Is it just me?

100 Blood Elf Death Knight
11715
Getting my DK to 90 and doing heroics, as well as my Monk, tanking on both, I've noticed a trend.

DPS pulling. DPS pulling and expecting the Tank to taunt off of them.

I did take a small break from WoW towards the end of Cata. But tanking all through Wrath and most of the Cata, as I recall, the tank pulled. If the DPS pulled, the Tank sat back and ate popcorn with the Healer while they watched said DPS die a horrible(ly funny) death.

Am I the only one bothered by this? Is the the norm now? Is this what's expected of tanks? Or am I just getting lots of groups full of DPS who have absolutely no idea how to play their role? When asking them not to, I'm called a FailTank and booted from the group. While being booted has only happened once, the seemly increasing trend of DPS trying to move things along irks me. I find it rude and ignorant.

(I'd like to clarify; I don't consider myself the best tank evar, but this hasn't been a threat issue. This is DPS pulling before me, even after being asked not to.)
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(...)If the DPS pulled, the Tank sat back and ate popcorn with the Healer while they watched said DPS die a horrible(ly funny) death(...)


We still do this as some folks never learn!
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90 Human Monk
17840
02/08/2013 11:26 AMPosted by Odaen
Am I the only one bothered by this? Is the the norm now?

No, it bothers other tanks too. And yes, it's the norm: if you're not pulling fast enough, some people will pull for you.

The catch: you'll never be fast enough.

Just leave the group, don't waste time putting up with it or trying to argue.
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90 Pandaren Monk
13240
Haven't run a dungeon in months (outside of a couple guild runs), and things like this are part of the reason why. I tend to just let them die. But of course then I'm the bad guy. Lose/lose, so I don't play.
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90 Draenei Warrior
11550
If they keep pulling and the healer is keeping them up

Either two things, if this makes you uncomfortable, leave the group
If it's fine for you and you just shrug it off, and they don't say anything about your tanking, eh stay, free valor
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90 Draenei Paladin
8180
it's the norm: if you're not pulling fast enough, some people will pull for you.

The catch: you'll never be fast enough.


Oh God, that's so true, that it hurts me in my soul.
Edited by Toolate on 2/8/2013 1:26 PM PST
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90 Pandaren Monk
6860
I feel mostly bad for the healers (partially because I dual-role tank and healer) that do their best to keep the DPS up. I try to save dungeons from this, but ugh. It feels like the dungeon is no longer in my hands.
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90 Human Warrior
6665
It doesn't bother me at all. I just chain pull anyway, sometimes in groups. Like to faceroll them. :0
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90 Orc Warrior
10110
Blizzard has effectively removed the tank role from heroic dungeons. With sufficient gear, any DPS can be the tank. Whoever gets to the mobs first is tanking it. I try to make sure that's me. Sometimes it's not.
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73 Dwarf Warrior
5605
It's very common in the lower level dungeons I am leveling through. The only time it bugs me is when it puts too much of a strain on the healer and/or leads to a wipe. I still try to out tank all of the other people fighting their own mobs, but some times I just need to let them do what they do (I cannot taunt-fight very well against void walkers and other hunter pets).

If we're progressing through a dungeon at a reasonable pace with everyone tanking, everything is gravy with me. If not, I'll attempt to make some verbal requests.

All in all, I simply enjoy the tanking role over the others in all aspects of the game (PvP, PvE, Questing, Leveling, Farming, Grinding, etc.) and some pushy DPS are not going to change that for me >:D
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100 Blood Elf Death Knight
11715
Thanks, guys. This is exactly what I needed to hear. And you're right. I can't let them ruin my fun. As long as we aren't wiping, I can keep it from letting it bother me.
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90 Orc Death Knight
tys
9350
Another option is to try to convince the healer not to heal them. Good healers will often comply.

First pull - maybe an accident; taunt off them
Second pull - not likely to be an accident, but perhaps a bad day

Ask why they're pulling

Third pull - well, you yank it you tank it

Most dps these days can tank heroic dungeons. In fact many healers too have been having a conversation about this. They feel undervalued in the heroics because there isn't too much to heal.
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100 Blood Elf Warlock
16415
The thing is this: no playstyle is "correct".

Tradition says the tank pulls and the dps are responsible for killing anything the tank pulls, but there is absolutely nothing forcing it to be that way. If the dps pulls, and the tank is responsible for holding aggro on anything the dps pulls, it's just a different way of looking at things. The first way, the tank has the responsibility to make sure the dps will be capable of downing the mobs before the healer runs out of mana. The second way, the dps have the responsibility to make sure the tank has enough mitigation and health to keep the healer from running out of mana.

If you are incapable of pulling aggro off a couple dps here and there, you're a bad tank. If the dps is pulling too much for you to handle, they're bad dps. Somewhere in the middle is a balance that works just fine if you let it. As a dps, it's fun to just nuke stuff. As a tank, it's fun when there's actually a bit of work involved in holding threat. As a healer, it's fun to actually use those aoe heals you got 30 levels ago but haven't really touched yet.

Getting all stuffy because people aren't letting you pretend to be the boss is a childish waste of time. Getting a bit stuffy because you are legitimately not skilled or geared enough to handle what they're pulling is acceptable, as long as you're still civil about it. And if you just don't have fun with that playstyle, there's nothing wrong with stating "hey guys, I don't like playing this way, so if you want to continue, I'll just drop group and find a group I like, then you guys can wait for a tank who plays your way". If they don't mind waiting for another tank (and/or healer, if heals feels the same way), it doesn't hurt you, because you can insta-queue, and it lets them do their thing. If they'd rather not wait, they can just opt to play your way right now.
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72 Human Paladin
3255
It really depends on whats going on. I really don't mind DPS pulling as long as only one does it (usually the hunter) and they bring it to me. I will NOT chase aggro.

Just depends on the situation. Hell I even say in the beginning of PUG groups "If I am pulling to slow feel free to pull but just bring it to me"
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90 Tauren Druid
4765
Here's something that happened a couple of levels ago:

A lock was pullin way before I was, so I said "Can't you wait for the tank to pull?"
He answered "Can't you just shut the *$# up?"

He kept pulling, so I said "Fine, go ahead"
Next thing he did was pull 5 or 6 packs of mobs towards the party.
He was the first one to die, then the other 2 DPS. I tried to save the healer but failed.
Result: Wipe.
He left.
----
Around the 50s I was tanking Temple of Atal'Hakkar and there is a boss that transforms someone into a beast (usually me).
As I got transformed, he stood still dpsin blindly as I was bashing him.
He died.
Then he cursed, called me a noob cause he had aggro.
I told him it was not my fault if he had no clue of how the fight was. He kept cursing - I ended the conversation with "if you're not happy, leave".

That's the kind of thing that discourages me from tanking: people's attitude. But if I consider how many succesful runs I've had, the odds that something bad happens is pretty low.
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80 Blood Elf Paladin
985
02/09/2013 12:55 AMPosted by Suprä
Around the 50s I was tanking Temple of Atal'Hakkar and there is a boss that transforms someone into a beast (usually me).


Oh I just loved when some one pulled that boss or stood too close and got feared into the boss when I have the whole room of trolls on me . . .
Then of course the heals pull aggro so I have to get a hold of the boss, who of course transforms me and all the trolls wipe the party.

That is the only time some one else pulling has really annoyed me, 6 times in 8 dungeons runs with different people was just !@#$ing stupid. -.-
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100 Blood Elf Death Knight
11715
The thing is this: no playstyle is "correct".

If you are incapable of pulling aggro off a couple dps here and there, you're a bad tank. If the dps is pulling too much for you to handle, they're bad dps.


ESPECIALLY when leveling, it's important to let the Tank pull first. The Tank has to establish aggro. If the DPS pulls too much, or the Tank isn't able to pull threat from the DPS (you run this risk especially in pugs, where the DPS may be better geared than the Tank. That doesn't make them a bad Tank.), then it's easier for the Healer to pull threat from the DPS, and then it's a wipe.

I agree, challenge makes it fun. But the roles are there for a reason. They're set up a certain way to work in a certain order. Yes, there are times and places where you can deviate from that. But pug instances with people you've never played before is not that place.

I was taught that DPS didn't just look watch Recount, but Omen too. I started out DPS, which is why this irritates me so badly. Through BC, Wrath, and the part of Cata I was around for, it was the DPS' responsibility to watch their threat. If they're starting to pull, then they needed to back off on the DPS.

Isn't it more important that the pulls go down, the group doesn't wipe, and the instance is cleared than being top DPS in a pug? Following the Role, completing the instance, and moving on is far more fun than stressing about if that DPS is going to "challenge" you more than your group can handle.
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90 Tauren Druid
4375
This happens to me often, and I get raged at for being a bad tank. You can't stop people from being @$$-holes, but you can control how you react. You can't really let them die either, in my experience most dps can just face roll without you. Don't sweat it, just dps, try to hold aggro, if you get called a fail tank ignore them and keep moving, if you get kicked who cares? You should have almost instant que times. As for me, I hope blizzard nerfs dps class survivablility so they can't do this anymore.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
7180
I do really dislike it when this happens to me. It hasn't happened much lately, but it does happen from time to time. I dislike it less because "Oh no, that DPS pulled the mobs before I was ready" and more because now my positioning of the mobs is messed up. Now instead of having this lovely little cluster of mobs centered around me, we have this constantly moving line of mobs as the DPS runs away. Or worse, the mobs are now attacking everyone in the party and everyone is running around like chickens with their heads cut off.

The first time it happens, I'll do my best to get the mobs back on me, though sometimes DPS just don't want to give up the mob. If it keeps happening, I'll sit back and watch. If people get mad, oh well. I'll just press qu- oh look at that, I'm already in another dungeon.
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90 Pandaren Monk
9455
I hate it because pulling and tanking is my job. I take pride in that.

I'm sure the DPS would be furiously burning up these boards if a tank at the cap could do more damage than them.
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