Lets suppose we had free speech

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100 Night Elf Druid
17330
This is a discussion forum. If you're unable to post in a civil manner


Am I to take this means that my original post is considered uncivil? I really must lack any social skills because I see nothing uncivil in it.


Your OP was not, which is why you weren't banned for it. However you implied that you would like to be able to spew hateful vile on the forums and not be actioned for it.
Edited by Ziryus on 1/1/2013 2:04 PM PST
69 Orc Death Knight
11095
First, you don't have free speech in private places. Go re-read the First Amendment. It relates to what the government can do about speech, not private entities. If you come to my house and start ranting at me I'm completely within my rights to tell you to shut up or get out. Similarly, Blizzard is a private entity. You have no free speech rights here and are bound by any rules they see fit to create and enforce.

Note, too, that freedom of expression does not mean you're free to say anything without consequences.


To add to this: Blizzard is incredibly lenient compared to many other private venues. Stuff that gets a pass on these forums would get many customers thrown out of bars, for instance.

Also:

01/01/2013 01:35 PMPosted by Bolgar
I do so in logical yet harsh language. Why would you require me to couch frustration in cheery terms? I could say dev so and so is a lazy so and so. Or I could say it sure would be nice if dev so and so worked harder.


Neither of these are useful criticisms, just varying levels of ad hominem attacks. Making them doesn't show any interest in improving the game, they just show you want to put someone down. You don't have to personally like a developer, but saying "work harder" or calling them lazy is spectacularly useless -- explain what, specifically, you feel needs to improve in the game, and how.
Edited by Danvers on 1/1/2013 2:09 PM PST
90 Tauren Paladin
13105
01/01/2013 01:52 PMPosted by Bolgar
This is a discussion forum. If you're unable to post in a civil manner


Am I to take this means that my original post is considered uncivil? I really must lack any social skills because I see nothing uncivil in it.


Which is where the lack of social skills probably comes in.
90 Blood Elf Warlock
0
01/01/2013 02:04 PMPosted by Rygarius


Am I to take this means that my original post is considered uncivil? I really must lack any social skills because I see nothing uncivil in it.


Thanks for partial quoting. The other half of the sentence before it got cut off specify that "If you're unable to post in a civil manner without breaching the Code of Conduct or Forum Guidelines to allow such discussions to take place, please take a deep breath to let passions simmer down, and take a break from the forums."

You are free to post as you wish. I am advising that those posts remain civil without violating the Code of Conduct or Forum Guidelines (You failed at that actually for discussing forum moderation, but I'm giving it a pass.)

P.S. I'm not a moderator. It's one of the many tasks that I undertake.


I am the total opposite of a fanboi, but...

/highfive
90 Human Warlock
12950
01/01/2013 02:04 PMPosted by Rygarius
P.S. I'm not a moderator. It's one of the many tasks that I undertake.


He also has to reset every escort quest in game by flying them back into caves, or so the legends say.
90 Pandaren Priest
12630
yeah i mean you can't even make one gay joke without someone jumping on your case and getting you temp banned.
90 Blood Elf Paladin
0
I dislike something about the game and feel the need to express my frustration and dissatisfaction.

I do so in logical yet harsh language. Why would you require me to couch frustration in cheery terms? I could say dev so and so is a lazy so and so. Or I could say it sure would be nice if dev so and so worked harder.

They both say the same thing. Yet one may get me banned and another merely downvoted.

It's pretty easy to see what the attitude from moderators are in the forums. I would liken them to censors who want a glowing but false picture of what the game is.

I can tell you if these forums were my way of deciding if I was going to try the game out first time I would see all the complaining and the long term unresolved issues and decide it wasn't worth the money or effort.

I don't need a moderator to decide for me what is relevant or properly worded. I resent the ever present arbitrary ban hammer in the forums. Short of outright obscenity or encouraging folks to cheat or worse yet harass each other IRL, we don't need moderators erasing our posts.


If someone were solely basing whether they wanted to try the game or not based on the vitriol on the forums, they'd be foolish. The vast majority of players are in game, playing and having fun. The vocal minority are those that are never happy with ANYTHING, like yourself, and feel the need to constantly complain about everything.

Sure, you're unhappy about something. Great. The game is not tailored to you, 100%. The game is tailored to a wider range of people. Sure, there are some things that could be done better. However, the game will never 100% please you, because things you enjoy are not necessarily enjoyed by others. Thus, Blizzard does the best job they can to find a happy medium that everyone enjoys.

For the record, feel free to check out my posting history. You will see that I am definitely not one of the "Blizz fanboys". I am generally disgruntled about class balance, as well as the disparity of gear over skill in PvP. However, as frustrated as I am, I don't make incessant whine posts, and instead try to provide something more constructive.

p.s. I am, indeed, on my last chance on the forums (I think). And I fully respect that my blunt, harsh comments towards others were deserving of week and month long bans. In the end, there's little justification to swear at people.
Edited by Githany on 1/1/2013 2:12 PM PST
90 Night Elf Hunter
4560
Free speech? Are the mods putting you in jail?

Lets get one thing straight. This forum belongs to Blizzard for the sole use of world of warcraft players to engage in discussion with one another. If Blizzard decides that you are being a jerk, they have an absolute right to delete your post, ban you from the forums or whatever else they choose to do because THIS GAME AND THIS FORUM BELONG TO THEM.

Games are not "for the people by the people" and if game designers don't like the way you are using their software, they can keep you from it. That's their right, you have no rights in this situation.
Edited by Veltor on 1/1/2013 2:09 PM PST
90 Worgen Warrior
7800
01/01/2013 02:06 PMPosted by Bolgar
I wont argue it's their game and they get to do what they want I just greatly dislike censorship in any form.

Then don't post bad stuff and it won't be a problem.
100 Goblin Death Knight
15660
01/01/2013 02:06 PMPosted by Bolgar
You're being really defensive, he's talking about you using harsh language in your other posts you admitted to.


Yes in my frustration I didn't bother to state my criticism in polite terms.


That's not being really civilized, is it?
Edited by Tsizu on 1/1/2013 2:10 PM PST
100 Dwarf Paladin
7195
You can be harsh AND civil at the same time, it isn't difficult. To have a demonstrated inability to communicate doesn't mean you are entitled to vulgarity or any other action that violates the CoC or rules of common decency.

Well written, even if they are harsh, critiques are welcome. Baseless, warrantless attacks with no supporting facts are not welcome.
100 Dwarf Hunter
10265
One of my favorite lyrics: "You know, there's always more than one way, to say exactly what you mean to say."
...
You can be dissatisfied, fed up, frustrated, even furious - and still post in a well-constructed way that gets your point across. Or, you can post in such a way that your thread turns into a flamefest that gets heavily moderated. Guess which one will be more constructive in getting results??
69 Orc Death Knight
11095
01/01/2013 02:06 PMPosted by Bolgar
I wont argue it's their game and they get to do what they want I just greatly dislike censorship in any form.


Mind if I come to where you work and spew invectives at you at the top of my lungs, so that nobody else can be heard?
100 Pandaren Hunter
12725
01/01/2013 01:52 PMPosted by Bolgar
Am I to take this means that my original post is considered uncivil? I really must lack any social skills because I see nothing uncivil in it.
You must really not want the ability to post on these forums.
92 Night Elf Druid
8710
You're being really defensive, he's talking about you using harsh language in your other posts you admitted to.


Yes in my frustration I didn't bother to state my criticism in polite terms.

I just reread the code of conduct the CM linked above, and I parsed the document using an inductive logic formula and what it all basically says what most eulas and online code of conduct say, that is, we do what we want, you accept it or don't use it.

I wont argue it's their game and they get to do what they want I just greatly dislike censorship in any form.


Awesome. Where do you live because I want to come over and call you and your friends names, berate you for lack of taste in home decor and insult your cooking. I'll do this in vulgar, over the top language that is meant to annoy and upset you.* You, of course, will take all of this in stride because you "greatly dislike censorship in any form" right?

*This should be obvious, but I have no intention of really doing any of that.
Edited by Clevmeleon on 1/1/2013 2:11 PM PST
90 Gnome Rogue
12245
01/01/2013 02:06 PMPosted by Bolgar
I wont argue it's their game and they get to do what they want I just greatly dislike censorship in any form.


Sorry. It's there though to spare us from the likes of your anti-censorship posts.
69 Orc Death Knight
11095
You've confused opinions for facts.
90 Worgen Warrior
7800
Thank for that example on how not to post Chasenya.
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