Time To Fix Balance Druid PvP and Patch 5.2

90 Night Elf Druid
6280
Here's a nifty question, of the druids in the audience who here thinks that the folks at blizz actually fully comprehend the boomkin spec?
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90 Night Elf Druid
5640
I wish Blizzard would just address some of Balance druids basal requests. I love my boomie, but it is so frustrating playing in PvP at high ratings. I mean sure I enjoy 2k+ RBG's, but arena is so frustrating due to our lack of movement dps, survivability, and proper sustained damage after our CD's. We are a dot class, yet our main dots barely tickle.

ALLOW MY WRATH SPELL TO GENTLY CARRES YOUR FACES... God knows it does no damage
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90 Night Elf Druid
9180
02/04/2013 07:54 PMPosted by Nexian
Here's a nifty question, of the druids in the audience who here thinks that the folks at blizz actually fully comprehend the boomkin spec?


I think the ones that understand how boomkin works, solely concern themselves with PvE.
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90 Night Elf Druid
8925
I don't play RBGs but i have no problem with surviability as balance. Symbiosis is the greatest surviabilty spell i use. i was shocked to read that pvp power is gonna effect my heals cus i thought i died little enough as is.
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100 Night Elf Druid
7955
02/10/2013 02:23 PMPosted by Dalorath
I don't play RBGs but i have no problem with surviability as balance. Symbiosis is the greatest surviabilty spell i use. i was shocked to read that pvp power is gonna effect my heals cus i thought i died little enough as is.


blizzard doesn't balance around random bgs/world pvp
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90 Night Elf Druid
8495
I completely agree with everything on this thread. Sure there aren't as many boomies as mages, but I feel blizzard should still address the state we are in. We have absolutely no survivability other than !@#$ty heals and our mobility. I love boomkin and it just wouldn't feel right to reroll just to be viable in arena. I could give one %^-* about new classes (as someone said above) I'd rather have blizzard actually try and balance everything for once.

LAZER CHICKENS UNITE!!!
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90 Worgen Druid
11110
BUFF ME DADDY!
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90 Gnome Monk
9940
02/10/2013 02:23 PMPosted by Dalorath
I don't play RBGs but i have no problem with surviability as balance. Symbiosis is the greatest surviabilty spell i use. i was shocked to read that pvp power is gonna effect my heals cus i thought i died little enough as is.

This shocked me as well. But hey I won't complain, now I have even more utility as a lazrchikn :D
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90 Troll Druid
14580
02/11/2013 08:28 PMPosted by Magicrooster
Boomkins need MORE. A sham can spam lightning bolt and move, we should have something similar, we have dots, SO what that doesn't make up for the long cast times which are redundant in all aspects. Long cast times with little damage...BROKEN! Boomkins need a buff and some new passives to make up for this huge gap that is between it and every other caster in this game.

GC had a post/tweet/form-of-communication which stated as follows, (paraphrased) "I don't like Cast While Moving effects." (does not include Instant spells.) So it's extremely unlikely to see this. Rather, everyone else will lose their cast-while-moving effects before we get a cast-while-moving effect.
Edited by Cyous on 2/22/2013 5:16 PM PST
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94 Night Elf Druid
2500
This is my first major contribution to the forums, so I would like to apologize ahead of time for any mistakes I have made.

With 14% crit (which is slightly more than what I have).
moon/sunfire tick 8 times each before expiring, which is a total of 16 ticks per target that I have both dots applied to which means that over the course of my dots ticking is 14 seconds (15 if you count the GCD between the spells) So how many of those "OP boomkin star surge procs" do I get per target? Statistically speaking, 0.73 star surge procs per 14 seconds of dot uptime. Over the course of 16 ticks I will get 2.24 of the 16 to crit, with each crit giving a 33% chance to proc my instant star surge. So in a 1v1 match boomkins can only hope to put out pressure, because we have literally no burst. Now lets go to the 2v2 section of pvp, I still have the 0.73% chance per dot tick to proc an instant star surge, but I can dot both targets and have 32 dot ticks in 17 seconds (again counting gcds) which means that my chance to proc starsurge is now a whooping 1.46% per 17 seconds. Not to mention that in a pvp situation one can not always keep dots active on all targets because our dots break cc. But wait! There is more! Our dots are unlike any other dot class, we have a complete lack of dispel protection. Naturally looking at these facts one can only assume that boomkins are in for a much needed nerf in 5.2! This assumption is what I like to call, dead wrong. You would be very very very very wrong to assume that boomkins need to have their cc (cyclone), their survivability/mobility (Displacer Beast) nerfed. Just because resto druids are considered OP doesnt mean that Balance druids should suffer the same consequences as them.

I'm new to wow, but in 1v1 situation isn't boomkin expected to augment gameplay with other shift forms? against catsters and non-armor melee go as cat, bear against armor melee. for, while you counted one gameplay output, what else is happening in those 14 seconds, one doesn't just sit around, does it?
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I'm trying to think of something to type that isn't incredibly ignorant. I've PvPd on this toon for 3 years now, the majority of my PvP being duels, there are a lot of reasons why I don't arena/RBG, but that's a whole other topic.

I did notice a pretty major buff to Boomkins in patch 4.3.4, the one that introduced the whole talent/glyph rework. And for that I'm still happy, however, I think we are out classed by just about everybody else, and I think a big part of the problem is because of how we are unable to cast anything really in a PvP situation.

I never really considered how bad it was until now, most of my time in duels are spent casting Rejuv, my DoTs, slowing/kiting/stunning and that's about it. I wouldn't mind seeing a buff, but I'd rather see a nerf to the other classes that are borderline broken.
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90 Tauren Druid
3095
Our damage while mobile is directly linked to our crit rate... so as the seasons progress through this xpac our mobility/dps in pvp will continue to go up. Right now it is a bit subpar, but it is probably a self correcting issue.

Not that anyone likes that answer. Being told to be patient is hardly a good answer.

Mostly irrelevant personal anecdotal: I'm fairly twinked out and leveling through pretty much jus BGs, and am rocking just over 50% crit rate... and am extremely mobile. I can full on spam starsurge because of constant procs from my dots. If/when I multidot, it procs multiple times before the GCD is over to use it again. Even still, because it is RNG... every once in a blue moon I'll have a short dry spell for a few seconds where I either have to spam moon/sun fire or stop to hardcast wrath/starfire... and that is fairly annoying. But the difference in my mobility since cranking my critrate through the roof is simply insane.

I really think as the achievable crit % goes up with higher and higher ilevels, we'll start to feel freed up to be mobile while still putting out decent damage.

I'm a pretty big fan of the glyph idea that was mentioned earlier, the one where it allows wrath/starfire to be cast on the move but reducing the damage a little. I think it'd be an awesome addition to our portfolio and still be well balanced. It'd free us up from complete reliance on crit and RNG, and that is generally a good thing.

We'd still be very RNG, but it wouldn't be an all or nothing kind of dependance.
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90 Troll Druid
9465
I think our nukes take too long to cast, as I've seen read here. All mages now get Scorch, cast while moving, the 3 specs have a instant cast spell that hits hard.
I'd like to see Wild Mushrooms become a debuff like a DOT, but I can pick the detonate time.
I'd like to see both DOTs applied at the same time so I'm not spending GCDs casting each.
I'd like to be able to go into prowl when in combat.

If I could get Solar beam to stick to the caster I threw it on to stay still for three seconds.....I could hit them with....a weak nuke(?)
I'm not sure that we're broken though.
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90 Tauren Druid
0
I love playing boomkin. This latest patch gave us some nice buffs. Yesterday I soloed a warrior, ret and frost Mage by getting zerker buff and blowing CDs...all 3 dropped at virtually same time. Back to back starsurge procs.

I've been toying around with solar beam vortex and mass entanglement combo and I'm digging it. Healers get thrown for a loop and get stuck in there for at least another 2 seconds.
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100 Night Elf Druid
6085
I agree with more or less everything the op posted. However i tend to shy away from talk about big buffs like what you proposed for my favorite spec. My biggest fear is the day blizzard decides to give us the buffs we have always needed, and in doing so over buff us. We all know that id that happens the nerf hammer will hurt twice as hard and we would probably just be completely unviable.
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100 Tauren Druid
10250
This is my first major contribution to the forums, so I would like to apologize ahead of time for any mistakes I have made.

With 14% crit (which is slightly more than what I have).
moon/sunfire tick 8 times each before expiring, which is a total of 16 ticks per target that I have both dots applied to which means that over the course of my dots ticking is 14 seconds (15 if you count the GCD between the spells) So how many of those "OP boomkin star surge procs" do I get per target? Statistically speaking, 0.73 star surge procs per 14 seconds of dot uptime. Over the course of 16 ticks I will get 2.24 of the 16 to crit, with each crit giving a 33% chance to proc my instant star surge. So in a 1v1 match boomkins can only hope to put out pressure, because we have literally no burst. Now lets go to the 2v2 section of pvp, I still have the 0.73% chance per dot tick to proc an instant star surge, but I can dot both targets and have 32 dot ticks in 17 seconds (again counting gcds) which means that my chance to proc starsurge is now a whooping 1.46% per 17 seconds. Not to mention that in a pvp situation one can not always keep dots active on all targets because our dots break cc. But wait! There is more! Our dots are unlike any other dot class, we have a complete lack of dispel protection. Naturally looking at these facts one can only assume that boomkins are in for a much needed nerf in 5.2! This assumption is what I like to call, dead wrong. You would be very very very very wrong to assume that boomkins need to have their cc (cyclone), their survivability/mobility (Displacer Beast) nerfed. Just because resto druids are considered OP doesnt mean that Balance druids should suffer the same consequences as them.

I'm new to wow, but in 1v1 situation isn't boomkin expected to augment gameplay with other shift forms? against catsters and non-armor melee go as cat, bear against armor melee. for, while you counted one gameplay output, what else is happening in those 14 seconds, one doesn't just sit around, does it?


Our dps in any other form (unless you take the first column talent in the last row) is crap. It literally does no dmg worth mentioning. The point is that we don't have any augmentation that benefits a caster (shifting to bear for some health armor but can't cast spells or heal in that form). And most of that 14 seconds we are feared/stunned/silenced/or some other form of CC in which we are getting pounded.

I firmly believe making the pvp trinket apply a buff that makes you immune to stuns/fears for 3 seconds after the use is a key to improving our survivability while not altering our class abilities (this also means that we couldn't chain cyclone someone, but hey that's ok by me).
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100 Tauren Druid
10250
Honestly, if the solar beam acted like a debuff instead of an area effect that silenced others within ten yards of that caster, our survivability and dmg would see an increase. Also bring back the three charge nature's grasp and maybe the dmg for typhoon (for those that use it)
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90 Tauren Druid
0
I love boomkin pvp in RBG and arena. We shine beat in RBG with aoe grip beam obviously. We aren't as strong in arena I agree. I have only recently been doing arena with some friends on my boomy at lower ratings. Can't really compare us to the other power houses in arena but its difficult to balance is in arena without making us OP in RBGs. I've found that in arena, we are extremely cool down dependent.

Timing big CDs with solar beam against healer comps is only way to kill targets, but it's like that regardless of class. With the exception of KFC, as their sustained damage is strong and their strategy is to just constantly keep applying pressure.

TLDR

We are still very strong in RBGs due to solar beam vortex combo and our AOE melts face with CDs up. Our nukes got a decent buff. It's be nice to have more strength in arena but overall I think we are in good shape.
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