Making TP work like jab.

90 Pandaren Shaman
8010
What are the consequences of removing jab and making Tiger Palm work like jab. It would generate chi and cost energy. You wouldn't have to remember to refresh tiger strikes all the time because you'd be constantly using it to generate chi. And it's one less button you'd have to press. The WW mastery could include rising sun kick instead of TP. I'm sure tanks wouldn't argue. And healers wouldn't mind it either I'd think.

Just thinking aloud.
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63 Dwarf Priest
0
As a monk healer, it'd be weird.

It'd cost mana, generate chi, consume chi, stack Tiger Power, and give you a stack of Vital Mists.

Next patch it would do all of that plus give you 1% of your mana back.

Admittedly being able to generate/use a chi in one GCD seems nice for Mana Tea purposes.
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90 Pandaren Monk
11455
From a Brewmaster point of view:

Please, no.

Brewmasters are using one of two resources. Chi or Energy.

If we have no chi, and no energy... we're stuck spamming Tiger Palm, since it costs absolutely nothing for Brewmasters.

WW have this problem a lot less often, what with FoF giving them time to pool energy back up, so they're rarely stuck with no button to push.

Mistweavers would be REALLY weird if TP had a mana cost instead- 5 Tiger Palms to make your next Surging Mists free... but Tiger Palm costs mana. Mistweavers would eventually be faced with having to solve this equation:


Is ((tiger palm mana cost * 5) + (tiger palm eminence healing * 5) + (surging mist healing * 1)) > ((surging mist mana cost * 1) + (surging mist healing * 1))?


I realize that's not a direct equation as we're trying to add two non-comparable things (mana cost and heals), but you get the idea. Mistweavers would need to redo the math every time they got new gear to see if it's more mana efficient to use TP instead of just straight up healing with SM- or maybe even see if it's more worthwhile to only stack a few TPs before using SM, or... It'd add unnecessary complication to Mistweaving.

Basically:
Brewmasters need a free spell for their empty GCDs.
Windwalkers rarely have an empty GCD so don't need the free spell of Brewmasters, and would have very little to gain from having their only choice for chi consumption being BoK 90% of the time.
Mistweavers... don't even think about it.
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90 Pandaren Monk
9735
Wish people would think more before they say this....I've seen this post many times and it's ALWAYS coming from the viewpoint of a Windwalker who has no idea about Tiger Palm in the other 2 specs.

Here you go Windwalker(s):

Tiger Palm for you- used every 19-20 seconds to keep up armor ignore buff and whenever can be used on mastery proc without losing dps by doing it and capping energy or using it instead of Rising Sun Kick.

Tiger Palm for Mistweaver - used for armor ignore buff.....also used to heal, spend chi (to build mana tea stacks and in 5.2 also return mana making Jab worth using), AND stack Vital Mist. Changing Tiger Palm for WW would make it utterly stupid for MW

Tiger Palm for Brewmaster - 30% armor ignore buff, costs NO Chi and NO energy and is used on downtime when not enough energy to Jab and not enough Chi to use on Blackout Kick or Guard, and it buffs for 15% more absorbption for the next Guard (which I think is annoying because the buff goes away with leaving combat and I wish it wouldn't).

So, Windwalkers, QUIT saying get rid of Jab and make Tiger Palm act like it for Chi Building because it DOESN'T WORK.
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90 Pandaren Monk
9455
Granted, I don't spend much time in my WW spec but is having Tiger Palm be a separate move THAT annoying? It costs one chi and Combo Breaker almost guarantees that I get a free one to keep up the buff within thirty seconds.
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90 Blood Elf Monk
10730
Lets just remove all the spells and have a computer move the character around on our screen so we can watch pretty colors and eat juice and cookies.
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90 Draenei Monk
11285
No, Monks have already have a small amount of abilities in their rotation. This would just make it fewer.
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90 Pandaren Monk
0
I would like to see WW - especially in pvp have a better way of generating chi. I don't think tiger palm is it, but Jab just does no damage, we have a lot of ramp up time for decent hits but against most classes, they can play keep away pretty well.
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90 Pandaren Monk
11975
For WW:

(Numbers taken from a log of myself on Protectors 25N elite, where I did 124k dps)

Tiger palm hits for roughly twice as much as jab. This would greatly increase the damage dealt from spending energy to gain chi. The increased damage from that would result in a gain of:

(30585.4 avg damage per noncrit tiger palm/15304.4 avg damage per noncrit jab*2811174 total damage from jabbing-2811174 total damage from jabbing)/352 second long fight= 7974 dps

Rising sun kick hits for roughly four times as much as TP. This would greatly increase the damage dealt from using mastery procs. The increased damage from that would result in a gain of:

(7455663 total RSK damage / 40 RSKs*27 mastery procs-1445073 total TP damage/34 TPs*27 mastery procs)/352second fight = 11037 dps

I would estimate my new dps would be about 143011, or a 15.33% gain. That's a pretty big buff.

Mastery would be a better stat (but they are changing it in 5.2 anyway).
Edited by Janxspirit on 2/10/2013 8:47 AM PST
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