"Remove flying mounts"middle ground solution?

90 Human Warlock
5390
01/18/2013 09:39 AMPosted by Yandere
For the record, I'm not anti flying. I'm pro immersion, and I do feel that the game would be better with some restrictions on flight. What I suggested was pretty minor. On any long flight, you could remount the moment you landed, since the 2 minute timer would be up. All it would really prevent is players mounting up between every set of mobs and quest objectives.


Why?

What is gained through fighting through a bunch of pointless mobs?

What's enjoyable and immersive about it?
90 Draenei Death Knight
8220
01/18/2013 09:39 AMPosted by Yandere
On any long flight, you could remount the moment you landed, since the 2 minute timer would be up. All it would really prevent is players mounting up between every set of mobs and quest objectives.


Then you don't mount up and be immersed into your own world. Why does it matter to you whether or not I fly from one mob to another?
90 Human Warlock
12950
01/18/2013 09:39 AMPosted by Meshkah
The point is that flying killed world pvp for the most part.


I'm a PvEr, I chose a PvE realm to reflect that.

I honestly don't care about WPvP personally, so why should flying be hindered for PvErs because of it?
90 Human Paladin
10690
recall mentioning quest objectives. I don't recall mentioning PvP. Critique the argument, not the poster. Blizzard has stated on numerous times that the ability to fly between quest objectives has hurt immersion and if they had the chance to do it over, flight would be more restricted. I just suggested how that could be accomplished.


Bliz has also mentioned multiple times that the game doesn't really start until max level and they like to get people through questing to max level asap, so they are talking out of both sides of their mouths at the same time...they want quests done at warp 99 so you can "avoid questing anymore and get on to 'the real game' asap". Removing/restricting flight would slow that, which would be contrary to their other statement of wanting you to get through questing asap.


Sounds like a gross misinterpretation of something Blizzard said.


The people campaigning for change are the people that don't want others to fly, not themselves. If they really don't want to fly themselves, they have a simple way to accomplish that...don't mount up on a flying mount.


This is false, and I'd appreciate it you'd provide your own opinions instead of telling me what mine are. Consider the following scenario: you love the immersive feeling of being on the ground, but don't want to fight the mobs in front of you. What do you do? You mount up and fly over them, breaking the immersion. Players will often take the easiest path even if it ultimately doesn't lead to the most satisfying result. This is why games have restrictions.

People really need to stop trying to take away from other people the parts of the game they need and enjoy. Bliz is fine with flying. They added it in outland, made it possible in Lich King, and again in Cata the expanded it further, and even ultimately implemented it in mop. They obviously do not have a problem with it, or they wouldn't keep going out of their way to implement it.


They restricted in Wrath and MoP for leveling and said not restricting in Cata was a mistake. That doesn't sound like something they're fine with. It's a choice they made in TBC that they have to live with.
Edited by Yandere on 1/18/2013 9:47 AM PST
MVP
90 Human Mage
10015

For the record, I'm not anti flying. I'm pro immersion, and I do feel that the game would be better with some restrictions on flight. What I suggested was pretty minor. On any long flight, you could remount the moment you landed, since the 2 minute timer would be up. All it would really prevent is players mounting up between every set of mobs and quest objectives.


I'm pro-immersion as well, I just don't think arbitrary limitations on flight serve to improve immersion. And I think simply disabling the "can fly" flag on an area (which I realize is not your suggestion, but it is happening in the new quest zone in 5.2) serve to really hurt immersion.

If they want to discourage flight, they should use an in-game mechanic to do so: flak cannons, angry flying mobs, etc. Frankly, though, I don't think they should discourage it. Instead, they should make it potentially hazardous everywhere. Make me want to watch the skies for enemy patrols or elite flying mobs as I fly. Make it really dangerous to point myself in a direction and go AFK.
90 Orc Shaman
19875
I feel like flying is only really a problem at the beginning of expansions (they seem to have the solution to that down fairly well) and world PvP.

To that end I think it would be best to just not let you mount a flyer for 5 minutes after killing the typical "honorless target". Basically if you're ganking lowbies and their friends show up to give you some balanced PvP you're going to have to hoof it or hearth if you're going to run away.

Right now flying mounts are almost a Get out of Jail Forever card.

I'm really looking forward to having a new zone with no flying in it though =)
Edited by Ninetales on 1/18/2013 9:51 AM PST
85 Blood Elf Warlock
11965
you know i just cancelled my account just because the current system of doing dailies for just anything, also i dont feel any interest in the next patch because it means more dailies plus a non flying zone, i am still able to play and post for the remaining time is left before my sub ends
maybe i will come back sometime if there is anything that looks fun enough to make it work but if blizzard ever removes the flying mounts from the game i can tell you i will never renew my sub again
100 Human Priest
13840
Here's the real compromize you are looking for:

PvP realms across the board:
Turn the whole world into a bg for world pvp by disabling/restricting flying by whatever means you like.
Leave CRZ in for world pvp so people on low pop areas have people to pvp with.

PvE realms across the board:
Leave flying alone as the only reason presented so far has to do with world pvp anyhow.
Remove CRZ as it has countless detriments for pve with the only real benefit being world pvp related (other benefits are much better served by realid grouping, with which you get all the benefits and none of the detriments).

If you REALLY are looking for a compromise, and not just looking for the ability to grief others, that's a compromise.

I expect the outcry from pvp realm people would be as high as that coming from the pve realm people though, so it's still never going to happen.
90 Blood Elf Priest
13010
01/18/2013 08:16 AMPosted by Rixus
Whaaaaaat... Why do we need a solution for flying? WTF is with these topics people are making where flying suddenly became some kind of problem?


Its because of pvp server crybabies who are upset their victims can res-mount-fly away.
100 Human Priest
13840
01/18/2013 09:52 AMPosted by Tyan
Its because of pvp server crybabies who are upset their victims can res-mount-fly away.


^^QFT
90 Human Paladin
10690
01/18/2013 09:45 AMPosted by Tessa
For the record, I'm not anti flying. I'm pro immersion, and I do feel that the game would be better with some restrictions on flight. What I suggested was pretty minor. On any long flight, you could remount the moment you landed, since the 2 minute timer would be up. All it would really prevent is players mounting up between every set of mobs and quest objectives.


Why?

What is gained through fighting through a bunch of pointless mobs?

What's enjoyable and immersive about it?


What's immersive about it? Do I really need to answer that? Being actively involved in the game world is immersion.

Exploration is a big part of an RPG. Sometimes that means fighting mobs you don't want to fight, sometimes that means plotting a route around them. People complain all the time about how boring dailies are. It's just kill 10 of this, 12 of that etc. Part of that boredom stems from not having to do anything other than your quest objective. The game world should be a (slightly) scary place. Safety shouldn't always be a click away, you shouldn't be able to skip everything you don't want to do.
90 Human Warlock
12950
01/18/2013 09:55 AMPosted by Yandere
Exploration is a big part of an RPG.


& flying makes exploring much more fun.
100 Human Priest
13840
What's immersive about it? Do I really need to answer that? Being actively involved in the game world is immersion.

Exploration is a big part of an RPG. Sometimes that means fighting mobs you don't want to fight, sometimes that means plotting a route around them. People complain all the time about how boring dailies are. It's just kill 10 of this, 12 of that etc. Part of that boredom stems from not having to do anything other than your quest objective. The game world should be a (slightly) scary place. Safety shouldn't always be a click away, you shouldn't be able to skip everything you don't want to do.


Again...simple solution...don't mount. Tada....you are there. If you have that little self control, remove the icon from your action bar. Don't try to alter the game for everyone else just because you don't trust yourself not to click. Find a group of like minded people if you want and group with them...the player base is plenty big for that to happen.
Edited by Adiathna on 1/18/2013 9:58 AM PST
90 Human Paladin
10690
Here's the real compromize you are looking for:

PvP realms across the board:
Turn the whole world into a bg for world pvp by disabling/restricting flying by whatever means you like.
Leave CRZ in for world pvp so people on low pop areas have people to pvp with.

PvE realms across the board:
Leave flying alone as the only reason presented so far has to do with world pvp anyhow.
Remove CRZ as it has countless detriments for pve with the only real benefit being world pvp related (other benefits are much better served by realid grouping, with which you get all the benefits and none of the detriments).

If you REALLY are looking for a compromise, and not just looking for the ability to grief others, that's a compromise.

I expect the outcry from pvp realm people would be as high as that coming from the pve realm people though, so it's still never going to happen.


There's no point in reasoning with you. You still a) don't understand what compromise means and b) can't fathom that there are other reasons to restrict flying besides PvP.
90 Human Paladin
10690
What's immersive about it? Do I really need to answer that? Being actively involved in the game world is immersion.

Exploration is a big part of an RPG. Sometimes that means fighting mobs you don't want to fight, sometimes that means plotting a route around them. People complain all the time about how boring dailies are. It's just kill 10 of this, 12 of that etc. Part of that boredom stems from not having to do anything other than your quest objective. The game world should be a (slightly) scary place. Safety shouldn't always be a click away, you shouldn't be able to skip everything you don't want to do.


Again...simple solution...don't mount. Tada....you are there. If you have that little self control, remove the icon from your action bar. Don't try to alter the game for everyone else just because you don't trust yourself not to click. Find a group of like minded people if you want and group with them...the player base is plenty big for that to happen.


The player base by in large doesn't have self control. Again that's why games have restrictions in the first place. Consider the following: if Heroic Raid gear could be purchased from a vendor, who would raid?
2 Human Monk
0
I got the absolute perfect solution for flying and any problem associated with it. DON'T USE IT IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT

For instance, if you think flying cheapens the world immersion experience, RIDE A GROUND MOUNT

About the only people not happy with said solution is the sadistic !@#$%^-*!ers who think everyone should be grounded so they can go along on their gankfest. In which case I give them a hearty middle finger salute.

I paid a crapton for flying (including epic flying on any alt capable of flight and I got over 15 of said alts). I damn well expect to use it anywhere and everywhere flying is possible.
90 Human Paladin
10690
01/18/2013 09:56 AMPosted by Killercaitie
Exploration is a big part of an RPG.


& flying makes exploring much more fun.


I don't recall suggesting their removal.
85 Blood Elf Warlock
11965
if you want immersion go a RPPVE/RPPVP server and get immersed all you want to i liked the freedom of being able to go whenever i wanted without any restriction other than the game ones, flying around on any of my mounts was one the few thing i always enjoyed on this game regardless of the expansion, i guess you are the kind of player that enjoyed having to run all the way from the wetlands to tirisfal glades to do your first scarlet monastery run back when there weren't summoning stones
100 Human Priest
13840
01/18/2013 09:58 AMPosted by Yandere
There's no point in reasoning with you. You still a) don't understand what compromise means and b) can't fathom that there are other reasons to restrict flying besides PvP.


You've presented no argument that hasn't been addressed...by multiple people...exhaustively. Stomping feet and trying to act like you are being logical after having all your points defeated by multiple people doesn't lend strength to your stance...in fact, it weakens it by showing you are unwilling to listen to logical reason.

Had you stated you didn't want to fly, that's one thing. That's fine. The instant you try to start taking away things others have, you show your true stance right there. No.
90 Human Paladin
10690
01/18/2013 09:48 AMPosted by Lhivera
I'm pro-immersion as well, I just don't think arbitrary limitations on flight serve to improve immersion. And I think simply disabling the "can fly" flag on an area (which I realize is not your suggestion, but it is happening in the new quest zone in 5.2) serve to really hurt immersion.


I don't agree with that approach either. I don't see how my suggestion is out of line though. Numerous spells have cooldowns, it's not really a foreign concept in this game.

01/18/2013 09:48 AMPosted by Lhivera
f they want to discourage flight, they should use an in-game mechanic to do so: flak cannons, angry flying mobs, etc. Frankly, though, I don't think they should discourage it. Instead, they should make it potentially hazardous everywhere. Make me want to watch the skies for enemy patrols or elite flying mobs as I fly. Make it really dangerous to point myself in a direction and go AFK.


Snowfox brought that up before, it would probably be a good idea.
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