[H] 15/16 N <electus> LF core healer/dps

90 Tauren Paladin
10405
Recruitment: We do not recruit for bench and we will consider exceptional players that are not listed in the classes below
- Holy Paladin(high)
- Disc Priest(high)
- Holy PriestMedium)
- Restoration Druid(high)
- Rogue(medium)
- Mage(medium)

Guild Info: 10 Man raiding guild
Electus was formed from a 25 man guild that wanted to complete 10 man heroic content. We are a tight knit bunch with a very laid back atmosphere. Our goal is to create an environment where we down content, enjoy each others company, and where everyone has a voice.

Server:
Earthen Ring

Raid Times:
8-11 eastern time, however if we are close to getting a kill for progression we will exceed 11 pm.

Raid Days::
Required: Tues, Wed, Thur are the main raid days. Depending on things we may do an additional raid night if we are close on progression or an alt night. Attendance at 90% is preferred.

Contact Info:
Web Site: www.electuser.guildportal.com
Email: electuser@gmail.com
Battle Tag: Tritoch#1861 Wyx#1881
Whisper: Tritôch(symbol alt 147), Phatbare, Xylvyr/Ynryst Garloo/Silverrune
Mumble interview accepted as application.

Loot: Loot council is used to determine, multiple factors are considered including length of time in guild, raids attended and also imput from the entire raid team.


Portion of the players are 16/16 in this tier thus far as we are in the process of forming the 10 man group

and to quote someone " we are just trying to raid here"
Edited by Tritôch on 1/31/2013 3:01 PM PST
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1 Orc Warrior
0
I'm confused... is your new raid team 6/6 6/6 3/4 or are you basing that off of your prior 25m guild's progression? It's kind of misleading if you're using an old teams progression as your own... You guys/gals may have that experience, but as a team your progression is what you've killed on this 10m team.
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90 Troll Druid
15815
At the risk of stepping into a quagmire:

...25m guild's progression?...

Arguably they wouldn't be citing a 25 man progression but a 10 man.

Likewise, I don't feel that it is substantially different than another guild, say, posting in trade looking for 25 man raiders but listing their 10 man progression.

Furthermore, if hypothetically a 10 man lost half its members, then using your logic, could the remaining members claim the progression of the original group in their own recruitment?
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90 Undead Warlock
7545
With respect, your team needs to claim its own progression. Your personal progress is not the same as your guild's. You're misleading people.
Edited by Malagon on 1/28/2013 2:30 AM PST
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90 Undead Warlock
7545
Likewise, I don't feel that it is substantially different than another guild, say, posting in trade looking for 25 man raiders but listing their 10 man progression.?


I don't think you're making a fair comparison. Blood Fist itself is 100% 16/16 1/6 heroic MSV, regardless of whether that is 25man or 10man. However, distinctions between our 25man and 10man progress are most certainly made with every applicant. We don't try to pull the wool over anyone's eyes. They are all very aware of the difference in progression between the two raids when they join.

Claiming another guild's progress as your own however, is *completely* different. Personal progress =/= to guild progress. If it was, I could have claimed Blood Fist had cleared Terrace months ago when I personally cleared it. That's what they're doing here, and it's wrong.
Edited by Malagon on 1/28/2013 2:39 AM PST
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90 Troll Druid
15815
01/28/2013 12:51 AMPosted by Malagon
Likewise, I don't feel that it is substantially different than another guild, say, posting in trade looking for 25 man raiders but listing their 10 man progression.?


I don't think you're making a fair comparison. Blood Fist itself is 100% 16/16 1/6 heroic MSV, regardless of whether that is 25man or 10man.


Technically yes, Blood Fist is 16/16N 1/16H. However, you failed to address the crux of my argument:

...if hypothetically a 10 man lost half its members, then using your logic, could the remaining members claim the progression of the original group in their own recruitment?


01/28/2013 12:51 AMPosted by Malagon
Claiming another guild's progress as your own however, is *completely* different. Personal progress =/= to guild progress. If it was, I could have claimed Blood Fist had cleared Terrace months ago when I personally cleared it. That's what they're doing here, and it's wrong.


You may be right here however I don't know that 3-5 players on a newly formed team is the same as "personal" progression. Also, I am not sure Blood Fist should be the wielder of the raiding ethics handbook since I know "Blood Fist" was in Terrace before their first Shek'zeer kill.

Not quite analogous but to use hyperbole for my point: Neckbeard technically has top server position despite only 2 of the raiders still being in the guild. Can those 2 claim the progression that they achieved without the other 8 as "guild" progression. I don't know that they could or should. My point is it may be no different to cite progression that you achieved before the loss of members than for those you lost to cite their prior progression.
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90 Undead Mage
14885
Finally someone with intelligence. Going to concur with Malagon in that it's somewhat misleading advertisement. In my opinion, unless the majority of this new raid team/guild was in BF and was part of their progression team, they should be stating some raiders have 16/16 *experience,* not progression. By stating their group's progression is this, it's implying that their team as a whole has progressed this far, which is untrue. I guess an analogy of what I'm trying to get across would be something like a football team that wins the superbowl; if 40% of the team leave and make a new football team next season, can their team claim to have won the superbowl?
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90 Undead Mage
14885
According to wowprogress, the raid team in Electus is 6/6 1/6 progression.
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90 Orc Shaman
7880
Guild Info: 10 Man raiding guild
Electus was formed from a 25 man guild that wanted to complete 10 man heroic content. We are a tight knit bunch with a very laid back atmosphere.


Progression: Group is 6/6 MSV 1/6 HEROIC 6/6 HOF and 3 of 4 terrace


I feel that these two lines here are very important and that by misinterpreting them we are getting different meanings. The group that is in Electus was part of the raid team out of blood fist. As part of that group they contributed to the boss kills in these raids (as did all members who was there, just to make that clear so we don't turn this into who contributed more/less).

In the line "Progression: Group" we have listed what the group has been a part of for progression. Now i can understand how one might misinterpret that as guild progression and not our "groups" progression but if were going to be that specific as to who has killed what than i fear every guild that is recruiting may be misleading people. If people come and go from guilds using this misinterpreted logic how can one truly claim a guilds progression when the people that were there as part of the kill may no longer be there. We could even go a step further and start picking at what characters people were on and which specific group got those kills but that would be taking it to the extremes which could get out of hand fast.

01/28/2013 05:40 PMPosted by Gurio
By stating their group's progression is this, it's implying that their team as a whole has progressed this far, which is untrue.


And just to add in on this comment. The written word is never really implied as both the reader and the writer are two separately independent thinking people. Because of that the interpreted meaning than can come out of the written word may not always be the same as how it was written. Case in point Religion for many people has been interpreted many ways because the reader can take a different meaning from the writer.
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90 Tauren Paladin
10405
wow i havent checked this in a few days. look at what we have here. I was part of blood fist and the progression was part of the blood fist progression team. I am guessing technically some of us are 16/16 as part of that progression team I will re word it to show this exact way. I feel i am NOT mis leading people though because that is what we are as most of the players minus maybe 2 are 16/16 in this tier. I can adjust it to say players with 16/16 experience and just leave the guild progress by itself.

does this make everyone happy?
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90 Orc Death Knight
11805
We're a bit frustrated with WoWProgress at the moment, as despite clearing MSV in two hours Tuesday evening as a guild and earning the achievement, this is not reflected on WoWProgress. In the meantime, we're not making any public progress claims, just to be on the safe side.

I do find it interesting that although we've never cleared HoF as a guild team, WoWProgress indicates that we are 6/6. Additionally, we have not as a guild group downed any bosses in Terrace, but WowProgress is insisting that we are 1/4.

I would expect anyone searching for a new team to check wowprogress, but I've discovered it can be misleading in some ways, at least guild-wise. Better to stick to character pages. As an aside, based on a couple of the comments above, perhaps I should inform the two pugs who joined us for MSV and got their first Will of the Emperor kills that they are not allowed to tell anyone they've cleared it because it was our guild achievement? Nah. I'm kidding. That'd be silly.

Mal, you and I have had a conversation about recruitment the other day. When I saw a trade message from one of our team members that seemed both misleading and outright inappropriate, it was shut down immediately. Within seconds, I apologized directly to you for what could easily have been seen as a "cheap shot", and assured you that there was no room for vitriol.

Additionally, if there is any bad blood between me and Colder I have seen no evidence of it, as our exchanges have been kind, genuine, and filled with wishes for mutual success.

Blood Fist has a long and respected history on the server, and has very strict guidelines for members. They don't talk bad about other guilds and they are dedicated to representing themselves on the server with honor. I believe these rules are part of the reason the guild has historically maintained a position of respect on Earthen Ring. Current members would do well to remember what their guild standards are.
Edited by Xylvyr on 1/31/2013 9:12 PM PST
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90 Undead Warlock
7545
I just think advertising this way is misleading. It's nothing personal.
Edited by Malagon on 2/1/2013 1:43 AM PST
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90 Undead Warlock
7545
Never use the WoW forums on a phone -_-
Edited by Malagon on 2/1/2013 1:43 AM PST
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90 Orc Death Knight
11805
01/31/2013 10:54 PMPosted by Malagon
I just think advertising this way is misleading. It's nothing personal.


If that were the case you wouldn't have posted in the thread multiple times. I believe you have enjoyed great success in your short time with Blood Fist, and are not struggling to bring bodies into the guild.

Leave the little guys alone. We're just trying to raid over here.

We are not looking for the sort of player who would fail to research his prospective guild thoroughly. We are not looking for the type of player who is intimidated by the success of others. We are simply looking for a skilled, motivated healer to complete a 10m progression team, and we advertised specifically to attract someone with a similar experience level to ours.
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90 Troll Druid
15815
Bump for a cool group keeping the interwebs safe from Dragons.
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