I have a theory on why warriors receive nerfs

90 Human Warrior
10000
Ok guys I had just gotten into bed and was contemplating something. Perhaps the reason we always get yelled at for nerfs is we are the only class who can charge in and literally blow classes to pieces. THAT is the heart of our class. Pure, unmitigated (colossus smash) physical damage. And the retards who choose to actually go toe-to-toe with us get destroyed in seconds and then come whine how that shouldn't happen. These people complaining are the ones who let a warrior go apes**t on them because they are trying to act like a warrior and stay in our faces. The sillies who forget to use what THEIR class calls for (CC, slows, etc) get facerolled by a warrior ourdpsing them to death and then them come and complain.

Blizzard, do you not realize this? YES we had WAY too much control for our burst in 5.0. 5.1 was even justified removing gag order. But now, you have gone a little too far. You can't take away our tools that allow us to do what we do, damage- you are letting other classes keep their ability to kite, fear, stun, slow us while severely limiting our ability to do damage. Seriously- it is NOT that hard to beat a warrior, but when you try and out damage them-FORGET IT. We are going to beat you if the gear/skill level is equal.

Last night I was just doing some 2s and noticed something. Faced a warrior and hunter I believe, comp, with me and a frost DK. I like to play defensive, disarm have them use their cds then make them pay and pop mine. First game, enemy warrior gets charge off on dk, and hunter opens on him, literally they killed him in 1-2 seconds. My first reaction was... WTF that should never happen! Then I just said, ok lets think, if we face them again we can avoid this surely. Sure enough, next comp same team. I leap charge to get the stun off, apply my MS and hamstring and he shockwaves and opens. I trinket, disarm and kite. After disarm I pop DBTS and def stance +shield wall for incoming hunter. Look at that! just like that, the other warrior is now a sitting duck with no offensive CDs and I am still alive. The dk takes care of the hunter and I can quickly dispatch the warrior using my damage CDs. Now I know you other classes don't have these same tools exactly, but you sure do have something to stop or avoid our burst! Do WE have to tell you how to beat us? Will that prevent you from coming on here and complaining like a little child until we get nerfed?

Seriously- do you people who constantly BEG for warrior nerfs just not consider other ways to beat them? I find warriors to only be mediocre in difficulty, with rogues monks hunters and cats below, rets dks middle, and the kiting casters- locks, frost mages, spriests hardest to beat.

Thoughts? Not trying to rage- just theorycrafting ha
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90 Worgen Warrior
11370
All indications point towards Warriors being really overpowered. Sorry, that's just the truth. If you want to know why they are receiving nerfs, there is your reason.
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90 Night Elf Warrior
5460
01/25/2013 08:53 AMPosted by Bladeletters
All indications point towards Warriors being really overpowered. Sorry, that's just the truth. If you want to know why they are receiving nerfs, there is your reason.


Solid argument to his well worded statement.
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90 Gnome Warrior
6985
01/25/2013 08:53 AMPosted by Bladeletters
All indications point towards Warriors being really overpowered. Sorry, that's just the truth. If you want to know why they are receiving nerfs, there is your reason.

You can argue over whether they're going overboard with all the nerfs but if nothing else, Defense Stance needs the adjustment they're giving it.
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100 Undead Warrior
14085
01/25/2013 08:38 AMPosted by Narcaine
Ok guys I had just gotten into bed and was contemplating something. Perhaps the reason we always get yelled at for nerfs is we are the only class who can charge in and literally blow classes to pieces. THAT is the heart of our class. Pure, unmitigated (colossus smash) physical damage. And the retards who choose to actually go toe-to-toe with us get destroyed in seconds and then come whine how that shouldn't happen. These people complaining are the ones who let a warrior go apes**t on them because they are trying to act like a warrior and stay in our faces. The sillies who forget to use what THEIR class calls for (CC, slows, etc) get facerolled by a warrior ourdpsing them to death and then them come and complain.


Pretty much this ^. Warriors were designed to be the King of Melee, and from Vanilla to early Cat, we were. We were well known for not having much utility/self healing, but for hitting like a freight train. Other melee classes knew they wouldn't live if they tried to go toe to toe Roshambo (hit for hit) with us. Ranged classes knew that we would kill them if we stuck to them. Both had to use CC and self-healing (Both things which we severely lacked, our two weaknesses) to beat us.
After early Cat however, Warriors recieved HUGE nerfs, and we no longer fulfilled the role we were meant for, damage. Both Frost DKs and Rogues severely outdamaged us at that point, and both had alot more control/utility/survivability. Warriors became flat out obsolete in mid-late Cat. Arena Teams would say "Why take a Warrior, when a Rogue or DK could do his role 3x better?". People got used to Warriors being nothing more than a free HK speedbump on the road to glory. During this time, people could facetank Warriors and play Roshambo with them, and win.
MoP hits, and Warriors are suddenly dangerous again in melee. The people who had forgotten how to fight us, QQ up a storm because they can't go toe to toe and facetank us anymore. As a result of that QQ, Blizzard begins to repeatedly nerf us once again.

Last night, i got into a World PvP fight against a Human Ret Pally that was just as geared as i am, and even though i lost, it was quite refreshing. Not only did this Pally know how to use his classes' advantages over me (self healing), but he had also actually dead zone kited me while hitting me with Judgements to refresh Censure and Burden of Guilt, along with Exorcisms, wearing me down to 35%, then reengaging in melee. This was a person who remembered how to fight Warriors.
Edited by Korbu on 1/25/2013 1:29 PM PST
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90 Worgen Warrior
11370
All indications point towards Warriors being really overpowered. Sorry, that's just the truth. If you want to know why they are receiving nerfs, there is your reason.


Solid argument to his well worded statement.


His well worded statement which assumes that everyone else doesn't know how to play their class except warriors? Look at the talents that Warriors have, look at Warrior rep in arena, compare that to the arena rep of other classes historically. He's using anecdotal evidence to prove his point and it's just not as well worded as you think it is.
Edited by Bladeletters on 1/25/2013 1:40 PM PST
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90 Gnome Warrior
6985
01/25/2013 08:38 AMPosted by Narcaine
Perhaps the reason we always get yelled at for nerfs is we are the only class who can charge in and literally blow classes to pieces.

Other classes can do it from a safe distance.
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90 Human Warrior
10000
Perhaps the reason we always get yelled at for nerfs is we are the only class who can charge in and literally blow classes to pieces.

Other classes can do it from a safe distance.


And it doesnt feel as violent. Wouldn't you agree? Someone right in your face stunning you and dropping you in seconds is going to lead a person to complain more than say a hunter stunning you from a distance and dropping you in seconds. We would feel more overwhelmed, our character is being torn to shreds and we can barely see it happening because the warrior is all over the place then bam execute gg. Whereas a hunter dropping us we see it happening can react better because we aren't totally overwhelmed by the chaos in front of us and thus act smarter, dont die as easily, and dont come here and complain....

Ok guys I had just gotten into bed and was contemplating something. Perhaps the reason we always get yelled at for nerfs is we are the only class who can charge in and literally blow classes to pieces. THAT is the heart of our class. Pure, unmitigated (colossus smash) physical damage. And the retards who choose to actually go toe-to-toe with us get destroyed in seconds and then come whine how that shouldn't happen. These people complaining are the ones who let a warrior go apes**t on them because they are trying to act like a warrior and stay in our faces. The sillies who forget to use what THEIR class calls for (CC, slows, etc) get facerolled by a warrior ourdpsing them to death and then them come and complain.


Pretty much this ^. Warriors were designed to be the King of Melee, and from Vanilla to early Cat, we were. We were well known for not having much utility/self healing, but for hitting like a freight train. Other melee classes knew they wouldn't live if they tried to go toe to toe Roshambo (hit for hit) with us. Ranged classes knew that we would kill them if we stuck to them. Both had to use CC and self-healing (Both things which we severely lacked, our two weaknesses) to beat us.
After early Cat however, Warriors recieved HUGE nerfs, and we no longer fulfilled the role we were meant for, damage. Both Frost DKs and Rogues severely outdamaged us at that point, and both had alot more control/utility/survivability. Warriors became flat out obsolete in mid-late Cat. Arena Teams would say "Why take a Warrior, when a Rogue or DK could do his role 3x better?". People got used to Warriors being nothing more than a free HK speedbump on the road to glory. During this time, people could facetank Warriors and play Roshambo with them, and win.
MoP hits, and Warriors are suddenly dangerous again in melee. The people who had forgotten how to fight us, QQ up a storm because they can't go toe to toe and facetank us anymore. As a result of that QQ, Blizzard begins to repeatedly nerf us once again.

Last night, i got into a World PvP fight against a Human Ret Pally that was just as geared as i am, and even though i lost, it was quite refreshing. Not only did this Pally know how to use his classes' advantages over me (self healing), but he had also actually dead zone kited me while hitting me with Judgements to refresh Censure and Burden of Guilt, along with Exorcisms, wearing me down to 35%, then reengaging in melee. This was a person who remembered how to fight Warriors.


Same exact thing happened to me in arena last night man. Ret pally kept losing me around a pillar when I had him in execute range, using burden of guilt and judging me all the while throwing another FoL on himself. I was constantly slowed and couldnt get to him, eventually he turned around stunned me and facerolled me. I was impressed. Instead of taking me head on like most of the classes who come and complain about us, he set up a perfect strategy and executed it flawlessly
Edited by Narcaine on 1/25/2013 2:40 PM PST
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90 Human Warrior
10000
I will be extremely upset if we are resigned to be cata warriors again who have no place in PvP. I am worried :(
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90 Draenei Warrior
9655
Last night...I shared a vision with my beard. We saw an evil machine pumping out fake warriors with facial hair. The machine was labeled "F.O.T.M". Suddenly a great explosion happened destroying the machine and there was a voice that spoke to my beard and I. It said "5.2".

In all seriousness the nerfs we are getting are a bit strange, but luckily the buffs are gonna be nice. TG BS will have some new life plus getting some haste buffing which kinda dodges devs having to re-stat new gear, but hey blizz has never been perfect.

But I strongly agree with OP. Classes that try and shoulder check me tend to be wiped out and ones that kite to no end seem to be just fine with warriors where we are. In the end it's still a long time before the patch so there's hope for more work arounds and hopefully correct ones.

/beardstroke
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100 Human Warrior
11060
01/25/2013 01:40 PMPosted by Bladeletters


Solid argument to his well worded statement.


His well worded statement which assumes that everyone else doesn't know how to play their class except warriors? Look at the talents that Warriors have, look at Warrior rep in arena, compare that to the arena rep of other classes historically. He's using anecdotal evidence to prove his point and it's just not as well worded as you think it is.


You really have nothing to stand on to defend your opinion on our state in arena atm. I'm playing tsg in 3's this season and people that play at around 1700 to 2000 are learning but there not stupid. With that said our c/d stacking burst is easily controlled by the countless cc in this game atm. If you're too stupid to cc someone that blows all there c/ds you deserve to lose seriously. I did 2's on my other level 90 horde side with a resto shaman, moron complain about locks doing a lot damage with chaos bolt. I told him chaos bolt damage is ok atm, if you're too stupid to interrupt a cast you deserve to get nuked. No it doesn't boil down to broken mechanics, what it really comes down to is lazy stupid fuc kin people that refuse to learn, thay want all the advantages of what they have instantly, "I don't want to cast counter spell when someone is casting that is just dumb let me do it regardless" Then why the fu ck is it called counter spell? We were strong in the beginning it got fixed, blizz has admitted that warriors have been overly nerfed twice now this expansion. The blame isn't warriors or people who play them its the devs and the lazy people that refuse to use the tools that they have right. Guess what 5.2 will go live and a week or 2 in people will still be complaining about warriors being op never mind the mage that switches to you and kills you in a frost bomb shatter or a locks chaos wave. I chose the wrong expansion to focus on pvp at this point everyone is an entitled jack as s, it honestly looks like there listening to all the people that do arenas with random people from trade chat. All I want is to be competitive not op or a joke, I want to lose to people that completely out skill us, not because a mage imp silence my healer after the 9th cc that was placed on him. Is asking for skill and experience to beat class/talent or glyph too much?
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100 Pandaren Warrior
17040
I'm not going to pretend I read the walls of text in this thread, but i honestly feel like we get nerfs 90% because we need them 10% because blizzard caves to bads.
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90 Human Warrior
10675
My problem with the way blizz does their nerfs is:

1) tfb is hitting too hard, so we're going to nerf the !@#$ out of avatar (wtf?) - that way warriors won't have sufficent face time for tfb to stack.

2) tfb will only stack to 1 in pvp (ok... what about avatar then?)

3) tfb is being completely redesigned so it doesn't interact at all with hs (ok.... what about avatar, then?)
'
Another thing that irritates me is TFB to start with. The INSTANT I read about tfb I said "that's idiotic and it won't make it past the first patch - assuming it's not just hotfixed. 500% weap damage? Really? You REALLY think that's ok?

I don't give a damned how much star aligning you have to do, if you manage to hit someone with a single attack that does that kind of damage, people are going to lose their bloody minds. Now add on the fact that it's off the gcd.

Horribly, horribly op and should never have been in the game, and yet it gets put in the game, and then just becomes another in the long line of nerfs that only adds to frustration both to warriors and non-warriors.
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90 Tauren Warrior
0
I was always under the impression it was because some stupid Warrior somewhere went and killed a Mage, knowing damn well we're not supposed to.
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90 Human Warrior
4650
take away all the cc abilities in pvp. so much fking crying it's just sad. we get our abilities to contend with other classes this expansion and now we are probably going to be thrown under the bus?! just let all the other classes(mages, palandins, rogues, druids) have their dps like they did in cata. and if you're a warlock and crying about lack of dps well fk you too!

anyway...if we are cata warriors again, I'm just going to enjoy spamming piercing howl! that should p(iss) people off.
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90 Human Warrior
10000
Too bad you can do that already as STILL not keep paladins slowed
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100 Human Rogue
3190
01/26/2013 01:18 AMPosted by Williame
My problem with the way blizz does their nerfs is:

Now consider this. 5.2 rolls around with all these nerfs and warriors adapt to a battle stance style of play. They've not done much to reduce the burst with cooldown stacking still. What happens when warriors still get the stars to align and global people? It's simple: Blizzard finally nerfs cooldown stacking and doesn't compensate for the last 10 nerfs.
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90 Worgen Warrior
11370


His well worded statement which assumes that everyone else doesn't know how to play their class except warriors? Look at the talents that Warriors have, look at Warrior rep in arena, compare that to the arena rep of other classes historically. He's using anecdotal evidence to prove his point and it's just not as well worded as you think it is.


You really have nothing to stand on to defend your opinion on our state in arena atm. I'm playing tsg in 3's this season and people that play at around 1700 to 2000 are learning but there not stupid. With that said our c/d stacking burst is easily controlled by the countless cc in this game atm. If you're too stupid to cc someone that blows all there c/ds you deserve to lose seriously. I did 2's on my other level 90 horde side with a resto shaman, moron complain about locks doing a lot damage with chaos bolt. I told him chaos bolt damage is ok atm, if you're too stupid to interrupt a cast you deserve to get nuked. No it doesn't boil down to broken mechanics, what it really comes down to is lazy stupid fuc kin people that refuse to learn, thay want all the advantages of what they have instantly, "I don't want to cast counter spell when someone is casting that is just dumb let me do it regardless" Then why the fu ck is it called counter spell? We were strong in the beginning it got fixed, blizz has admitted that warriors have been overly nerfed twice now this expansion. The blame isn't warriors or people who play them its the devs and the lazy people that refuse to use the tools that they have right. Guess what 5.2 will go live and a week or 2 in people will still be complaining about warriors being op never mind the mage that switches to you and kills you in a frost bomb shatter or a locks chaos wave. I chose the wrong expansion to focus on pvp at this point everyone is an entitled jack as s, it honestly looks like there listening to all the people that do arenas with random people from trade chat. All I want is to be competitive not op or a joke, I want to lose to people that completely out skill us, not because a mage imp silence my healer after the 9th cc that was placed on him. Is asking for skill and experience to beat class/talent or glyph too much?


Wall of text crits me for 300,000k. You're still stating that people who complain about Warriors don't know how to play their class. Look at Warrior rep in arena. It tells the f'ing story. It's not everything, but when you look at the talents we have and compare them with other classes it's easy to see that we are OP. You are far more than competitive this tier, Warriors are OP.
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90 Worgen Warrior
5700

I don't give a damned how much star aligning you have to do, if you manage to hit someone with a single attack that does that kind of damage, people are going to lose their bloody minds. Now add on the fact that it's off the gcd.


chaos bolts
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90 Orc Warrior
2880
I agree with you man. Warriors are meant to be HEY NOW IM CLOSE GOODBYE

I can agree with some nerfs. I thought second wind OR defensive stance had to be nerfed.
TfB? Arms didnt need that to be awesome. I personally like slamming and MS, when I play arms.

The new patch isnt bad though. Our burst isn't getting nerfed (lemme know if im wrong in that) and its actually just our cc and survivability. I think they got the cc part wrong but I accept the challenge of defensive stance and secod wind nerf.

The shockwave one im a bit.. Ehh. Mages need a little more challenge from warriors. I think we should have more ways to keep with range, for our op survivability did that for us, but now its gone we will be a Lol its a warrior for mages again. I reckon ill accept these nerfs fully and well if they bring gag order back, and a little more anti ranged.

Maybe spell reflect reflects all spells for a certain time period, but doesnt actually throw them back at the caster.

I reckon
Burst- Stay.
Second wind-nerf
Defensive stance-nerf
Gag order- work on players.
Spell reflect- dont throw spell back, but reflect all fr a certain amount of time. Maybe no attacking in this period, and it has a one minute CD, a little like bladestorm- you use it whilst you're moving, and no spell damage for 5 secs, one minute laater you can use it again. Maybe dont be slack with animations and make a new raise shield one.

That is my perfect, Not OP, Warrior right there. We aren't mega men unleess we're protection, but we can go fisticuffs on the ranged.
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