created within the Horde helped bring my spirits up just a little. But still, after it was all over I found myself pretty much reacting the same way as Baine when he saw the bomb destroy Theramore.

I've always had a soft spot for the blood elves, after seeing all the suffering they've had to endure in Warcraft 3 and the sorry state that their kingdom still remains in. Which is one reason why I've never taken part in any "For the Alliance" raids.- nor have I done any "For the Horde" raids on my Horde alts, but I digress- Just looking at the state of their kingdom and knowing what caused it, I couldn't bring myself to invade that place because I felt that doing so would make me no better than the Scourge. I joined WoW to *fight* the Scourge, not become them.

So yeah, felt bad doing it, but was still able to protect my reputation as a paladin by sparing the civilians and only attacking the hostiles. And come to think of it... there was that one guy who was robbing the bank. I didn't feel too bad about killing him.
Edited by Cassima on 12/19/2012 3:21 PM PST
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100 Night Elf Hunter
20410

So yeah, felt bad doing it, but was still able to protect my reputation as a paladin by sparing the civilians and only attacking the hostiles. And come to think of it... there was that one guy who was robbing the bank. I didn't feel too bad about killing him.


I thought he was "robbing" the bank of items that were his 5 minutes earlier. The quest doesn't say that though so I guess it was just my head cannon.
http://www.wowhead.com/quest=32420

Also, if you want to feel good about the purge don't do the horde version. From that POV the purgers seem like even bigger jerks. Most of the BE civilians have no idea what is going on and don't seem to want to fight. They are just confused and afraid.
Edited by Threeslotbag on 12/19/2012 3:41 PM PST
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100 Night Elf Priest
17460

So yeah, felt bad doing it, but was still able to protect my reputation as a paladin by sparing the civilians and only attacking the hostiles. And come to think of it... there was that one guy who was robbing the bank. I didn't feel too bad about killing him.


I thought he was "robbing" the bank of items that were his 5 minutes earlier. The quest doesn't say that though so I guess it was just my head cannon.
http://www.wowhead.com/quest=32420

Also, if you want to feel good about the purge don't do the horde version. From that POV the purgers seem like even bigger jerks. Most of the BE civilians have no idea what is going on and don't seem to want to fight. They are just confused and afraid.


I have made my opinion of the two different purges. I made a post some time ago, but it looks like the thread was erased because I can't find it in my earlier posts...
Anyway, here's what I think of why there are two different Dalaran events:

The Alliance players want to be the good guys. They want to do the right thing above all else. But at the same time, they don't want to be stupid in their goodness. They want their actions to be taken seriously, and they want to fight back against the Horde's agression instead of rolling over. What they get is a scenario where the Blood elves are on the attack. As soon as you get there, they jump Jaina and try to ambush her. They are armed by the Horde. They are in full insurrection mode. At the same time, you see civilians running around scared !@#$less. Not only you're not asked to attack them, but Jaina teleports them unharmed to the Violet hold. You can spare the innocents, and you're expected to while various attackers jump out and attack you. The quest gives you the impression that a great part of the Sunreavers are involved in betraying the Kirin Tor, and you are dispensing justice in a righteous way.

Horde players are given an entirely different scenario. They want to fight the Alliance, but have been hit by the villain bat very hard and can only feel like villains. They are not in the right, they are pushing this war needlessly. The Dalaran scenario makes them see the Alliance and the Silver Covenant in the middle of doing horrible things to the Sunreaver innocents. Its a slaughter right now. The quest's purpose is obviously to make you feel that you have a good reason to fight the Alliance due to their treachery. You have to make them pay. Blood for blood.

Alliance players are absolutely clean in their actions. Horde players are completely justified in their anger. Its a win for all players.
Mostly Allies since they get the Kirin Tor and the Silver Covenant as allies.
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96 Undead Warlock
8885
I'm not going to lie and say I felt good while doing it, but it at least brings me comfort knowing that I was able to ignore the cowering unarmed civilians and focus entirely on the hostiles. Plus, the note I received in the mail about the chaos it created within the Horde helped bring my spirits up just a little. But still, after it was all over I found myself pretty much reacting the same way as Baine when he saw the bomb destroy Theramore.

I've always had a soft spot for the blood elves, after seeing all the suffering they've had to endure in Warcraft 3 and the sorry state that their kingdom still remains in. Which is one reason why I've never taken part in any "For the Alliance" raids.- nor have I done any "For the Horde" raids on my Horde alts, but I digress- Just looking at the state of their kingdom and knowing what caused it, I couldn't bring myself to invade that place because I felt that doing so would make me no better than the Scourge. I joined WoW to *fight* the Scourge, not become them.

So yeah, felt bad doing it, but was still able to protect my reputation as a paladin by sparing the civilians and only attacking the hostiles. And come to think of it... there was that one guy who was robbing the bank. I didn't feel too bad about killing him.


I think one of the problems is that as far as we know, only one Sunreaver actually helped the Horde, the rest didn't. If we threw in people we knew were involved, I'm sure the Alliance players would feel happier than killing people they have no idea if they actually played part. I personally think Jaina had the right idea, but went about it all wrong.

P.S. I think the guy robbing the bank was trying to get his stuff then flee. Assumption and I could be wrong.

12/19/2012 06:01 PMPosted by Resileaf
Mostly Allies since they get the Kirin Tor and the Silver Covenant as allies.


I thought the Silver Covenant was always a part of the Alliance. Like how the Sunreavers were always a part of the Horde, since they were still a part of Quel'Thalas, and by extension, the Horde.
Edited by Ximothy on 12/19/2012 6:07 PM PST
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100 Night Elf Priest
17460

Mostly Allies since they get the Kirin Tor and the Silver Covenant as allies.


I thought the Silver Covenant was always a part of the Alliance. Like how the Sunreavers were always a part of the Horde, since they were still a part of Quel'Thalas, and by extension, the Horde.

Logically, but I've never seen them fight on the Alliance's side except at Theramore, and I think they did because Rhonin was fighting there. Where the Sunreavers openly did stuff for the Horde, the Silver Covenant was mostly part of the Kirin Tor.
Although I may be remembering wrong.
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96 Undead Warlock
8885
12/19/2012 06:13 PMPosted by Resileaf
Logically, but I've never seen them fight on the Alliance's side except at Theramore, and I think they did because Rhonin was fighting there. Where the Sunreavers openly did stuff for the Horde, the Silver Covenant was mostly part of the Kirin Tor.


They repsensted the Alliance in the Argent Torunment.

Silver Covenant also help Alliance players in Icecrown Citadel, Sunreavers as the Horde counterpart.
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100 Night Elf Priest
17460
12/19/2012 06:23 PMPosted by Ximothy
Logically, but I've never seen them fight on the Alliance's side except at Theramore, and I think they did because Rhonin was fighting there. Where the Sunreavers openly did stuff for the Horde, the Silver Covenant was mostly part of the Kirin Tor.


They repsensted the Alliance in the Argent Torunment.

Silver Covenant also help Alliance players in Icecrown Citadel, Sunreavers as the Horde counterpart.


Were they in ICC? I don't remember.
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90 Human Mage
13505
12/19/2012 06:28 PMPosted by Resileaf


They repsensted the Alliance in the Argent Torunment.

Silver Covenant also help Alliance players in Icecrown Citadel, Sunreavers as the Horde counterpart.


Were they in ICC? I don't remember.


No they didn't as I recall. Argent Crusaders mostly.
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96 Undead Warlock
8885
12/19/2012 06:33 PMPosted by Valius
No they didn't as I recall. Argent Crusaders mostly.


Their wowpedia page says that Champions of the Silver Covenant fight alongside players in Icecrown.
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100 Human Warrior
16460
12/19/2012 06:06 PMPosted by Ximothy
P.S. I think the guy robbing the bank was trying to get his stuff then flee. Assumption and I could be wrong.


He was, but the assets he was taking out were frozen. You can't just let him go and let him withdraw all his assets if you believe him potentially guilty of a crime. And who knows, maybe the Dalaran bank has a clause in their TOS that says that any items given to Dalaran are technically theirs.
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96 Undead Warlock
8885
12/19/2012 06:38 PMPosted by Mordstreich
He was, but the assets he was taking out were frozen. You can't just let him go and let him withdraw all his assets if you believe him potentially guilty of a crime. And who knows, maybe the Dalaran bank has a clause in their TOS that says that any items given to Dalaran are technically theirs.


Oh I know, I was simply saying he was trying to get his stuff back.
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100 Night Elf Priest
17460
12/19/2012 06:42 PMPosted by Ximothy
He was, but the assets he was taking out were frozen. You can't just let him go and let him withdraw all his assets if you believe him potentially guilty of a crime. And who knows, maybe the Dalaran bank has a clause in their TOS that says that any items given to Dalaran are technically theirs.


Oh I know, I was simply saying he was trying to get his stuff back.


Well, a frozen account is used to keep criminals from using their money to commit more crimes. If it happens, then trying to get it back is a crime as well. Pretty standard stuff today.
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90 Human Mage
13505
12/19/2012 06:43 PMPosted by Resileaf


Oh I know, I was simply saying he was trying to get his stuff back.


Well, a frozen account is used to keep criminals from using their money to commit more crimes. If it happens, then trying to get it back is a crime as well. Pretty standard stuff today.


Yes but I love Blizzard but I don't think they thought that well ahead and in detail ;)
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90 Human Warlock
5390
Eh. I've never had too much sympathy for the blood elves. Many of their problems are a result of their own arrogance.

The purge was enjoyable from a story perspective, though. The Blood Elves first betrayed the Alliance, and then betrayed Jaina's trust, who still forgave them and the Horde, despite everything.

The main difference is that they're actually be called on their bull!@#$, this time. And I'm glad.

Lions aren't merciful. Why should I be?
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90 Human Mage
13505
Eh. I've never had too much sympathy for the blood elves. Many of their problems are a result of their own arrogance.

The purge was enjoyable from a story perspective, though. The Blood Elves first betrayed the Alliance, and then betrayed Jaina's trust, who still forgave them and the Horde, despite everything.

The main difference is that they're actually be called on their bull!@#$, this time. And I'm glad.

Lions aren't merciful. Why should I be?


Cause two wrongs don't make a right. It's kind of hypocritical to say Blood Elves did !@#$ to them and we do something back to them to *get even* or what not and the whole Lion analogy doesn't work either since lions aren't exactly sentient and have non animalistic minds.

You might be able to argue that when I see a Lion talking in human language.

And before someone starts, yes the Sunreavers had to be dealt with but saying "THEY DESERVED IT CAUSE THEY DID STUFF TO US" is silly logic.
Edited by Valius on 12/19/2012 6:50 PM PST
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90 Human Warlock
5390
12/19/2012 06:49 PMPosted by Valius
It's kind of hypocritical to say Blood Elves did !@#$ to them and we do something back to them to *get even*


Didn't say that.

Said that the Blood Elves are finally being held accountable for their actions.

12/19/2012 06:49 PMPosted by Valius
whole Lion analogy doesn't work either since lions aren't exactly sentient and have non animalistic minds.


Fun fact: The Lion is considered the symbol of the Grand Alliance.

Perhaps you can work out what I said from there.

Trust me, it's not that hard.

God, this was not worth hitting display this post.

Try harder next time!
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100 Night Elf Hunter
20410
12/19/2012 06:43 PMPosted by Resileaf
Well, a frozen account is used to keep criminals from using their money to commit more crimes. If it happens, then trying to get it back is a crime as well. Pretty standard stuff today.


He was illegally trying to remove (his?) assets from the bank. 5 minutes earlier it would have been totally legal. But because he was 5 minutes too late we get a quest to kill him. Also, "legal" can be evil. I feel the kill order on him, the shopkeepers, and the mounts were evil.

And we still don't know how many sunreavers were horde aligned. There has only ever been 1 confirmed and he was kicked out of the sunreavers for it.
Edited by Threeslotbag on 12/19/2012 6:55 PM PST
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100 Human Paladin
18555
12/19/2012 06:54 PMPosted by Threeslotbag
I feel the kill order on him, the shopkeepers, and the mounts were evil.


It's not like Brasael or the shopkeepers were innocents, cut down while they cowered and pleaded for mercy. They were criminals and traitors who chose to violently resist arrest.

What happened to them wasn't evil. It wasn't even morally ambiguous. It was justice.
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100 Tauren Druid
20770
It's not like Brasael or the shopkeepers were innocents, cut down while they cowered and pleaded for mercy. They were criminals and traitors who chose to violently resist arrest.


Thing is they might have remembered the last dalaran purge... and have little faith that they'd survive with the silver covenant being the ones going round the streets.

Remember the Kirin Tor weren't enforcing Jaina's order... it was the Silver covenant... and organisation that was LOOKING for an excuse to kill the BEs.
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100 Human Warrior
16460
And we still don't know how many sunreavers were horde aligned. There has only ever been 1 confirmed and he was kicked out of the sunreavers for it.


Only the Horde knows of one, I think. Alliance has evidence to imply that the Sunreavers are behind it. Maybe not all of them are. But as far as Alliance knows, It's somewhere between 1 Sunreaver, and every Sunreaver.

The only solution is to remove the Sunreavers from Dalaran and imprison them until proven innocent.
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