RP Help: Are DK's alive?Dead? ((OOC thread))

90 Human Death Knight
11430
I've been wondering this for -years- and I've never been able to find a strait answer:

Are death knights alive or dead or is there a variation?
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100 Blood Elf Death Knight
11340
I've been wondering this for -years- and I've never been able to find a strait answer:

Are death knights alive or dead or is there a variation?


undead.
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71 Draenei Shaman
5770
The DK's we play are undead. The original ones were not.
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90 Troll Shaman
0
Any death knight that is still alive would have been a volunteer, and thus far more likely to have stuck with the Scourge when the Ebon Blade split off.

It's conceivable that a player DK could be alive, but it's pretty hard to justify and you'd be far more ostracized than even normal DKs who at least were unwilling in their transformation. Plus, it reek of special snowflake RP.
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100 Gnome Death Knight
2440
We are as dead as dirt. We don't breath, bleed, or feel anything.
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90 Night Elf Druid
12650
I tend to go with alive, in the blood flows type of way. Taking dark rebirth as resurrection and the ability of "freezing the blood in your veins" thing as implying that there is moving blood in said veins, features of living.

What makes something alive or dead? Really? And in what situations does it even matter?

It doesn't matter for me. I'm not RPing them in romantic - touchy relationships. I'm certainly not ERPing. There will be no DK spawns.
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80 Draenei Death Knight
3195
All DKs are undead. All of them. Even the volunteers who gradually became DKs. The end result was undeath even if there was no clear point of death. Seriously, Arthas ripped his out heart out, if that's not undeath I don't know what is.
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90 Orc Warrior
7875
Any death knight that is still alive would have been a volunteer, and thus far more likely to have stuck with the Scourge when the Ebon Blade split off.

It's conceivable that a player DK could be alive, but it's pretty hard to justify and you'd be far more ostracized than even normal DKs who at least were unwilling in their transformation. Plus, it reek of special snowflake RP.


Not sure what you mean here. Not being snarky I am just not getting it.

I've been pondering some of this because the original death knights as created by Gul'dan and associates, were the souls of warlocks stuffed into the decaying bodies of slain humans. With an all orc guild, I've pondered whether we could accept a game race Forsaken who was able to roleplay one of those Second War, orc soul - human body DKs. I only know a couple of roleplayers who could pull it off, and I am not one of them. It could be some good stuff though.

Or an absolute train wreck. It would take a really good roleplayer.
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90 Human Death Knight
4840
All playable death knights are dead. We don;t need to eat, breath sleep drink. We feel neither pain nor cold. Death Knights are eessentially "generally" well preserved super-powered walking corpses.
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100 Human Mage
19565
That's something that varies by death knight. Role play as alive or dead as you please. There's at least one death knight ability that specifically says the death knight "becomes undead" when they use it, strongly suggesting the death knight was not undead otherwise.

We have examples of death knights who were killed and then resurrected as death knights. So the case for some being undead is clear. But Arthas himself was never killed to become a death knight and the often cited example of him ripping his own heart out of his body happened after he became the lich king, not simply a death knight. Using it to prove that Arthas was undead as a death knight doesn't work.

Be prepared for anger though. A lot of hard case forts will be mad if you role play a living death knight. It doesn't fit into their idea of what a death knight is and so - lore aside - you must be a bad role player or even a dreaded "special snowflake" if your character isn't undead.

Become a death knight was a matter of losing your soul to the power of Frostmourne. The death knights played by players have been freed from this servitude. How you became a death knight in the first place, whether it required your soul or your life, is up to you. Be prepared to defend your choices.
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90 Night Elf Hunter
9905
02/11/2013 04:14 PMPosted by Imperon
That's something that varies by death knight. Role play as alive or dead as you please. There's at least one death knight ability that specifically says the death knight "becomes undead" when they use it, strongly suggesting the death knight was not undead otherwise.


The Abillity doesn't mean that Death Knights were alive in the first place. Even so, it'd make them more dead. This has nothing to do, nor does it hint, that Death Knights we play currently are alive in any way.

02/11/2013 04:14 PMPosted by Imperon
We have examples of death knights who were killed and then resurrected as death knights. So the case for some being undead is clear. But Arthas himself was never killed to become a death knight and the often cited example of him ripping his own heart out of his body happened after he became the lich king, not simply a death knight. Using it to prove that Arthas was undead as a death knight doesn't work.


This is true, Arthas was never killed. No, he was corrupted by Shadowmourne, and the crown he placed upon his head sealed the deal. However, he is a lore character, his is exception, not the rule.

02/11/2013 04:14 PMPosted by Imperon
Be prepared for anger though. A lot of hard case forts will be mad if you role play a living death knight. It doesn't fit into their idea of what a death knight is and so - lore aside - you must be a bad role player or even a dreaded "special snowflake" if your character isn't undead.


More like logically it doesn't work. The live death Knights as far as i know are hundreds of years old, maybe less, maybe more.
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http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/7416261677

Could help.

Chapter Six: Death Knight
Operable Classes: Death Knight
Bonus: Forsaken can roleplay as Death Knights. Forsaken can do whatever they want.

Death Knights of Acherus are an interesting bunch - a regiment of the very best the Horde and Alliance had to offer, slain in various ways and for various reasons, created for one purpose: To attack The Scarlet Enclave and, ultimately, Light's Hope Chapel in order to force Tirion Fordring's hand.

These abominations never saw combat with either the Alliance nor the Horde, and were the first documented soldiers of the Scourge to use Saronite as armor and weapons. To a man, they are undead, tortured by shades in the Shadow Realm and forced to wreak havoc and carnage and cause agony or they go insane. It's a rough life. This overrides magic dependency (Blood Elves), and feral instinct (worgen) was broken upon acquisition to the Scourge - it remains so even after they are freed, giving worgen the chance to be fuzzy humans and Blood Elves to be, for all intents and purposes, High Elves. Dead High Elves.

Death Knights have access to the full gamut of living emotions: remorse, depression, anger, happiness, loyalty, even love and fondness are not unknown to them. These are all demonstrated by various Death Knights, including Koltira, Thassarian, and Darion Mograine.

Being undead, Death Knights have a trait not commonly discussed or acknowledged: Their blood, if they retain any, is toxic. Stagnant blood in living creatures, such as when a limb is tourniqueted and the blood pools for a significant amount of time, begins to develop a level of toxicity that can cause severe damage to a body if it is released. Ultimately, you can die. If a Death Knight was laid low by plague or simply not exsanguinated in death, this is something they may well have developed.

Death Knights do not "bleed" as living creatures do. Rather, instead of a steady flow in the event of a gash or spurts of gore in response to a severed artery, blood will simply seep and ooze from an injury because no heartbeat drives it. An injury lower on the body will release a deluge of blood; above the heart, a Death Knight might not bleed at all. At no point will they spray blood - instead it would simply flood out as if you were pouring water from a cup.

The Knights of Acherus were give access to several abilities: They are potent hand to hand combatants and they have some amount of control over unholy, frost, and blood magicks.

Naturally, because they recall to some extent their lives, they may well decide on particular fighting styles. A warrior, for example, may disregard magic entirely; a mage who decides to roleplay a Death Knight might assume an almost Lich-like role, falling back absolutely on Frost magic.

Naturally, for Forsaken, this opens rogues, hunters, Shadow Priests, and perhaps even monks as options. Being undead, they all have skill-sets that could see them as Death Knights that simply decided on other methods of mayhem - the Lich King didn't really care how you murdered innocents, simply that you did.

They don't have a lot of abilities that I can go into the way that other Prestiges do, but I'll do my best.

Unholy magic is a forte of the Death Knight. Shadow Priests of the Forsaken can emulate this pretty simply; warlocks that take up Grimoire of Sacrifice likewise. Otherwise, you're stuck being a Death Knight. Maybe a rogue's poisons and a hunter's Serpent Sting could be construed as diseases...?

Frost magic can naturally be shown as a Frost mage. Otherwise, again, enjoy being a Death Knight.

Blood magic is pretty Death Knight only.

Potent hand to hand ability can be taken on by warriors and rogues both. Otherwise... Well, I hope you like Death Knights.


Is the post in question.
Edited by Zinwatha on 2/12/2013 2:40 AM PST
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90 Tauren Shaman
2025
You should take the same way that the forsaken are, They are undead but given even less of free will untell they were freed from The lich king. So really they are perfectly preserved undead trained and mind controlled into being amazing warriors.
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100 Orc Warrior
15610
They are dead. They have no requirements to eat, none to breath (although that may take some getting used to that you don't drown.). Sleep -could- be done (the gnome in the roster) but it was cracked down hard by the scourge and I doubt those lessons have gone away sience then.

They -do- have blood in their veins though. It's probably only there to assist in blood magic, and probably serves a similar purpose in the San'whatever. It is likely used as a base of some sort. It may -flow- threw said magic, or maybe not. However, deathknights cannot create their own blood. The marrow is long dead, and they do bleed when injured. So how do they replenish?

Likely Vampirism via their Runeblades. This is what I think the healing is from blood stance / deathstrike. It's the new blood replacing the lost amount. This shows that the blood is very important to deathknights. It may keep them alive at most, or at minimum remove some of their powers, which would quickly result in death.

Admittedly this is all conjecture. Until blizzard actually makes a statement (game or otherwise) on how it works, we will have to wait.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
5715
The DK intro made it pretty clear that they are dead. The LK raised them and empowered them.
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90 Night Elf Druid
10295
I think Death Knights - no matter what - are dead. How they got into that situation, however, I feel can vary.

By default, the Death Knight a player creates is known to be a "risen hero", which basically means they died then came back to life to serve the Lich King unwillingly. So for the most part, it's just easier to consider your DK as one of those since there isn't anything breaking about it as that IS how the lore is.

The only lore-accurate "alive" Death Knights are "second generation" Death Knights who willingly gave themselves to the Lich King; they also usually consist of some rather powerful folk, too. Whether they're actually alive still or undead is...kinda debatable, so we're left up to assumption.
One thing to remember is that the Lich King himself is a Death Knight who didn't become one through actually dying, though it's pretty clear he is undead. I'd assume the same for these guys, allowing their soul and free-will to be sucked away in return for power and as a result it probably killed them from the inside-out.
There's alot left to assumption here, though, and some of the already-set lore makes it sound like if you played one you're setting yourself up for a sue-esque or "too powerful" character (a possibly alive Death Knight?, gave themselves willingly?, was so powerful the Lich King willingly accepted your butt?, etc), so for the most part it's advised not to make your character one.

Some other things to note:
Death Knights seem to be the most "alive" out of the Scourge, despite being also being undead. I'd take a venture and guess (like others have stated already) that it is because of Blood magic.
Death Knights also start off with a small stack of food. While one might just chalk that up to game mechanics, there is also a vendor in Archerus dedicated to selling Death Knights food and drinks (Corpulus). iirc, if we were to equate this to Forsaken, there are (were) some early quests that mention hunger in some sort of form, so even if eating and drinking isn't required anymore it's most certainly not an uncommon thing. One would also question the existence of Forsaken chefs as well, as they have most certainly existed since Vanilla (so you can't just chalk it up to the Ko'kron being there), but I digress. Regardless, food and drink wouldn't be a luxury thing as one of the DK books in-game mentions alcohol having a greatly dimished taste and effect on the user.
Sleep doesn't seem needed either (see: http://www.wowpedia.org/The_Death_Knights_of_Acherus and read about Milton), but apparently can be done. Even if dead, I would assume rest would probably help in some form...but again isn't required.
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100 Tauren Druid
20150
02/11/2013 05:03 PMPosted by Liå
The Abillity doesn't mean that Death Knights were alive in the first place. Even so, it'd make them more dead. This has nothing to do, nor does it hint, that Death Knights we play currently are alive in any way.


It's gameplay mechanics pretty much. Otherwise abilities that work on undead mobs would be able to work on forsaken / DK characters 100% of the time. That's why they're classed as humanoids instead. The 'turns the player undead' was referring to ingame character classifications, which would make them immune to some CC but susceptible to others.
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90 Human Paladin
5930
The DKs who make up the Ebon Blade, the ones who joined the Horde and Alliance, are undead. Every single one of them.
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02/11/2013 11:49 AMPosted by Sharliomi
The DK's we play are undead. The original ones were not.


1st gen DK's are dead.

2nd Gen Dk's are not dead but bound to a weapon via Arthas.

3rd gen DK's are dead.
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60 Blood Elf Warlock
3545
Actually... even the 2nd generation DKs are undead... including Arthas before he became the Lich King.

In Athas' case... while he didn't "die" as we would expect. His soul was sucked out of his body by Frostmorne (one of the effects the sword has on those who use it). Apparently this happens so gradually that the person weilding Frostmorne may not even realize that his body is now dead and his soul has been consumed by the sword.

As for the other 2nd Generation DKs... since their rune weapons were based upon Frostmorne, it is likely that this aspect was also included in their design. Given enough time, they two would have passed from life to undeath... just not in a noticable fashion (they weren't killed, but are still effectively dead since they no longer have a soul).
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