Are Resto Druids Really *That* Bad?

90 Night Elf Druid
10390
01/21/2013 04:02 PMPosted by Fangthorn
He was talking about nourish, and it WAS the go-to direct heal in wrath....


Yeah, I was referring to Nourish. The guy I posted said it was "really good", which is kinda a huge exaggeration =/

Nourish was really not that incredible back then. It never has been, as far as I know. (I was very casual in Cata, though - I can't speak for then).
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100 Worgen Druid
12800
But that's the problem, what should another player do, sit there at full mana and "be nice".

The problem is the word, sniping implies it is intentionally done by others plays in some malicious way... I have always found that to be silly. They are just playing like you are. While I may have problems with the druid tool-kit and tuning, I have never found myself blaming other healers.

Unless other healers are being so competitive that they are ooming themselves and causing wipes, they are doing exactly what they SHOULD be doing.
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100 Worgen Druid
12800
01/21/2013 04:47 PMPosted by Gilthemar
He was talking about nourish, and it WAS the go-to direct heal in wrath....


Yeah, I was referring to Nourish. The guy I posted said it was "really good", which is kinda a huge exaggeration =/

Nourish was really not that incredible back then. It never has been, as far as I know. (I was very casual in Cata, though - I can't speak for then).


Its healing was increased when HOTS were on a target, 20% baseline for any HOT, and an additional 6% for each hot when glyphed. It was fast and cheap. With lifebloom allowed on mutiple targets, and regrowths at 21 seconds, it was easy to get 3-4 Hots on multiple players concurrently and spamming nourish on them was a go to move...

It was an great spell and heavily used.
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Something that bothered me... I ranked number 14 on heroic Garalon, meanwhile, a shaman guildie who healed more than me, only ranked 165.. and the disc priest guildie that did better than BOTH of us... didn't rank at all.

I felt kinda badass for ranking that well on a fight that's all about pushing the limits of your class...(DONT SHOOT ME DOWN!) yet the priest who didn't rank at all, beat us both without even making a mark on the log rankings.

*shrug*

Guess I just wish the lil druid paw leaf could be up there with the *actual* highest rankings of this fight. It feels like the best that I can do for my class, doesn't even compare to what other classes can do for theirs.

(Sorry if that didn't make sense... I've had a few coors lights lol)
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90 Troll Druid
HC
12650
01/21/2013 04:02 PMPosted by Fangthorn
Either you use your HOT based tool-kit and get "sniped", or don't heal at all

He means the other healers shouldn't be casting big heals on someone that's currently Rejuv'd (unless they're going to die). Otherwise they're sniping rejuv.
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85 Blood Elf Mage
5510
01/21/2013 05:41 PMPosted by Fleurs
He means the other healers shouldn't be casting big heals on someone that's currently Rejuv'd (unless they're going to die). Otherwise they're sniping rejuv.


But surely with the spikiness of damage this tier they are running a risk by *not* sniping rejuv?
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90 Troll Druid
HC
12650
He means the other healers shouldn't be casting big heals on someone that's currently Rejuv'd (unless they're going to die). Otherwise they're sniping rejuv.


But surely with the spikiness of damage this tier they are running a risk by *not* sniping rejuv?

There's a point in time where the damage patterns and your spells healing capability become second nature, so that you can know whether the need of a heal is dire, or if they will survive without you taking over and topping them off. I mean, fights like Garalon, no one needs to be topped until Crush happens (minus the tanks/pheromone kiter). But how many people do you wanna bet tried to keep everyone at 100% the entire time?

edit: I will say, a lot of what I just said ^ also comes down to the synergy you have with your co-healers. If you guys don't have good synergy, you can definitely count on seeing a ton of sniping.
Edited by Fleurs on 1/21/2013 5:56 PM PST
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90 Blood Elf Priest
13110
01/21/2013 05:53 PMPosted by Fleurs
edit: I will say, a lot of what I just said ^ also comes down to the synergy you have with your co-healers. If you guys don't have good synergy, you can definitely count on seeing a ton of sniping.


^^

If you don't trust your fellow co-healers, then there are bigger problems there.
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100 Worgen Druid
12800
Either you use your HOT based tool-kit and get "sniped", or don't heal at all

He means the other healers shouldn't be casting big heals on someone that's currently Rejuv'd (unless they're going to die). Otherwise they're sniping rejuv.


Of course this is from a 25 man perspective:

That's just not gonna happen, nor should it happen. I would be surprised to even find a healer who actively tracks other heals in that fashion... Where does it stop, riptides? Shields? Etc.. etc..

I remember I went through a phase where I tracked shields, and even other hots. My goal was to get better rejuv coverage with a second druid, and avoid over-healing on shielded people. Ultimately I found it was a total waste of time and an information overload.

In general though, I think that if any healer actually limits their healing for that reason, they are just making the encounter harder. As I said earlier, the only reason any healer should control their healing is their own mana. If they can afford the mana to cast that big heal, they should. If the healing is so light that you can worry about "sharing" then drop a healer.

IME the best healing groups are the ones that gobble up healing deficits like a pack of rabid dogs fighting over a food dish. Thats what keeps people up when they stand in bad stuff or bad stuff happens. That is with two simple rules; overlapping major raid cd's is a waste, as current raid design requires them separated, and OOMing yourself while doing the above makes you bad.
Edited by Fangthorn on 1/21/2013 6:28 PM PST
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90 Blood Elf Priest
13110
Of course this is from a 25 man perspective:

That's just not gonna happen, nor should it happen. I would be surprised to even find a healer who actively tracks other heals in that fashion... Where does it stop, riptides? Shields? Etc.. etc..

I remember I went through a phase where I tracked shields, and even other hots. My goal was to get better rejuv coverage with a second druid, and avoid over-healing on shielded people. Ultimately I found it was a total waste of time and an information overload.

If any healer actually limits their healing for that reason, they are just making the encounter harder and becoming a worse healer in the process. As I said earlier, the only reason any healer should control their healing is their own mana. If they can afford the mana to cast that big heal, they should.


Coming from a 10 man perspective, I don't track other people's HOTs, either (primarily because I just don't have room for the extra icons on my bars). But most of the content this tier has predictable burst damage. You know, if you have done more than one pull, when the damage is going to come. So if you know there's a lull, why are you losing your mind (as a Disc Priest anyway) trying to burst people back up, when Disc Priests frankly suck at healing people back up?

Just my thought process.
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90 Worgen Druid
6550
01/21/2013 04:47 PMPosted by Gilthemar
He was talking about nourish, and it WAS the go-to direct heal in wrath....


Yeah, I was referring to Nourish. The guy I posted said it was "really good", which is kinda a huge exaggeration =/

Nourish was really not that incredible back then. It never has been, as far as I know. (I was very casual in Cata, though - I can't speak for then).


Actually nourish was extremely useful in wrath. As a flash heal on tanks it hit for like 20k+ I think on tanks with HoTs and had a cast time of like 1.2 seconds at decent haste. Tanks had around 53 - 60k health with bears being 80k+. I felt very powerful spamming that on a tank taking a ton of focus damage. I believe others had slightly stronger direct heals but a tank with HoTs and nourish spamming was competative with all other healers (this was kind of big for us druids). It was a lot better than healing touch and a lot of druids wanted noursh back in some form for our flash heal instead of regrowth. Guarenteed crit regrowths aren't too bad now but it's not the same.
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5 Human Warlock
0


Yeah, I was referring to Nourish. The guy I posted said it was "really good", which is kinda a huge exaggeration =/

Nourish was really not that incredible back then. It never has been, as far as I know. (I was very casual in Cata, though - I can't speak for then).


Actually nourish was extremely useful in wrath. As a flash heal on tanks it hit for like 20k+ I think on tanks with HoTs and had a cast time of like 1.2 seconds at decent haste. Tanks had around 53 - 60k health with bears being 80k+. I felt very powerful spamming that on a tank taking a ton of focus damage. I believe others had slightly stronger direct heals but a tank with HoTs and nourish spamming was competative with all other healers (this was kind of big for us druids). It was a lot better than healing touch and a lot of druids wanted noursh back in some form for our flash heal instead of regrowth. Guarenteed crit regrowths aren't too bad now but it's not the same.


GC gave it to us. I believe it coincided with his crushing of LB spam. Surprisingly a lot of druids complained that we didn't need it. Personally I was overjoyed after having spent all of Vanilla and BC with major flash heal envy (no HT4 does not count). Then he took it away.
Edited by Merise on 1/21/2013 8:50 PM PST
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100 Tauren Druid
10285


back in wrath of the lich king it was really good.


Not at all.


yes it was 20k nourish on 1.2 sec cast time was really strong average hp 20k-30k.
Edited by Lìfendeath on 1/21/2013 9:04 PM PST
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90 Draenei Priest
6645
Is it really worth never using Nourish/HT? A lot of people are telling me this, but it just sounds...wonky.
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90 Draenei Priest
6975
01/22/2013 05:12 AMPosted by Eclipsé
Is it really worth never using Nourish/HT? A lot of people are telling me this, but it just sounds...wonky.


I use HT with Nature's Swiftness, but that's it. Regrowth is just so much better.
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100 Night Elf Druid
6295
01/21/2013 05:49 PMPosted by Sorrów
But surely with the spikiness of damage this tier they are running a risk by *not* sniping rejuv?


In some situations, maybe, but on someone who's already at 75% with a HoT on them, when Titan Gas/Force and Verve/Rain of Blades/Get Away/etc. has just ended? Sniping the HoT is a pointless waste of your mana, unless you think looking better on meters is worth the mana. (Of course if some kind of pulsing raid damage is still ongoing, the direct heal and the HoT will both get their chance to do some actual healing, so sniping isn't as much of a problem there.)

There is spiky damage, true. But most/all of the big raid damage spike moves are on cooldowns. If you're healing up people who have just been hit by them, you have at least 10 seconds, usually more, before the raid gets hit again. That's the time when you can afford to let the HoTs do their work. Or you can try to look good on meters by sniping them. The druid can't control what choice the other healer makes in this situation; the druid's mana is already spent, but the other healer still has the option of saving theirs.
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100 Night Elf Druid
16610
That's the time when you can afford to let the HoTs do their work. Or you can try to look good on meters by sniping them. The druid can't control what choice the other healer makes in this situation; the druid's mana is already spent, but the other healer still has the option of saving theirs.


This is crazy. Healers heal. NOBODY stops to see if a rejuv is ticking on a target. Instinct takes over. The real problem is the developers. They are doing a terrible job. In my opinion they should be replaced ASAP. I've never seen so many nerfs, buffs and hotfixes. A quick look at the healing parses clearly show Rdruids at the bottom by almost 30%. But GC says we are "fine".
It makes you wonder how competent these guys are. Sure we are getting some buffs, but should it take 5 months?? To any devs who may read this, please do a better job.
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90 Draenei Priest
6645
This is crazy. Healers heal. NOBODY stops to see if a rejuv is ticking on a target. Instinct takes over. The real problem is the developers. They are doing a terrible job. In my opinion they should be replaced ASAP. I've never seen so many nerfs, buffs and hotfixes. A quick look at the healing parses clearly show Rdruids at the bottom by almost 30%. But GC says we are "fine". It makes you wonder how competent these guys are. Sure we are getting some buffs, but should it take 5 months?? To any devs who may read this, please do a better job.


It's pretty obvious that the devs haven't really cared about druids for a *long* time.

Feral dps has been the same since Wrath basically.
Moonkin dps has been clunky and awful since Cata.
Resto Druids are outdated and can look forward to an entire expansion as 'the bad healer'.
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100 Night Elf Druid
14110
It's pretty obvious that the devs haven't really cared about druids for a *long* time.

Feral dps has been the same since Wrath basically.
Moonkin dps has been clunky and awful since Cata.
Resto Druids are outdated and can look forward to an entire expansion as 'the bad healer'.


it's only because Ghost Crawler hates druids.
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