A buff for wiping in raid finder

90 Undead Rogue
9325
lul at the buff and lul at all the pointless raging going on over the buff.

But in all seriousness, I'd like the encounters to be harder please... And not be a 10 minute beat down for every boss who happens to be a loot pinata with a ridiculous health bar. All I do is 1,2,3,4,1,2,3,move,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,move,3,4,6,8,1,2,3,4,tab target adds,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,move,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4...

I always, always try to do my best but even now I'm starting to think that I can afk and nothing bad would come from it.

And before someone jumps on that I'll just say time =/= difficulty. I'd rather have Gara's crush be an instant kill and only take about 3 minutes to kill him than have to wail on his legs for 6 eternities.
Edited by Dalkin on 1/30/2013 4:45 PM PST
90 Troll Death Knight
15650
...we did have to trivialize some encounters and mechanics. With a system that can correct for variances in groups, encounters don't have to be quite so binary (trivial vs. impossible). Mechanics can be more meaningful.


If the last line is true, I don't think this would be as bad as if it were currently implemented in 5.0 LFRs. However, I still don't think it's needed as looking now, we see that (most) players actually deal with arcane resonance correctly on Feng, albeit it simply moving out of melee range since they know, if they don't, they will probably wipe.

As long as the new encounters aren't like Stone Guards, Sha, etc., and include mechanics and the debuff is implemented correctly, so it can't be abused, the increase in damage, health and healing won't save stupid (Fusion Slash knockback on Lei Shen, Elegon Platform).

Just my thoughts.
Edited by Walzee on 1/30/2013 4:48 PM PST
90 Troll Rogue
11815
If this would go in with a harder LFR it would make for an even longer and more frustrating grind outside of raids. A 1/2 hour queue and 2hrs of frustrating wipes as part of our out of raid chores? No thank you. Please un link LFR and normal tier sets and make the LFR trinkets exceptionally bad or the VP trinkets good.
90 Human Paladin
12490
The change is meaningless unless they expect most LFR groups will wipe. And since LFR doesn't learn, that means most LFR runs will be even more annoying than they are now, week in, week out.

Terrible, terrible idea.

What Blizzard SHOULD do: implement systems for detecting when players are behaving badly, doing things that would get them kicked by the raid leader in real raids, and penalizing those players. Make the cost of exploitation and poor performance fall on the miscreants, not so much on their 24 victims.
90 Pandaren Shaman
16840
So basically, if 4 healers want to dps in LFR, it's ok now - just wait it out.
90 Troll Rogue
11815
it's just not a good idea.

pretend people are doing will, and half the dps die to devastating combo. group wipes. come back in with a damage buff.

they wipe again, this time because adds were all over the place.

eventually, the damage buff gets to a point where it trivializes all the mechanics. LFR is already tuned very, very lightly, and is very forgiving.

elegon is killable without ANYONE doing the orbs properly.

is a scaling buff even necessary?


That's the problem. It sounds like they want every fight to be LFR Garalon now. That's just so time consuming to finish an LFR then its not even funny unless you do it with guildies.
90 Human Death Knight
10355
01/30/2013 04:51 PMPosted by Osmeric
What Blizzard SHOULD do: implement systems for detecting when players are behaving badly, doing things that would get them kicked by the raid leader in real raids, and penalizing those players. Make the cost of exploitation and poor performance fall on the miscreants, not so much on their 24 victims.


I totally support that but I imagine that would take a LOT of coding to develop such a system. x% per wipe is far easier on the dev time.
90 Human Paladin
12490
01/30/2013 04:57 PMPosted by Nexumus
I totally support that but I imagine that would take a LOT of coding to develop such a system. x% per wipe is far easier on the dev time.


Hey! Welcome back!
90 Worgen Rogue
10985
The change is meaningless unless they expect most LFR groups will wipe. And since LFR doesn't learn, that means most LFR runs will be even more annoying than they are now, week in, week out.

Terrible, terrible idea.

What Blizzard SHOULD do: implement systems for detecting when players are behaving badly, doing things that would get them kicked by the raid leader in real raids, and penalizing those players. Make the cost of exploitation and poor performance fall on the miscreants, not so much on their 24 victims.
This would be a good idea, except can you imagine all the complaints for people getting kicked in Raid Finder for AFKing. I'm serious people post about them AFKing in BGs and then complaining that they were kicked for AFKing....

/playerfailedlogic
90 Gnome Rogue
19635
Just imagine if Blizzard were in charge of reforming entitlement like Social Security and need based programs like SSI !
90 Human Mage
18095
Considering heroic 5mans give the Luck of the Draw buff, why not just start LFR at 15% and leave it?
90 Night Elf Druid
5485
01/30/2013 02:11 PMPosted by Karoc
A buff to the overall raw survivablity and throughput of a raid doesn't mean anything if people keep running under Garalon or fail to stack for Unseen Strike or stand in Defile/Void zones.


It'll help me keep up the tanks that get hit with 3+ hits of combo on will. Also help down adds faster.

It'll help the raid survive repeated epicenters if nobody knows how to stop them (and help get him out of that phase without it lasting 10 minutes, too).

It'll give the tanks a few more seconds of life with a ton of Spray stacks if the other tank doesn't taunt off at the right time. Or anyone else who stands in the spray, too.

And it will definitely help people banished by Sha of Fear kill their target faster and get a tank back to the circle before the raid gets massacred by having both tanks gone at once because the fail dps got picked to go with them.

With enough stacks you probably could even heal through some crushes (not constant, but more than you could before), 3x blademaster, both dissonance fields going off at once, or stuff like that. The number of people you need to have in the right place for unseen strike goes down, and it's easier to heal them back up (sure, if NOBODY stacks, the target still gets oneshotted, but at some point having even half a dozen people might be enough).

The point of having an LFR difficulty (as opposed to just matching up random people and throwing them into normals, which they could have done with much less developer time involved) is that you shouldn't need EVERYONE to perform the mechanics correctly -- because you never know when you're going to get some noobs or even griefers. This buff will improve the ability of a mixed group of decent players and noobs to eventually get the boss down. Maybe the noobs will even learn in the process (if they're not really griefing on purpose, but hopefully you can at least kick those).

P.S. I hope they watch out for double dipping on heal or damage effects that have their base amount calculated as a percentage of another heal or damage effect -- there's quite a lot of those now, in all four possible categories.
90 Tauren Druid
0
You'd better tell me that this is a joke. The most annoying thing I run into in LFR is when some lock or hunter gets the bright idea of sending his pet in to pull a boss when people aren't ready. We may have dead to res (that's fun to watch the whole fight and get no credit because some idiot pulled before heals could res you). Healers may have no mana from the trash chain pulling.

This sort of idiocy leads to big repair bills for me, especially when I get brez'd in combat. We do not need to be encouraging more wiping or antisocial behavior because some dps'er wants to see his character make bigger numbers on his screen.

Set the bar. Let us rise to the challenge. If people aren't up to the challenge, then they shouldn't be in the raid anyway. I'm sorry, but a bare minimum of situational awareness and comfort with your class's mechanics is necessary to raid, even at the introductory level that is LFR. If you want to learn basic group mechanics and how to play your spec in a group environment, dungeons are the place.
90 Human Paladin
12490
01/30/2013 05:02 PMPosted by Minimize
This would be a good idea, except can you imagine all the complaints for people getting kicked in Raid Finder for AFKing.


I'm not sure they'd have to be kicked. How about giving a small reward to people who don't screw up too much? Calculate some performance metric (say, a weighted combination of avoiding certain mechanics, performing others, doing sufficient dps/healing/mitigation for your gear level), and give them some tokens, scaling with how well they did. Lesser Charms (or whatever is replacing them), maybe a nominal number of VP, as well as some sort of raid-visible failscore.
Edited by Osmeric on 1/30/2013 5:35 PM PST
90 Blood Elf Paladin
VEX
10945
wait. Is this real and not a joke?
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