Rogues on the PTR are flat out broken

90 Worgen Rogue
10120
pls take your green daggers and exit this thread.

Anticipation is not better. rogues took ST for the utility portion (nonlethal) of the ability. Removing it guts the ability.


Go do your Random BGs, if you're going to start being a little !@#$% like that then allow me to say this.

"You have NO arena experience, what the hell are you doing on these forums?"

Most Rogues WILL keep using ST in arenas even if they remove the poison proc, I guarantee you. And if some of them decide otherwise then guess what? The 90 talent tier is balanced.
Edited by Vøltare on 1/25/2013 2:59 PM PST
90 Human Rogue
4310
Sorry I don't think you even play a rogue or you are a reroller. No way you have green daggers and are using your rogue.

Most classes have a 90 talent used by the majority of pvpers. No reason to nerf ST usefullness in the hope of balance. Now I will admit that perhaps the increased dmg overcompensates for them removing nonlethal application. Hopefully more rogues will comment cuz atm it seems like a pretty big nerf.
90 Worgen Rogue
10120
Sorry I don't think you even play a rogue or you are a reroller. No way you have green daggers and are using your rogue.

Most classes have a 90 talent used by the majority of pvpers. No reason to nerf ST usefullness in the hope of balance. Now I will admit that perhaps the increased dmg overcompensates for them removing nonlethal application. Hopefully more rogues will comment cuz atm it seems like a pretty big nerf.


I didn't play this season because the gear gap is so huge(hence the dreadful gear and green daggers hur hurr). If you want you can take a look at this rogues statistics, go for it. Had him since BC.

You on the other hand, have lost every single RBG you have stepped foot into, have an extremely little amount of arenas played, are crying about the possiblity of not being overpowered even though you've already been served a plate of buffs yet you proceed to call me a fotm re-roller LMFAO.

Just get out.
90 Human Rogue
4310
plate of buffs? truly nothing we asked for. If you actually played your rogue and didnt move to the next fotm you would know this. ST on live was working fine. It didnt do much dmg but the utility from it was excellent.

All they needed to do to address rogues was the two things I listed. They did one of those 2 things.

1) prep baseline
2) feint usable in stuns

we honestly dont need c&d, the extra energy, etc. Imo the extra energy is to compensate for the shadow focus change.

ps. I dont care about your rankings. I'm casual pvp'er but that's all I do. I do care if you are commenting as someone who has actually been playing the class. Your weapons did nothing but show me you havent been.
Edited by Hairyhoudini on 1/25/2013 3:09 PM PST
90 Human Rogue
12200
01/24/2013 07:18 PMPosted by Conspiracy


Nothing is set in stone, per se, but Shuriken Toss hasn't proven to be very popular in its current live incarnation.


With all respect included Daxxarri, where are you pulling this data from?

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/tichondrius/Jax/simple
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/tichondrius/Relegated/simple
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/tichondrius/Garbagemanx/simple

I have trouble finding a high rated rogue that DOESN'T currently use Shuriken toss. If this is a PvE thing, just say so.


2400 is high rated pvp now? lol.
90 Worgen Rogue
10120
plate of buffs? truly nothing we asked for. If you actually played your rogue and didnt move to the next fotm you would know this. ST on live was working fine. It didnt do much dmg but the utility from it was excellent.

All they needed to do to address rogues was the two things I listed. They did one of those 2 things.

1) prep baseline
2) feint usable in stuns

we honestly dont need c&d, the extra energy, etc. Imo the extra energy is to compensate for the shadow focus change.


I actually do play my rogue, if you'd look at his stats you'd say he has almost every single number higher than you and has existed since BC. While you are the fotm re-roller scum served on a dish.

Try looking at other statistics besides arenas, you dunce. I already mentioned I did not gear my characters because I'm a late-starter for MoP, hence why I have ZERO malevolent and no weapon. HMMMMM
Edited by Vøltare on 1/25/2013 3:14 PM PST
90 Undead Priest
6600
01/25/2013 03:06 PMPosted by Instìnctz
2400 is high rated pvp now? lol.


Welcome to MoP, I'm glad you just bought the expansion, would you like me to introduce you to the changes?
Edited by Conspiracy on 1/25/2013 3:14 PM PST
90 Human Rogue
4310
sorry I've played this guy since forever. 100k kills doesnt = fotm reroll. and my gear is up to date as you can see. And I know 100k kills is NOTHING. Just saying I do play my rogue all the time.
90 Blood Elf Rogue
6885
How is ST going to be changed as far as energy and CD goes? I mean if it is going to proc auto attacks for 10 seconds... wouldn't there need to be some sort of CD or increased energy cost because of the duration? What about CP generation? As it stands right now it is the easiest way to set up a 5 point KS and Shadow Dance with full energy.

I think if you do any of those things to ST it is going be even LESS POPULAR for PvP. Those will also be things that I think should be looked at or ST will be broken as hell. 30 yard range on auto attacks with poison procs coupled with CnD is going to be silly, just saying. Honestly... it seems like the same type of situation we would see if it weren't changed at all just less OP.
90 Night Elf Priest
8950
01/25/2013 03:14 PMPosted by Hairyhoudini
sorry I've played this guy since forever. 100k kills doesnt = fotm reroll. and my gear is up to date as you can see. And I know 100k kills is NOTHING. Just saying I do play my rogue all the time.


gear =/= fotm re-roll.

I chose not to gear ANY toons this season because I'm a late-starter to MoP. I play arenas a lot and it's extremely frustrating to lose simply because of gear distinction(yes I know it's possible to still win but I don't enjoy handicaps)
100 Worgen Death Knight
15315
Cloak really needs to be removed from prep and then have its cd reduced. Double cloak only allows for mongol aggression at the beginning of an arena match.

Are you bi-polar with stupidity?


01/25/2013 03:13 PMPosted by Conspiracy
2400 is high rated pvp now? lol.


Welcome to MoP, I'm glad you just bought the expansion, would you like me to introduce you to the changes?


I'm gonna go ahead and say that if you're done with the "YOU CANT COMPARE ANYTHING TO ANYTHING BECAUSE ITS NOT THE SAME" arguement and you're expertly crafted one-liners,

You've contributed about as much as you possibly can, and you can go now.

No really, you can. I'm sure the next few pages will suffice without you.
Edited by Stunshine on 1/25/2013 3:32 PM PST
Community Manager
01/25/2013 03:17 PMPosted by Vish
As it stands right now it is the easiest way to set up a 5 point KS and Shadow Dance with full energy.


In 5.2, Marked for Death will be the easiest way to do that.
90 Undead Priest
6600
There was reason to my comment, as that what you could say? You say in caps something I never even implied because you can't understand it, and that's my fault?

You're bipolar because every other comment is like you had a seizure mid comment. It's honestly mind boggling. I mean no offense, I'm REALLY curious to what is going on. It's scaring me.

Rank 11 isn't high rated play evidently.
90 Undead Rogue
4445
pls take your green daggers and exit this thread.

Anticipation is not better. rogues took ST for the utility portion (nonlethal) of the ability. Removing it guts the ability.


Go do your Random BGs, if you're going to start being a little !@#$% like that then allow me to say this.

"You have NO arena experience, what the hell are you doing on these forums?"

Most Rogues WILL keep using ST in arenas even if they remove the poison proc, I guarantee you. And if some of them decide otherwise then guess what? The 90 talent tier is balanced.


Rogue previously had throw as a ranged snare. I gather you've taken the season off for the most part, but that's gone. Without the ranged snare, one root, fear, scatter shot, whatever, will keep you from reconnecting with any kind of control outside of burning your blind (or another significant CD Rogue currently is best off holding defensively), and not every team is dumb enough to just let the rogue restealth each time he's peeled.

Losing the potential to snare from ranged is a big deal and will probably push a lot of people into BoS, which I really don't want to run. Will it be unplayable? No, of course not. But it still sucks, and only because they decided a few PVE rogues might occasionally use ST on a boss fight or two if they changed it.
Edited by Crookston on 1/25/2013 3:46 PM PST
100 Undead Rogue
10270
I agree w/ the removal of cloak from prep for example. They need to lose some tools, mostly against casters. Of course, I say 'casters', but the reality is that warlocks, mages and shadow will probably be fine, where as kins/elemental/etc will not be. :(

Anyway, a lot of the complaints about S11 rogues are off base. One of the reasons they were so dumb was that recuperate was dumb.

01/25/2013 03:39 PMPosted by Crookston
and not every team is dumb enough to just let the rogue restealth each time he's peeled.


If you play with a good rogue and a healer that knows proper dispelling in a viable comp, getting the rogue to the target is never an issue. They're able to swap to anything effectively. It's why comps like RMP, RLS, and Thug work; because they're able to just swap on demand.
Edited by Yeux on 1/25/2013 3:45 PM PST
90 Undead Rogue
4445
RMP and thug work because the control is amazing, the burst is immediate and opener is basically guaranteed. Yes, your healer can get you out, but that's on CD and sometimes you're not the priority dispel.

Point is retard ranged damage from Rogue is stupid and losing the snare is painful. Neither are wanted.
Edited by Crookston on 1/25/2013 3:49 PM PST
90 Worgen Rogue
10120


Go do your Random BGs, if you're going to start being a little !@#$% like that then allow me to say this.

"You have NO arena experience, what the hell are you doing on these forums?"

Most Rogues WILL keep using ST in arenas even if they remove the poison proc, I guarantee you. And if some of them decide otherwise then guess what? The 90 talent tier is balanced.


Rogue previously had throw as a ranged snare. I gather you've taken the season off for the most part, but that's gone. Without the ranged snare, one root, fear, scatter shot, whatever, will keep you from reconnecting with any kind of control outside of burning your blind, and not every team is dumb enough to just let the rogue restealth each time he's peeled.

Losing the potential to snare from ranged is a big deal and will probably push a lot of people into BoS, which I really don't want to run. Will it be unplayable? No, of course not. But it still sucks, and only because they decided a few PVE rogues might occasionally use ST on a boss fight or two if they changed it.


I see where you're coming from.. I'm just worried because I've found it somewhat easy to absolutely smother casters and just imagining the return of prep(now with cloak tagged on) coupled with the already decent ranged damage pressure and new snaring pressure of shuriken toss(Especially the Paralytic stun /shudder) sounds a bit devastating. I have not played the PTR, though, and this is only reflecting upon the game overall in regards to basic mechanics.

This sounds like it'd be great and justified for hunters, but for all other casters.. Ehh...
Edited by Vøltare on 1/25/2013 3:52 PM PST
100 Undead Rogue
10270
01/25/2013 03:48 PMPosted by Crookston
Yes, your healer can get you out, but that's on CD and sometimes you're not the priority dispel.


you can't rely on the opener. good teams will stop the opener, or at least make it less effective.

in a high rated environment, the opener is rarely as good as it can be, because reactions are fast.

and the rogue is almost always the highest priority dispel. coming from a healer.
Edited by Yeux on 1/25/2013 3:52 PM PST
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