Open Libram LXV: A Fury Divine

90 Tauren Paladin
5895
01/25/2013 04:33 AMPosted by Lobster
I'm going to magically reach through the internet and smack the next person who suggests baseline Divine Purpose or complains about Inq. The ignorance, the laziness... it's beyond ridiculous lol. Light save me.


I wasn't suggesting that DP be made baseline, I was just saying it's a hard choice between the sustainability of DP versus the heavy-damage/healing every 2 minutes of HA.(And the amazing animation.)

Warlock
- We are reverting the removal of Spell Lock.

Mage
- We are reverting the removal of Improved Counterspell.

Druid
- We are reverting Cyclone having shared diminishing returns with other forms of crowd control. While we are keeping the cooldown of Cyclone cast by Feral druids in order to make Predatory Swiftness CC less dominant, we are lowering the cooldown to 20 sec from 30 sec.


What. The. HELL.


Because the game obviously needs this many CCs.
Edited by Shiralia on 1/25/2013 12:21 PM PST
90 Human Paladin
15050
Warlock
- We are reverting the removal of Spell Lock.

Mage
- We are reverting the removal of Improved Counterspell.

Druid
- We are reverting Cyclone having shared diminishing returns with other forms of crowd control. While we are keeping the cooldown of Cyclone cast by Feral druids in order to make Predatory Swiftness CC less dominant, we are lowering the cooldown to 20 sec from 30 sec.


What. The. HELL.


I dont PVP, yet that sounds pretty stupid
90 Draenei Paladin
16405
Really considering upgrading my LFR Last Orders, not sure if my guild will be doing Vaults anymore for the normal one. :(

What. The. HELL.


I thought they were trying to lessen the massive amount of CC crap in PVP........
Edited by Cadenbrie on 1/25/2013 11:42 AM PST
90 Blood Elf Paladin
11915
What. The. HELL.

As always, the proper nerfs never stick. Looks like next season will still be unplayable.
90 Blood Elf Paladin
13415


Because the game obviously needs this many CCs.


It's ridiculous. I try to abstain from complaining about changes, but honestly, I call BS on their reasoning that they don't want players to "relearn their class" mid-expansion when that's basically been the answer of choice every time other classes have been hotfixed or adjusted between patches - never mind that they never even gave players a chance to properly test these changes out on the PTR before pulling it.

Honestly, if they were worried about the timing of such "drastic" (lol) changes, the best time to test it out would've been at the start of a new season. They already proved they'll hotfix something if it gets too unplayable. :/
90 Draenei Paladin
17085
The ppl that don't want it are more into competitive dps and don't want any other rets to do better dps than them because other ret got lucky with procs and they didn't. Its the whole "my dps is legit" so having more RNG would throw this out. In this way they can be sure who's doing legit dps and not getting lucky.

Sound about right?


Not really. Some people would prefer to have the choice whether to deal with that much rng or not. Personally, I like DP, but I'd rather see it buffed to be more competitive with the other two talents, rather than be made baseline.

DP is the kind of talent that could be buffed into the range of slightly into the range of simming higher than the other two talents, while the other two would still have strong arguments for the amount of controlled, reliable burst they provide.
90 Blood Elf Paladin
9115
GC's reasoning is actually pretty solid. Yes, there's currently too much CC in the game, and yes, blanket silences in particular have gotten rather stupid, but casters barely cast. Healers and DPS casters alike jump around spamming instants all day. That needs fixing first, and it'll require major, major changes.

And once that's fixed, melee will need nerfs...

Basically, the arms race is over because everyone's started nuking each other. A major patch is required to repair the damage, but we'll have to wait for an expansion because Blizzard prioritizes players too lazy to learn changes over those who want to see the game improved.
90 Blood Elf Paladin
13415
The ppl that don't want it are more into competitive dps and don't want any other rets to do better dps than them because other ret got lucky with procs and they didn't. Its the whole "my dps is legit" so having more RNG would throw this out. In this way they can be sure who's doing legit dps and not getting lucky.

Sound about right?


Not even close. I couldn't give two rat's farts about what another Ret's dps was, unless he's in my group (in which case, it better be up, because I'm not @!%!@%ing doing this boss all night).

The people who don't want it are into competitive DPS, sure, but they don't want to see one of their mechanics gutted to bring DP baseline, which a lot of people (rightfully) fear, since we're one of those hard to balance around classes.

Imagine, for example, the burst window you could put out with Sanctified Wrath+DP. Blizzard sees this and nerfs something to compensate because people are getting pooped on due to lucky streaks. Now everyone's !@%!ing about that, and no one's happy.
90 Human Paladin
9970
I'm all for buffing DP to competitiveness (eg: increased proc rate, small passive haste bonus, DP-powered spells get a small bonus to damage/healing, or any number of other things), and not strongly opposed to buffing sustained damage (probably while reducing burst a bit to compensate). I just don't really see much reason that baseline DP is a good fix for either thing. Ret's rotation is in a pretty good spot, and doesn't need to be messed with.
90 Human Paladin
15050
Not a competitiveness thing

I dont want my DPS that influenced by RNG, I like having control over dps rather than my potential dps be subject to the mercy of a random proc.

I agree the talent DP needs a boost.
90 Draenei Paladin
16405
How would any of those changes have forced anyone to relearn their entire class? That's bull.

On another note looking at some GC tweets he really can't seem to comprehend the possibility of buffing our sustained without nerfing our burst. I mean it is possible, plenty of viable ideas have been floated.

Evidently hundreds of Rets cry when it's mentioned though, funny cause I thought we spent all of Cata crying about sustained problems to begin with.

/random

Mr. Smites Compass + Darkmoon Firewater + Vrykul Drinking Horn = Really, really big Ashbringer. :O
90 Human Paladin
15050
Well if you buff passive, it'll inevitably and indirectly buff our burst as well

I think thats what their problem is, really the only thing that they could buff is censure ticks, and thats not really fun

Buffing any other ability, it'll buff our burst as well. (ex TV doing 5% more damage or direct ability buffs)
90 Blood Elf Paladin
18820
01/25/2013 12:59 PMPosted by Cadenbrie
How would any of those changes have forced anyone to relearn their entire class? That's bull.


What he meant to say, but couldn't, is that it would make people have to learn their class when they were no longer able to deep-shatter-blanket and land kills.

01/25/2013 12:59 PMPosted by Cadenbrie
On another note looking at some GC tweets he really can't seem to comprehend the possibility of buffing our sustained without nerfing our burst. I mean it is possible, plenty of viable ideas have been floated.


It depends on the magnitude that's being looked at.

If we get a decent enough buff to sustained to have it noticeable, we probably would need to have our burst potential altered to make sure our overall hasn't gone too high, and more importantly that we can't just use our newly increased burst to hit cooldowns and roll people. While it's true that other specs can do it, it's not good for the game.

If a sustained buff is fairly small, but enough to bump us into more competitive dps (censure going to 11.7% SP per stack and righteousness going to 10%), we wouldn't really need to have our burst altered but we'd have people crying that our sustained wasn't buffed enough.
90 Draenei Paladin
16405
01/25/2013 01:02 PMPosted by Paladinchaz
I think thats what their problem is, really the only thing that they could buff is censure ticks, and thats not really fun


01/25/2013 01:15 PMPosted by Cayse
If a sustained buff is fairly small, but enough to bump us into more competitive dps (censure going to 11.7% SP per stack and righteousness going to 10%), we wouldn't really need to have our burst altered but we'd have people crying that our sustained wasn't buffed enough.


These are the types of buffs I was referring too and I would like to see them happen. May not be the most fun way to do it but I think we're pretty fun as we are. No need to ruin a good thing.

And people will always cry that we weren't buffed enough, we don't need anything drastic.
90 Blood Elf Paladin
18820
It's the kind of buffs I think of when people talk about buffing sustained. Sustained isn't fun, it isn't big. It's just there. Breathing isn't exactly thrilling, and yet it's sustained.

My suspicion is that GC is more inclined to look at something that would be an exciting change to sustained, something that would make people go hey that's a great sounding buff, which would be something that would require direct burst nerfs.
Edited by Cayse on 1/25/2013 1:28 PM PST
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