An angry tank rant... (Second Edition)

90 Troll Warlock
7565
01/07/2013 03:50 AMPosted by Mineva
DPS players, I have to ask you: Do you know -why- you have such long queues, especially at lower levels?


Actually, my experience with the lowbie levels is that DPS doesn't have long wait queues.

I claim that's because the tank supply is greater at the lower levels, mainly because the effort you need to tank is much less than at endgame. the playerbase is all about minimizing effort and maximizing reward.

But "Re: Teh Tanking Shortage" - the tank role shoulders a larger part of the 5man burden than dps does. This alone will guarantee less people playing tanks (again the playerbase is all about maximum reward for least effort) and the way the game is built, tanks are not a least effort role to play. People are still willing to play tanks, but only if the reward matches the effort. In order to guarantee a decent supply of tanks, Blizzard basically has to pay them to queue. Witness the rise of the CTA bag of compensation.

Or to put it in terms that the 12 year olds can understand - you're willing to complain about waiting in line as dps, but if you play a class that can tank (and a lot of you do) you can't be bothered to do something about it by switching to the tanking role. I'm not judging you, for the most part you've figured out that the effort is not worth the reward and it's easier (minimum effort) to just complain about it while you wait.

In the endgame raiding world, the low supply of tanks doesn't really matter too much, because the demand matches the supply. And your raid MT also tends to be one of the officers in the guild, so the rewards of raid tanking are somewhat different than the other roles.
Reply Quote
90 Troll Warlock
7565
01/08/2013 06:42 AMPosted by Mineva
The healer then proceeded to say in party chat that if I kept running off, I would get no more heals.


5man Tanking 101:

1. When in doubt, cover your !@# with a readycheck
2. Know your healer. That means making sure the healer is at the keyboard, that the healer has adequate mana, and that the healer is still in range to heal you
3. You pull it, you tank it. You have to make sure your healer lives. You don't have to make sure anyone else lives.
4. If the healer sucks, there's no real point in telling the healer, s/he'll just get mad at you and heal even worse than before. If you're doing your job, and the healer isn't doing his, just leave when you meet the dungeon timer requirements.
Reply Quote
the simple answer to this is put in a server only option so that people that dont want to deal with the nameless faceless masses from other servers that they will never see again never have to.

Ever since LFD was added as a cross server funtion the groups have become less social more gogo and more and more tanks like myself are sick of it.

Before LFD we pugged up a group in the zone or in trade and generally met people and added them to our friends list eventually you'd start running with them more and more and you would still pug up some but you'd end up joining or making a guild with these people.

With LFD theres no reason to be social or even work as a team all they want is there loot and they want it now the go go's have taken over the game and blizz is not doing anything to help it with adding more cross realm options .

LFD as I said from day one will ruin this game.
Reply Quote
90 Human Paladin
12045
01/07/2013 05:28 PMPosted by Rivaeon
It's pissing me off more lately as a healer though, because not all tanks are good about getting that aggro back immediately, meaning I have to panic heal damage the DPS shouldn't have been taking in the first place.


If somebody is consistently pulling off me without taunts, I've got bigger problems than the dps in my group. If somebody is pulling groups for me, I stick with the healer. If the healer wants the dps to stay alive I don't care what the dps does, I'm gonna tank the mobs. If the healer wants to let them die, I'm good with that too, and will pick them up when the derp is down. If somebody other than me taunts I taunt the mob back once. If the problem persists (like somebody's got their pet on Tenacity w/growl) they get to learn how to tank.

Early in Cata I seriously struggled for threat. I used to blow both taunts, stun mobs, and run myself ragged trying to keep everybody alive any time I didn't have the best gear in the group. I was an emotional wreck going into heroic dungeons because I knew I would use every tool available to me and still fail if the group was well geared. I read everything I could find about bears, the class I was playing at the time, and was lucky enough to have a co tank that was a far more serious tank than I am ever likely to be. He pointed me to Big Bear Butt with the comment that I just needed to read one of the greats if I was going to learn how to do the job. The above paragraph was what I took from the first post I read.

I like to chain pull. Another tank somewhere here in the tank forums said he likes to keep the healers mana somewhere in the 30 - 40% range. I never thought about it that much, but I like to do something similar, though I usually like to let the healer stay above 50%. I'm trying to let the newer healers have enough pressure to learn without the soul crushing failures, and the experienced healers hopefully will tell me if they can take more.

Everybody wants to chain pull. Everybody wants to see their dps top the chart. Me too. I do remember that floor tanking is less dps than slow tanking.
Reply Quote
100 Tauren Paladin
17795
02/21/2013 02:14 PMPosted by Leodin
the simple answer to this is put in a server only option so that people that dont want to deal with the nameless faceless masses from other servers that they will never see again never have to.


Might be better to make LFD server/realID/Battletag only base and have an option to get randoms from other server. To me this option would best be locked/unlocked based on post dungeon evaluations done by the rest of the group, ranging from -5 (absolute horror to run with) to +5 (best person I have had the pleasure of running with). Guildmates would of course not be allowed to rank each other (to keep the numbers from being artificially skewed) and in the case of the non-guild mate being rated universally bad ratings would backfire on the guild (I.E. 4 guild mates, 1 PuG, all guild mates give the PuG ratings from -3 to -5, all members of that guild get hit with the total rank deduction).

This could also be aranged, without the tie to x-realms, to keep people of similar rankings together, I.E. lower rankings (trash) with trash, polite players with polite, etc.
Reply Quote
02/22/2013 01:02 PMPosted by Ujarak
the simple answer to this is put in a server only option so that people that dont want to deal with the nameless faceless masses from other servers that they will never see again never have to.


Might be better to make LFD server/realID/Battletag only base and have an option to get randoms from other server. To me this option would best be locked/unlocked based on post dungeon evaluations done by the rest of the group, ranging from -5 (absolute horror to run with) to +5 (best person I have had the pleasure of running with). Guildmates would of course not be allowed to rank each other (to keep the numbers from being artificially skewed) and in the case of the non-guild mate being rated universally bad ratings would backfire on the guild (I.E. 4 guild mates, 1 PuG, all guild mates give the PuG ratings from -3 to -5, all members of that guild get hit with the total rank deduction).

This could also be aranged, without the tie to x-realms, to keep people of similar rankings together, I.E. lower rankings (trash) with trash, polite players with polite, etc.


you always run into one idiot that will give everyone the -5 just to grief them so leaveing that up to the player base wont.
Reply Quote
100 Tauren Paladin
17795
02/22/2013 12:48 PMPosted by Isindre
Everybody wants to chain pull. Everybody wants to see their dps top the chart. Me too. I do remember that floor tanking is less dps than slow tanking.


One thing: tanks also enjoy is fast runs, true we do get faster queues but we also have other things to do in additon to tanking/valor capping. However, for a tank like me a fast run might be 15 miniutes when DPS seems to want 13 miniuet ones and we also try to get through the instance without !@#$ hitting fan often enough so the fan take a perminant shade of brown.
Reply Quote
100 Tauren Paladin
17795
02/22/2013 01:06 PMPosted by Leodin
you always run into one idiot that will give everyone the -5 just to grief them so leaveing that up to the player base wont.


Yeah, need to make it a two-edged sword, like the final ranking is based on the rankings you give the other members combined with the rankings you got from them, example:

Griefer A gives scores of: -5, -5, -5, -5 total=-20
Griefer A gets scorse of: +1, -3, +3, +4 total=+5
Total rank change=-15

But there is a reason why I put LFD as server/realID/battletag only as base, reputation on server would be more effective then any ranking system randoms cold ever use and even those of us that get our ranking high might not want to group with PuGs ever.
Reply Quote
02/22/2013 01:10 PMPosted by Ujarak
One thing: tanks also enjoy is fast runs, true we do get faster queues but we also have other things to do in additon to tanking/valor capping. However, for a tank like me a fast run might be 15 miniutes when DPS seems to want 13 miniuet ones and we also try to get through the instance without !@#$ hitting fan often enough so the fan take a perminant shade of brown.


I hate this speed run crap I miss cc I miss thinknig in the dungeons I miss the Cata ones and bc ones when there we at level you accually had to think instead of mindlessly roll your face on the keys while texting away on your phone.
Reply Quote
100 Tauren Paladin
17795
02/22/2013 07:33 PMPosted by Leodin
I hate this speed run crap I miss cc I miss thinknig in the dungeons I miss the Cata ones and bc ones when there we at level you accually had to think instead of mindlessly roll your face on the keys while texting away on your phone.


Looks like someone did not think things through, tanks want fast yet SAFE runs. This might mean slowing the run down a few seconds for CC, planning for "kill zones", etc. As tanks, and DPS/healers get gear, less CC and the like will of course be needed but that should still be up to the tank.

To put it another way:
Tanks: speed run for us could be anything from 15 min to 1 hour, depending on the size of the dungeon and the controll needed.
DPS/lealers (the "gogogo" kind): if it takes more then 10 miniutes it is too long
Reply Quote
90 Troll Warlock
7565
02/21/2013 02:14 PMPosted by Leodin
the simple answer to this is put in a server only option so that people that dont want to deal with the nameless faceless masses from other servers that they will never see again never have to.


I'd definitely queue more often on my tank if I had a choice like that, even if the wait was longer. Tanking with people who know they have some "social skin" in the game, makes people behave nicer and makes everything more fun.
Reply Quote
51 Troll Druid
4735
3. You pull it, you tank it. You have to make sure your healer lives. You don't have to make sure anyone else lives.


This
Reply Quote
90 Blood Elf Paladin
3810
I know when I am in 5 mans and a blue square goes up, it tends to take me a second to go..oh you want a trap lol

Its been a long time since we have had to use cc, blizzard dont go out of the way to make it necessary in pve anymore. Pvp on the other hand .......
Reply Quote

Please report any Code of Conduct violations, including:

Threats of violence. We take these seriously and will alert the proper authorities.

Posts containing personal information about other players. This includes physical addresses, e-mail addresses, phone numbers, and inappropriate photos and/or videos.

Harassing or discriminatory language. This will not be tolerated.

Forums Code of Conduct

Report Post # written by

Reason
Explain (256 characters max)
Submit Cancel

Reported!

[Close]