Judgment in pvp.

97 Blood Elf Paladin
9815
So is anyone else noticing judgment hitting for much less in pvp.
When using judgment in pve it hits for around 45-36k and crusader strike for about 40-36k, but when i go to pvp my crusader strike will average around 20-16k on similarly geared players and judgment hits about 12-8k. With inquisition up judgment will hit for around 16k while Crusader strike hits about the same, maybe a 2k increase in damage.
Anyone know what's going on here, or no one else having this problem.
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Resilience. If youre pvp power is not equal to or greater than the resilience of the opponent, your damage will be less in pvp than it is in pve.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
11140
01/14/2013 05:52 PMPosted by Omalli
Resilience. If youre pvp power is not equal to or greater than the resilience of the opponent, your damage will be less in pvp than it is in pve.


I believe it doesn't work that way.

Let's say you have 50% pvp power.

Your opponent has 50% resilience.

You hit your opponent for 100 damage. Resilience chops it in half, so it comes out as 50 damage. Your pvp power is 50%, which increases that damage AFTER RESILIENCE by 50%, which will be 75 damage.

So really, you will NEVER do the same amount of damage you're doing to someone in pvp than in pve.

Someone correct me if im wrong, though.
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100 Blood Elf Paladin
9935
Judgment should hit harder than CS in PVE and PVP. It could hit less if you're casting it without Inquisition up or inq is glyphed, though.

Perhaps your data is off because it was collected from different opponents, meaning a varying level of resilience, or you had different buffs up, or maybe there were unaccounted Cds or procs. CS procs an increase in pvp power for a few seconds, which you may have overlooked.

And I'm pretty sure you're right, Charms.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
5110
So really, you will NEVER do the same amount of damage you're doing to someone in pvp than in pve.

Someone correct me if im wrong, though.


Thats right (although I think the damage gets boosted first - doesnt really matter however). But if you hit someone without any PvP equipment (so, 40% resilience) with over 66,67% PvP power (which is impossible to obtain), you would still do the same damage. 100 * 1,6667 * 0,6 = ~100.

The differences may come from different armor values. Judgment should always hits more consistently than CS, and even harder with targets with ~40%+ armor. Considering my values, I hit for around 14k with Judgment (no buffs) and an average of 22k with CS + Mastery (no armor) on my PvP equipment. PvP power/resilience will affect both the same way, but CS got affected by armor, which can be as high as 50% for a holy paladin, or as low as 25% with a warlock (as far as I can tell). I dont know about PvE armor values, if they are constant or not though.

Judgement scales better with str increase - and get direct affected by Inquisition; it also has the glyph which raises its damage by an additional 20%. CS only got 4% increase by Judgment' debuff and got affected by Mastery (with itself got affected by Inquisition), other than AW and HA. So it really depends on the target armor and on how buffs you were under. So check that in both PvE and PvP scenarios to see why your Judgment is hitting for so low.
Edited by Syros on 1/14/2013 8:01 PM PST
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
6645
Pvp power acts as a damage multiplier.
Lets say your TV hits for 100k.
If you have 50% pvp power, you will hit a target for 150k.
If your target has resilience at 50% (everyone has a baseline resilience of 40% without pvp gear) you'll actually be hitting them for a total of 75k.
If you have no pvp power then you would hit the same target for 50k.
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70 Blood Elf Paladin
8965
01/14/2013 05:58 PMPosted by Charms
Resilience. If youre pvp power is not equal to or greater than the resilience of the opponent, your damage will be less in pvp than it is in pve.


I believe it doesn't work that way.

Let's say you have 50% pvp power.

Your opponent has 50% resilience.

You hit your opponent for 100 damage. Resilience chops it in half, so it comes out as 50 damage. Your pvp power is 50%, which increases that damage AFTER RESILIENCE by 50%, which will be 75 damage.

So really, you will NEVER do the same amount of damage you're doing to someone in pvp than in pve.

Someone correct me if im wrong, though.


I believe PvP power activates before the Resilience reduction

Source: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/6490579264
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100 Blood Elf Paladin
9935
Resil and pvp power are both multipliers, so it doesnt matter which is affected first.
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90 Human Paladin
9970
Multiplication is commutative, so which happens first is kinda irrelevant.

A player in PvP gear has in the ballpark of 60% resilience, so you hit them for 40% normal damage. Even with 50% PvP Power, you only get back up to 60% of normal damage - and that's not to mention that players frequently have better passive and active defenses than NPCs do. So yes, in PvP you should indeed be seeing lower numbers than you do in PvE.
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