DW Frost PvP (Where you all at!!!)

90 Undead Death Knight
0
So what kind of stat setup are all my other fellow DW Frost DK's rolling around with? Xmog to strat's against 1v1'1 2v2's 3v3's etc...
Edited by Ønysablet on 2/5/2013 10:53 PM PST
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90 Human Death Knight
5405
2H is better for frost at the moment, if you want to do arena i would recomend going 2H.
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90 Human Warlock
7865
02/05/2013 10:52 PMPosted by Ønysablet
So what kind of stat setup are all my other fellow DW Frost DK's rolling around with? Xmog to strat's against 1v1'1 2v2's 3v3's etc...


Where they at? At the bottom of the leader boards because they "like the way DW looks."
Edited by Jinxr on 2/6/2013 1:41 AM PST
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90 Undead Death Knight
0
So what kind of stat setup are all my other fellow DW Frost DK's rolling around with? Xmog to strat's against 1v1'1 2v2's 3v3's etc...


Where they at? At the bottom of the leader boards because they "like the way DW looks."


thats not why FYI... if not most but all DK's that spec Frost will norm go 2h because there offspec either unholy/blood and dont care to farm for the extra weap and BTW it's not for the look its the playstyle. however, i cant speak for other DW's I like the utility/fast pace rotation.
Edited by Ønysablet on 2/6/2013 6:49 PM PST
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90 Night Elf Death Knight
6960
Frost is in the strange position where our weapon choice isn't just cosmetic anymore. It acutally changes the way we play. Most people go 2H because 1) A 2H weapon is cheaper than 2 1H weapons, and 2) 2H has better burst with harder hitting Obliterates. Since burst is king atm, most go 2H frost.

That being said, I personally prefer DW, not because of asthetics, but because of playstyle. IMHO, DW has a lot more room for error, since it's signature move (HB) only costs one rune, where as Obliterate consumes 2. This means DW has more room for abilities like Necrotic Strike, has better sustained damage, and better ranged pressure. Not to mention we can just blow KM on Frost Strike without hesitation, since its only real resource competition is Dark Simulacrum.
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90 Draenei Death Knight
10060
I DW. I tried 2H and it just didn't fit my play style.
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90 Gnome Death Knight
10170
Since DW Frosties have better mobility, survivability, utility, and sustained damage (maybe even burst), they have no reason to come to the forums.
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90 Undead Death Knight
0
DW ftw
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90 Human Death Knight
7640
02/06/2013 10:20 PMPosted by Gâshcat
Since DW Frosties have better mobility, survivability, utility, and sustained damage (maybe even burst), they have no reason to come to the forums.


What kind of horse crap is this. People go dw because mashing two buttons (hb, fs) is easier than mashing three (hb, oblit, fs). One or the other does nothing for your mobility or survivability.
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90 Worgen Death Knight
12005
DW frost is awesome for random BGs when you at least have T1 and stacking pvp power. Howling Blast splash does a considerable amount of damage.

Infact, that sounds like a lot of fun. Maybe I'll regem to do that soon....

Everything else though, 2hd Frost or Unholy.
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90 Gnome Death Knight
10170
What kind of horse crap is this. People go dw because mashing two buttons (hb, fs) is easier than mashing three (hb, oblit, fs). One or the other does nothing for your mobility or survivability.


Really?

Why wasn't Frost DK mobility a problem last xpac? The answer is mostly because every Frost DK was using Howling Blast. It is easily the most powerful ranged ability for a melee in the game. With the elimination of Desecration, this gave Frosties little ability to stick on their target. However, with Howling Blast, the difference isn't really noticeable. Because you can range down your opponent, you have all the mobility you need. You could do this as a 2H, but you would be sacrificing your Obliterate Damage.

With such low survivability overall, anything that adds a little, adds a lot. Despite its nerfs, Death Strike is still a spammable heal. Again, 2H could use this, but it would really hurt their dps. DW on the other hand is free to use as many Death Strikes as they want to; they won't sacrifice much single target dps, and since it builds Runic Power twice as fast as using abilities that cost a single rune, it actually aids in burst.
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90 Human Death Knight
7640
02/07/2013 09:51 PMPosted by Gâshcat
What kind of horse crap is this. People go dw because mashing two buttons (hb, fs) is easier than mashing three (hb, oblit, fs). One or the other does nothing for your mobility or survivability.


Really?

Why wasn't Frost DK mobility a problem last xpac? The answer is mostly because every Frost DK was using Howling Blast. It is easily the most powerful ranged ability for a melee in the game. With the elimination of Desecration, this gave Frosties little ability to stick on their target. However, with Howling Blast, the difference isn't really noticeable. Because you can range down your opponent, you have all the mobility you need. You could do this as a 2H, but you would be sacrificing your Obliterate Damage.

With such low survivability overall, anything that adds a little, adds a lot. Despite its nerfs, Death Strike is still a spammable heal. Again, 2H could use this, but it would really hurt their dps. DW on the other hand is free to use as many Death Strikes as they want to; they won't sacrifice much single target dps, and since it builds Runic Power twice as fast as using abilities that cost a single rune, it actually aids in burst.


Lol I shouldn't feed the trolls but I can't resist. First off casting a ranged spell doesn't equal mobility. And howling blast single target isn't that great. C hiblains has always allowed frosties to stick on targets as well as chains of ice.

Now lets talk death strike. 2h can spam ds for the same cost as dw and seeing as how ds doesn't hit with the offhand or blood would be using dw it would actually. Be more dps for 2h frost to spam ds instead of dw.

Once again you argument is full of holes. Back to the drawing board.
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90 Undead Death Knight
0


Really?

Why wasn't Frost DK mobility a problem last xpac? The answer is mostly because every Frost DK was using Howling Blast. It is easily the most powerful ranged ability for a melee in the game. With the elimination of Desecration, this gave Frosties little ability to stick on their target. However, with Howling Blast, the difference isn't really noticeable. Because you can range down your opponent, you have all the mobility you need. You could do this as a 2H, but you would be sacrificing your Obliterate Damage.

With such low survivability overall, anything that adds a little, adds a lot. Despite its nerfs, Death Strike is still a spammable heal. Again, 2H could use this, but it would really hurt their dps. DW on the other hand is free to use as many Death Strikes as they want to; they won't sacrifice much single target dps, and since it builds Runic Power twice as fast as using abilities that cost a single rune, it actually aids in burst.


Lol I shouldn't feed the trolls but I can't resist. First off casting a ranged spell doesn't equal mobility. And howling blast single target isn't that great. C hiblains has always allowed frosties to stick on targets as well as chains of ice.

Now lets talk death strike. 2h can spam ds for the same cost as dw and seeing as how ds doesn't hit with the offhand or blood would be using dw it would actually. Be more dps for 2h frost to spam ds instead of dw.

Once again you argument is full of holes. Back to the drawing board.


Actually DS does hit with offhand(Only FrostDK's can do this since ToT is baseline). However, it only get's heals from the main hand strike(This is the main reason why its bad for Blood and Unholy to DW). As for the DW only using 2 buttons you are again wrong 1st off DW has more utility HB/FS is our main spells but we will use Oblit at times to help build RP and since HB/FS are our main spells and not tripping about Oblit all the time we use those runes on SR/NS/DS spamming. If I remember correctly SR makes 2H's rotation a bit clunky but yes you do get bigger heals from DS but DW can set up DS's within our rotation so we really dont need to think wether to save those runes on a DS or Oblit since even if a KM proc's will go FS and not have to wait on rune to get that Oblit off.
Edited by Ønysablet on 2/8/2013 2:30 AM PST
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90 Gnome Death Knight
9535
DW is the most fun in bgs. The up time is constant. And you get to hit more than two buttons if you know how to play dw to its max. Thanks for exploring the topic, if you like videos about dw frost go to youtube, http://www.youtube.com/user/CryptusDK?feature=watch Cryptus for some ideas.
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90 Troll Death Knight
19820
Death Strike heals have not been related to their damage dealt since wotlk. DW and 2H have the same healing from a single Death Strike.
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90 Undead Death Knight
0
02/08/2013 08:08 AMPosted by Xoss
Death Strike heals have not been related to their damage dealt since wotlk. DW and 2H have the same healing from a single Death Strike.


yea I was just doing some testing b4 I check forum this is good to know
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90 Gnome Death Knight
10170
02/08/2013 12:31 AMPosted by Berndhart
C hiblains has always allowed frosties to stick on targets as well as chains of ice.


Then why did everybody pick up desecration? Is it because until this xpac, your chillblains would just get dispelled in arenas?

02/08/2013 12:31 AMPosted by Berndhart
First off casting a ranged spell doesn't equal mobility


Sure it does. It means despite being rooted or slowed, you have the chance to always be "up" on your target.

02/08/2013 12:31 AMPosted by Berndhart
2h can spam ds for the same cost as dw


You could not be more wrong. While it "costs" the same, the resulting loss in damage for 2H is far, far greater. Spamming Death Strike uses runes which means less Obliterates which is bad for 2H damage. At the same time, it actually helps DW burst damage by building Runic Power which DW uses for burst with Frost Strike.

Do you wanna start talking about utility? You wouldn't make it past Necrotic Strike in that argument.
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100 Draenei Death Knight
5960
02/08/2013 02:15 AMPosted by Ønysablet
This is the main reason why its bad for Blood and Unholy to DW


I thought it was bad for Blood and Unholy to DW mainly because they don't get Threat of Thassarian, so most of their abilities don't hit with the offhand (thus making them suck).
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90 Human Death Knight
12270
I love DW both for the look and the play style in both PVE and PVP.

Anyway, gemming and stats depend on if you want to just go all out offense or defense or a little of both. If you look at me I"m gemmed and reforged for offense. I know it means I die quicker but that's what healers are for. I love doing tons of damage and then dying if I don't have one though.

Anyway of course for DW it's hit to 3%, expertise to 3%, then for offense you want to gem str/pvp power for red, str and mastery for yellow and straight pvp power for blue. Reforge anything you can to mastery, and if it isn't an option then do haste. I left my crit on though since my crit is low, I didn't reforge most of my crit. (not sure if that's good or bad).

Enchanting they say to do strength for everything basically but I did mastery because I like more mastery. MH - windsong enchant, OH - rune of the fallen crusader for weapons.

As far as strats, whehter it's in BGs or arena, I always pop all my offensive CDs straight away and plow into the target me and my teammate(s) have decided to kill. I usually will pop AMS too to absorb some damage since I'm usually targeted first, and Lichborne vs fearers, Frozenblood against wars/rogues so they can't stop my burst. I do this because then I can do my full burst in 10 seconds and nobody can stop it. (until they've destroyed my AMS or 7 seconds is up). I go HB, HB, HB, HB, DnD, FS FS FS FS, then if no death/frost are back up I'll get rid of the last rune with PS if not then I continue with HB, blood tap 2 death runes, HB all the runes, FS FS FS FS FS FS FS etc. I also have RW atm but I'm thinking of trying desecrated ground. With RW though I'm trying to figure out the best time to pop it and I usually do it right when I'm on the person doing my burst.

Willing to take any critisism and comments/tips about these stats and my approach. Anyway if you want to go defense or half d/o, then you just will do Resil in some of those gems instead of PVP power/mastery.

Why do I like HB/FS spam over getting diseases up and then spamming Obliterate?

1.) for the reasons that have already been discussed, some person snares you (which happens a lot in PVP) you can still spam HB and nothing happens to your dps rotation, nothing stops you from your dps rotation as DW frost unless you are out of Death/frost runes or you are completely cc'd/silenced/stunned, which also happens a lot in pvp.

2.) If you talent into chillblains, along with your HB spam you will constantly be doing nice AOE damage to the other team and they will be slowed.

3.) If a caster is running from you, you can keep him slowed without going out of your dps rotation (until you're out of frost/death runes).

4.) Overall damage is tops of any class/spec in pvp and although we dont' wanna be stat hoes, doing all that damage really hurts the other team.

5.) I just love running around spamming HB and if you're not a war/tank you better run like heck from me or when I catch you and spam FS on you, your hp is gonna drop like a rock in the ocean.

6.) I haven't really gotten into necrostrike or DS spam but when I do it will be even more awesome.

7.) Both sub-specs are great. And it's been proven (there's a thread with stats about it), that there are some fights and instances where one is better than the other but at the end of the day, both are equal in damage output.

8.) Since they're equal play what you like.

The ONLY thing I really like about 2h is the burst damage is better and those 130k crits from obliterate are nice and shiny. This is making me want to spend extra conquest to get a 2h and do it from time to time depending on who I'm facing. When I first started dw I thought "wow my damage is weak," but now that I know how to spend my runes/runic power more efficiently, it almost feels like I'm killing things jsut as fast if not faster then when I was using 2h. But that being said I'm always working on thinking and experimenting ways to do even more damage as DW.
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