New 5.2 Changes (Feb 13th)

90 Tauren Druid
9105
Have sandstorm and shields block damage from different attacks. Shields can reduce single/burst attacks, and sandstorm can reduce dots/multi-attacks. That way they would still have some lateral synergy but wouldn't be impenetrable.
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90 Undead Rogue
4535
02/14/2013 06:11 PMPosted by Surrender
Yet you failed how to explain how a roach survives vs a crystal spider.


You don't get 5 pets to pick, you get 3. Your original double shield comp was anubisath, crawdad and proto drake. I showed you comps that beat that. And you flipped out and started quickly changing comps realizing your error.

Just admit that you had an oversight, it's fine, really...
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90 Human Death Knight
12145
Yet you failed how to explain how a roach survives vs a crystal spider.


You don't get 5 pets to pick, you get 3. Your original double shield comp was anubisath, crawdad and proto drake. I showed you comps that beat that. And you flipped out and started quickly changing comps realizing your error.

Just admit that you had an oversight, it's fine, really...


Please show me where I ever listed FIVE pets? Oh the irony. Again, if you want to throw random comps that don't get ran that often, and I suggest ONE pet being subbed out that basically shuts down ALL threats to it (apocalypse and wiggles burst), is not "flipping" out. You suggesting horrible counters (Lil' KT, I mean really, Anubsith can almost practically solo him alone) and using your 5.1 evidence for 5.2 comps is the core issue here. Get things straight and then get back to me, but when you can't even count the number of pets I mentioned its really really hard to take you seriously. Also, still waiting on that Curse of Doom Screenshot.

02/15/2013 08:11 PMPosted by Hudax
Have sandstorm and shields block damage from different attacks. Shields can reduce single/burst attacks, and sandstorm can reduce dots/multi-attacks. That way they would still have some lateral synergy but wouldn't be impenetrable.


Interesting but probably overly complicated solution. I think a more simple system where same type buffs/debuffs don't stack would be a better idea. No more Flat + Flat or % + % stacking. Flat + % is ok as it doesn't break things as badly as the current Flat + Flat problem. Weakness and resistance of course would ignore this, and the strongest buff or debuff would always override the weaker one.

No pet really gets screwed over by this, because Anubsith has the choice of taking Deflection over stoneskin, or rupture over sandstorm. Ooze's still need a fix though, as corrosion simply does too much as is, and I believe removing the DoT component on it would balance things out.
Edited by Surrender on 2/15/2013 8:37 PM PST
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90 Undead Rogue
4535
02/15/2013 08:37 PMPosted by Surrender
You suggesting horrible counters (Lil' KT, I mean really, Anubsith can almost practically solo him alone) and using your 5.1 evidence for 5.2 comps is the core issue here.


No he can't. I use him all the time as anubisath counter. Works great! Obviously don't rely on low damage dots...

Come on man, you got to play more pets than the op pre 5.2 sets.
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90 Human Death Knight
12145
02/17/2013 09:05 AMPosted by Kenpo
You suggesting horrible counters (Lil' KT, I mean really, Anubsith can almost practically solo him alone) and using your 5.1 evidence for 5.2 comps is the core issue here.


No he can't. I use him all the time as anubisath counter. Works great! Obviously don't rely on low damage dots...

Come on man, you got to play more pets than the op pre 5.2 sets.


Again, your stuck on 5.1 mentality. We are discussing 5.2 pets, and Lil' KT is a HORRIBLE counter suggestion. We already know Magical Crawdad eats him for lunch, but Anubsith does practically almost solo him (5.2, 5.1 generally does NOT run stoneskin). Since your having a hard time wrapping your mind around this concept, I'm gonna show you WHY he almost practically solos him. Lets assume their a horrible player like you automatically assume and they insist on leaving him in vs Lil' KT.

Lil' KT (1627) Anubsith Idol (1725)

Sandstorm / Curse of Doom (1257) (1725) - First sandstorm isn't mitigated
Stoneskin / Shadow Slash (1257) (1460) - Subtraction before multiplication on weakness
Crush / Shadow Slash (1035) (1264) - Double shields + healing factored in
Crush / Shadow Slash (813) (1068)
Sandstorm / Shadow Slash (517) (872)
Crush / Shadow Slash (Curse of Doom) (295) (Dead)

I dunno about you, but in my books, that is "almost practically" soloing. Thats a bad counter example to that team, and you should feel bad for posting it earlier as hes pretty useless against the comp as a whole. I didn't even factor in misses (since it affects both parties equally) but if Lil' KT misses at any point, the fight goes on at LEAST one more round because Curse of Doom tops out at 753 against double shields (with the 5.2 shield fix kept in mind, as it was in the above example).
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90 Goblin Warlock
8095
sandstorm is not a big deal it has the same effect on every pet. so there is no advantage. now when stacking with something witha a shield the advantage goes to the shield only so its only like have 1 upper hand on you.

and as far as deep freeze hitting for 400 it actually hits for about 525 w/ a power grunt.

lets try this.- Turn 1 super sticky goo, to your shield
- Swap eat attack
- Ice tomb/geyser/stun seed etc , eat attack
- attack each other
-attack each other.....dead or close and stunned
no sandstorm plus shield

plus u can weather change with a LOT of pets to nulify the sandstorm

its not going to be a big deal. sure they are getting rid of the crazy hard hits on overpowerd ability sets but thats good.

and as far as this pet battle thread goes. SURRENDER you are not moderator, you do not get to set rules, you do not get to demand anything from anyone, you can give your opinion. noone needs to prove anything to you. stop being so arrogant. P.S. please quote me and defend yourself to prove my point
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100 Blood Elf Paladin
12150
/popcorn
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90 Human Death Knight
12145
sandstorm is not a big deal it has the same effect on every pet. so there is no advantage. now when stacking with something witha a shield the advantage goes to the shield only so its only like have 1 upper hand on you.


This simply shows you have no idea what your talking about. Addition/Subtraction is done before multiplication, so the more flat damage you reduce, the less damage you take from weaknesses and damage multiplier moves.

and as far as deep freeze hitting for 400 it actually hits for about 525 w/ a power grunt.


Pets that nobody uses. Plus deep freeze was already nerfed, and its stupidly easy to dodge the combo if your not running a Blizzard pet (good luck getting that off on a competent player).

02/22/2013 12:40 AMPosted by Shadowsedict
lets try this.- Turn 1 super sticky goo, to your shield


Nobody uses this, but I'll entertain the idea, and no, I'm not casting shield on turn 1, your eating a sandstorm.

02/22/2013 12:40 AMPosted by Shadowsedict
- Ice tomb/geyser/stun seed etc , eat attack


All nerfed and delayed abilities, but we'll continue.

- attack each other
-attack each other.....dead or close and stunned
no sandstorm plus shield


Nice math you included. Also, was I passing all these turns? Looks like it from your post.

02/22/2013 12:40 AMPosted by Shadowsedict
plus u can weather change with a LOT of pets to nulify the sandstorm


3 round CD. You better be good at guessing when I'm gonna cast it.

02/22/2013 12:40 AMPosted by Shadowsedict
its not going to be a big deal. sure they are getting rid of the crazy hard hits on overpowerd ability sets but thats good.


......and leaving shields as is will be ok with all big hits basically gone? Yeah, no.

02/22/2013 12:40 AMPosted by Shadowsedict
and as far as this pet battle thread goes. SURRENDER you are not moderator, you do not get to set rules,


K, not relevant to the conversation at all.

02/22/2013 12:40 AMPosted by Shadowsedict
you do not get to demand anything from anyone, you can give your opinion. noone needs to prove anything to you.


Oh, but I do. Posting "Its not OP" without any proof or valid reasoning (much like your flawed attempt) doesn't benefit the discussion at all. I provide facts at least. You provided gibberish.

02/22/2013 12:40 AMPosted by Shadowsedict
stop being so arrogant.


Provide some better facts or counter points. Everything so far has been poor attempts (with a 5.1 mentality) on what will more than likely be a broken 5.2 comp. You've failed to provide any math, basically said the player was incompetent on casting his shields, and made poor decision choices.

02/22/2013 12:40 AMPosted by Shadowsedict
P.S. please quote me and defend yourself to prove my point


You got what you wanted. Bring some math next time or go home, because what you posted didn't prove anything.
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90 Human Death Knight
12145
Anubisath Idol: Deflection and Sandstorm have switched positions (Deflection and Rupture now share a slot while Sandstorm and Stoneskin share another).

Further proof that double shielding is an issue. Pretty big blow to the comp, since you would be forced to switch a LOT more than you would currently.

Haters gonna hate. Good to see Blizzard addressing future problems and listening to reasoning instead of nonsense.
Edited by Surrender on 2/22/2013 10:18 PM PST
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100 Blood Elf Paladin
12150
02/22/2013 10:17 PMPosted by Surrender
Haters gonna hate. Good to see Blizzard addressing future problems and listening to reasoning instead of nonsense.


True statement. Now if only they would apply that logic to end game PvP!
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90 Goblin Warlock
8095
u have no idea what ur casting on turn one my point is that if you played as an example a pet with goo, you can prohibit stacking all these damage eating buffs and take out that pet.

for the most part all of the changes i agree with. i cant say i am a fan of nerfing some of the highly forshadowed abilities. they are easy to avoid. if you get hit by them then thats ur bad.
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90 Human Death Knight
12145
u have no idea what ur casting on turn one my point is that if you played as an example a pet with goo, you can prohibit stacking all these damage eating buffs and take out that pet.


Um, yeah, I actually do. I'll almost always gonna open with anubsith unless the situation would be extremely dire. Especially if I suspected someone might be running a "Goo" pet. Good luck stopping me from casting sandstorm + stoneskin, not that it matters because the developers clearly agreed that it was too powerful and removed that option from him.

for the most part all of the changes i agree with. i cant say i am a fan of nerfing some of the highly forshadowed abilities. they are easy to avoid. if you get hit by them then thats ur bad.


lol, seriouly? Funny, when I speak up about some potentially broken things in 5.2 its "oh, your completely WRONG!" Now that the developers agree its all roses and sunshine.

Also, there was NO way to avoid someone setting up double shield buffs, outside of gambling with weather (which the odds are in their favor, tank pet with a 3 round CD weather). Either way, the effects needed tone down, because with reflection gone, their #1 counter was removed. Combo the fact that they hit so hard, stunned, and you ate a regular hit that turn simply was too good.

You can say avoidance all you want, but tell me, how are you going to avoid it if say, oh I dunno, I sleep or stun you the turn before it lands? Yeah, thats what I thought, you wouldn't be avoiding it. Not to mention that it forces mandatory pets onto a team, which is something they seem to be trying to move away from (not that its a horrible idea to bring an avoidance pet). Plus, things like Biggles Ice Tomb into an Ice barrier combo would be pretty ridiculous without a nerf.
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85 Tauren Druid
7950
Although I agree with the changes in the latest patches like nerfing double shielding and Elementium Bolt/Ice Tomb, it makes the game much, much more bland.

There really won't be any strategy left in pet battles if they keep nerfing everything. All moves are gonna end up normal base power and the game is going to be glorified rock/paper/scissors. I mean, with all the downsides and side effects, what's gonna be the point of even using Ghostly Bite or Conflagrate if they keep nerfing them down to basically slightly better than a regular attack, but slightly worse if the conditions aren't met?

No one uses Triple Snap or Slicing Wind already over the 1/2 +1 abilities like Quills or Blitz. The inconsistency is absolutely crippling. I would rather have a consistent team than rely on high risk/medium reward. Crawdad keeps getting better and better for that reason alone, and it might realistically be the only decent pet in a month or two if they don't nerf Wish.

I would expect Wish to be nerfed very, very soon, at least down to 33% if not 25% like many other abilities.
Edited by Lillyoon on 2/23/2013 8:11 PM PST
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