Dawn of the Aspects - Part 1 Coming Soon*

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02/08/2013 04:16 PMPosted by Haely
So I don't understand why people keep blowing this out of proportion when all Rhonin did was use a tricky situation and turned it into a good situation.


BECAUSE HE RECRUITED THEM UNDER THE GUISE THAT HE SAVED ONE OF THEIR ANCESTORS FROM 10000 YEARS AGO!!!!

My god, how can people be so obtuse? There is only so much belief that should be suspended before it becomes assinine.
Edited by Seebach on 2/8/2013 6:06 PM PST
100 Human Monk
6510
02/08/2013 04:16 PMPosted by Haely
I'm tired of everyone using the Raptor Army as an excuse. All Rhonin did was use the mannerisms of the Raptors to try and establish a dominance. Which is basically whats done in every kind of wild animal encounter, usually not trying to dominate them but still establish some sort of connection. Honestly the only real thing he did was stare down the leader, not much else till Iridi helped out.


Didn't he also used magic to read the leaders minds or something?



02/08/2013 04:16 PMPosted by Haely
Also it wasn't Rhonin only that was there, Iridi used her powers to form a mental connection to provide some images to their minds. The Raptor just so happened to remember Rhonin from before we he helped expel the Orcs, it's not that surprising.


Oh yeah.



It has been stated before that the Raptors in WoW are highly intelligent, much more then most Animals and even in Stormrage this is portrayed with many other animals pairing up with the Raptor in the Dream Battle.

So I don't understand why people keep blowing this out of proportion when all Rhonin did was use a tricky situation and turned it into a good situation.


People bring it up because:

1) It's really funny.

2) It's a symptom of a much larger problem.

See, in that book alone, it wasn't just the raptors. It was Iridi being able to brawl out a group of people effortlessly, and then move a boat on her own that would "normally take three full grown men to move". It's also the way he just takes the Warcraft franchise and strangles it into his own "epic vision", by creating a race of Dwarf hybrid monsters(among other things). It's how he wrote the one Blood Elf as being extremely cliche. It's his over-use of words. Also, his extremely stiff dialogue.

And then you get all his other works, and you see common trends like characters being made just to fit a logical flaw in his intended story(like that human "druid" in Stormrage who ended up only existing to teleport people around).

Thing is, my personal complaints with Knaak aren't even about these things I'm talking about. Those are just the real flaws. My actual disagreements(which have no bearing on his writing quality, as they are my opinions) are things like how the Dragons in Warcraft are completely stupid.

Edit: Also, after Night of the Dragon was released I remember there was an interview with Knaak that asked him about why he decided to go with raptors and he basically said something like, "I don't know! I just got to that point of the story and decided it would be really cool".

Might explain why some people just want to roll their eyes at the guy.
Edited by Draile on 2/8/2013 7:38 PM PST
90 Gnome Priest
6860
So I don't understand why people keep blowing this out of proportion when all Rhonin did was use a tricky situation and turned it into a good situation.


BECAUSE HE RECRUITED THEM UNDER THE GUISE THAT HE SAVED ONE OF THEIR ANCESTORS FROM 10000 YEARS AGO!!!!

My god, how can people be so obtuse? There is only so much belief that should be suspended before it becomes assinine.


That's not from when the raptor remembered him.

The image is of Rhonin fighting an Orc and Rhonin comments that's when they expelled the Orcs from that area.

Not from 10,000 years ago.

Edit: I'm honestly not sure what your talking about. Rhonin doesn't mention anything in that chapter over afterwards about saving one of it's ancestors a 10,000 years ago.

Edit2: I'm even more confused. Are you saying that Rhonin recruited them about something that happened 10,000 years ago in War of the Ancients?

02/08/2013 07:30 PMPosted by Draile
See, in that book alone, it wasn't just the raptors. It was Iridi being able to brawl out a group of people effortlessly, and then move a boat on her own that would "normally take three full grown men to move". It's also the way he just takes the Warcraft franchise and strangles it into his own "epic vision", by creating a race of Dwarf hybrid monsters(among other things). It's how he wrote the one Blood Elf as being extremely cliche. It's his over-use of words. Also, his extremely stiff dialogue.


That's cool, all I was talking about was the Raptor Army thing that people blow out of proportion when it's not that big of a deal.
Edited by Haely on 2/8/2013 7:51 PM PST
90 Blood Elf Death Knight
0
02/08/2013 06:06 PMPosted by Seebach
So I don't understand why people keep blowing this out of proportion when all Rhonin did was use a tricky situation and turned it into a good situation.


BECAUSE HE RECRUITED THEM UNDER THE GUISE THAT HE SAVED ONE OF THEIR ANCESTORS FROM 10000 YEARS AGO!!!!

My god, how can people be so obtuse? There is only so much belief that should be suspended before it becomes assinine.


Can you not be an !@# just because people don't share your dislike of something?
100 Human Monk
6510
02/08/2013 07:50 PMPosted by Gethrian
Can you not be an !@# just because people don't share your dislike of something?


It's really just the kind of situation where people who don't like the author see, very glaringly, his flaws. And those few who want to defend him come off as obtuse or without anything other than a base opinion to defend him.

I've never actually heard of anyone defending his writing style with anything other than "Blizzard gave it the go ahead, so therefore it must be good. Or at least Blizzard's fault".
Edited by Draile on 2/9/2013 8:40 AM PST
90 Blood Elf Death Knight
0
Why do they have to come across as anything? Sometimes people like things just because they do. I don't have to defend why I like the color blue do I?

Some people like his stuff because it's violent or it's good or whatever. I really don't care and I don't think people have to defend him from those who act obnoxious about disliking him.

The Knaack haters are getting just as annoying as the Justin Bieber haters and the Lil Wayne haters.
90 Orc Warrior
11510
And here I was hoping that you'd finally let go of Knaak for his complete inability to write a story worth reading.

I am disappoint :(


Shut the heck up! I don't normally do that, but it needed to be done...
90 Orc Warrior
11510
Also, very excited! Can't wait to learn more history about the awesome Warcraft universe, especially considering it's about the Father of Dragons and his demise.
90 Human Warrior
13525
Why do they have to come across as anything? Sometimes people like things just because they do. I don't have to defend why I like the color blue do I?

Some people like his stuff because it's violent or it's good or whatever. I really don't care and I don't think people have to defend him from those who act obnoxious about disliking him.

The Knaack haters are getting just as annoying as the Justin Bieber haters and the Lil Wayne haters.


Yeah. I mean we're allowed to like it. Personally Stormrage was hard for me to read but I'm not going overly nuts about it and somehow think people are *dumb*. That's... just immature. I've never read a book that made me go "GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR STUPID AUTHOR RAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAWR RAGE."
100 Human Monk
6510
Why do they have to come across as anything? Sometimes people like things just because they do. I don't have to defend why I like the color blue do I?

Some people like his stuff because it's violent or it's good or whatever. I really don't care and I don't think people have to defend him from those who act obnoxious about disliking him.

The Knaack haters are getting just as annoying as the Justin Bieber haters and the Lil Wayne haters.


Blue is a simple colour.

You're making the illogical assumption that people complain about the content in Knaak's work, when it's the quality of the content that people take issue.

I'm all for violence/action in fantasy stories. When it's told poorly on a technical and artistic level however, it's not enjoyable to read.

And as someone who has this opinion, I can back it up(as it has been by many others countless times). But if you like it, you can't actually back up why you like his prose, story structure or characterization. Or at least, you choose not to.

Which means that, yeah, you don't really have a leg to stand on in a debate like this if you have nothing to actually say.
Edited by Draile on 2/9/2013 1:35 PM PST
90 Human Warrior
13525
Why do they have to come across as anything? Sometimes people like things just because they do. I don't have to defend why I like the color blue do I?

Some people like his stuff because it's violent or it's good or whatever. I really don't care and I don't think people have to defend him from those who act obnoxious about disliking him.

The Knaack haters are getting just as annoying as the Justin Bieber haters and the Lil Wayne haters.


Blue is a simple colour.

You're making the illogical assumption that people complain about the content in Knaak's work, when it's the quality of the content that people take issue.

I'm all for violence/action in fantasy stories. When it's told poorly on a technical and artistic level however, it's not enjoyable to read.

And as someone who has this opinion, I can back it up(as it has been by many others countless times). But if you like it, you can't actually back up why you like his prose, story structure or characterization. Or at least, you choose not to.

Which means that, yeah, you don't really have a leg to stand on in a debate like this if you have nothing to actually say.


Everyone has opinions. Knaack isn't the best author but he's not as horrible as you haters put him out to be. Considering how in this post you haven't said anything about the quality either I could say you have no leg to stand on either.

Inbefore "ARE YOU OBTUSE/ASININE
100 Human Monk
6510
Everyone has opinions. Knaack isn't the best author but he's not as horrible as you haters put him out to be. Considering how in this post you haven't said anything about the quality either I could say you have no leg to stand on either.

Inbefore "ARE YOU OBTUSE/ASININE


I've said quite a bit in previous replies, so it seems you misread :)
90 Human Warrior
13525
Everyone has opinions. Knaack isn't the best author but he's not as horrible as you haters put him out to be. Considering how in this post you haven't said anything about the quality either I could say you have no leg to stand on either.

Inbefore "ARE YOU OBTUSE/ASININE


I've said quite a bit in previous replies, so it seems you misread :)


I did read it. I honestly don't think you have any ground to stand on. Of course you might be meditating in the air for that. In all seriousness there is no doubt Golden is better(IMO anyways). Knaack isn't horrible.

I'd still prefer him for Dragons then anything else. And for the record Draile the Inb4 was not towards you.
66 Draenei Shaman
2905
02/06/2013 12:03 PMPosted by Nethaera
The age of the dragons is over. Azeroth’s ancient guardians struggle to find a new purpose in a world plagued by uncertainty

Cant wait to see the outcome...
100 Human Monk
6510
02/09/2013 09:58 PMPosted by Lorthuron
I did read it. I honestly don't think you have any ground to stand on. Of course you might be meditating in the air for that. In all seriousness there is no doubt Golden is better(IMO anyways). Knaack isn't horrible.


I listed many examples, particularly:



2) It's a symptom of a much larger problem.

See, in that book alone, it wasn't just the raptors. It was Iridi being able to brawl out a group of people effortlessly, and then move a boat on her own that would "normally take three full grown men to move". It's also the way he just takes the Warcraft franchise and strangles it into his own "epic vision", by creating a race of Dwarf hybrid monsters(among other things). It's how he wrote the one Blood Elf as being extremely cliche. It's his over-use of words. Also, his extremely stiff dialogue.

And then you get all his other works, and you see common trends like characters being made just to fit a logical flaw in his intended story(like that human "druid" in Stormrage who ended up only existing to teleport people around).

Thing is, my personal complaints with Knaak aren't even about these things I'm talking about. Those are just the real flaws. My actual disagreements(which have no bearing on his writing quality, as they are my opinions) are things like how the Dragons in Warcraft are completely stupid.


If you don't think any of those technical examples are relevant, than I'm not sure what you're trying to argue here. They are very valid(and I believe accurate) criticisms. Also, they are common criticisms for the author. An author who is, by the way, the very kind of author critics tend to hate: Franchise writers. People who make their living by latching onto a company's creative work and making novelizations about it(I'm serious; even my old college film text book called them "hacks". I remember thinking it was funny just how opinionated the writers of that text book were).
100 Human Monk
6510
edit: Uh, this reply posted in the wrong thread
Edited by Draile on 2/10/2013 8:05 AM PST
90 Dwarf Paladin
14910
I bought the War of the Ancients trilogy because I liked and played Warcraft III.

Imagine my surprise when the book started in the present day with Thrall and some no-name shaman having visions. Then skip to Krasus and Rhonin who has a pregnant Elf wife. Not exactly painting a picture of the stuff of legends here.

Then we get to the Night Elves who really act nothing like the Night Elves in Warcraft III. Not that it doesn't make sense, but it was jarring just the same.

And Azshara has a PM or whatever lusting after her while she lounges round on a couch all day. No one lusted after anyone in the Warcraft games, so having it in a book was disconcerting.
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