More Divine Aegis/Prayer of Healing Nerfs :\

100 Blood Elf Priest
16485
So the following two statements were in a blue post and completely contradict each other.

1) Divine Aegis now works differently. It causes any critical heal to proc a bubble for 100% of the heal instead of doubling the heal. In other words, a crit for Holy is a 200% heal. A crit for Disc is a 100% heal + a 100% bubble. The bubble however benefits from mastery, so it's more likely a 100% heal + a 130% bubble.

2) Makes Prayer of Healing good for periods of restoring damage, but makes Power Word: Shield better for periods of preventing damage.

So on live, a critical heal with PoH will be a 200% heal + 100% divine aegis with mastery. Assuming a 20k normal heal and 30% mastery this means a critical PoH heal will be a 40k heal and 26k absorb for a total of 66k healing.

With this new ptr build and the same stats. A critical PoH heal will be 20k heal 26k absorb for a total of 46k healing.

Can anyone explain how a nerf to the healing component of PoH will make "Prayer of Healing good for periods of restoring damage?"

Edit: I just realised this is for all critical heals, not just PoH. So all of disc heals just got significantly worse, not just PoH. YAY!!!!!!!
Edited by Tweakler on 2/15/2013 6:21 PM PST
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100 Night Elf Priest
13820
Well, Mastery now increases our raw healing.
Edited by Elethia on 2/15/2013 6:22 PM PST
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100 Blood Elf Priest
16485
02/15/2013 06:21 PMPosted by Elethia
Well, Mastery now increases our raw healing.


Not by nearly as much as the nerf. It's not even worth mentioning.

Edit: and It's actually a slight buff to our heals, but a larger nerf to our absorbs. another nerf in disguise.
Edited by Tweakler on 2/15/2013 6:24 PM PST
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90 Troll Priest
9550
I believe the way that they are trying to fix disc priests is because right now, we can prevent a lot of damage after SS is on CD. Getting a 120k absorb on the entire raid is pretty substantial for some abilities regardless. However, since even going to comfortably hit 35% crit next patch, we wont have a 100% chance to get DA on everyone. Meaning that PoH will be mainly to stabilize the raid group.
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100 Blood Elf Priest
16485
02/15/2013 06:23 PMPosted by Lillèth
I believe the way that they are trying to fix disc priests is because right now, we can prevent a lot of damage after SS is on CD. Getting a 120k absorb on the entire raid is pretty substantial for some abilities regardless. However, since even going to comfortably hit 35% crit next patch, we wont have a 100% chance to get DA on everyone. Meaning that PoH will be mainly to stabilize the raid group.


The point is that the heal component of PoH has always been !@#$. Now they are taking away the guaranteed absorbs from it AND making the heals half as good on crits. It makes no %^-*ing sense and is completely ignoring the problem,
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90 Human Priest
5860
I like the way Amabella put it:

Imagine they took the Crit heal portion of our crits, and spread it around all of our heals via the new mastery.

That's kinda what they did to make the mastery change.

It should end up being a 5-10% nerf to heals and a 10-15% buff to PW:S, depending on C:M stats.

edit: The important change is now mastery is an interesting stat. It was going to be dumped by priests in 5.2. Haste will still be better than crit or mastery, but it's limited by mana regen and cds. So, gearing should be more interesting now.
Edited by Evry on 2/15/2013 6:29 PM PST
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90 Blood Elf Priest
12435
02/15/2013 06:26 PMPosted by Tweakler
Now they are taking away the guaranteed absorbs from it AND making the heals half as good on crits


Absorbs are heals.
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100 Blood Elf Mage
17990
OH GOD.

Tweakler, please read this thread: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/7924332656
Edited by Taymage on 2/15/2013 6:30 PM PST
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100 Blood Elf Priest
12515
02/15/2013 06:23 PMPosted by Tweakler
Well, Mastery now increases our raw healing.


Not by nearly as much as the nerf. It's not even worth mentioning.

Edit: and It's actually a slight buff to our heals, but a larger nerf to our absorbs. another nerf in disguise.

It's a quite significant buff to heals and a buff to PWS, and a nerf to crit heals. The end result is that total output might be reduced by less than 5% (depending on how much PWS you cast, you may break even), but more of it comes in predictable, reliable heals. It should be a buff to effective healing compared to the current PTR state.

(There's math demonstrating some of this in the other Disc threads.)
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100 Blood Elf Priest
16485
OH GOD.

Tweakler, please read this thread:


That's like handing someone a dictionary and telling them to read it because they spelled one word wrong.
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90 Human Priest
5860
it's like there's already a thread for this. or something.
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100 Blood Elf Mage
17990
OH GOD.

Tweakler, please read this thread:


That's like handing someone a dictionary and telling them to read it because they spelled one word wrong.


Huh? I'm telling you to read it, because it contains actual information about the proposed changes to disc, as opposed to your incorrect, sky-is-falling assessment.
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100 Blood Elf Priest
12515
02/15/2013 06:26 PMPosted by Evry
It should end up being a 5-10% nerf to heals

I think you're overestimating here.

02/15/2013 06:26 PMPosted by Tweakler
The point is that the heal component of PoH has always been !@#$.

It's currently just as good as Holy's in Serenity. After the Mastery change, it'll be somewhere in between Serenity and Sanctuary PoH. It's an excellent heal.

Considering that you can turn it into a shield 25% of the time, buff it by an additional 25% (for the record, that makes it better than Holy's in Sanc) 60% of the time, force it to crit once every 45 seconds, and haste it by 15% on demand by casting another excellent spell with similar throughput...I think you're going to be OK.
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100 Night Elf Priest
13820
02/15/2013 06:35 PMPosted by Tweakler
That's like handing someone a dictionary and telling them to read it because they spelled one word wrong.


Actually, it's probably like linking someone the entry of the word they misspelled/misused.

I'll also have some figures in a bit.
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100 Blood Elf Priest
16485


That's like handing someone a dictionary and telling them to read it because they spelled one word wrong.


Huh? I'm telling you to read it, because it contains actual information about the proposed changes to disc, as opposed to your incorrect, sky-is-falling assessment.


Just because I'm upset by the ridiculous changes doesn't make my math incorrect or my understanding of the nerf invalid. There are two potential buffs in the whole announced change.

The first "buff" is that PWS can now crit but was followed by severe nerfs making crit completely undesirable. How generous.

The second "buff" is that mastery now increases all healing, but makes our absorbs (which you mostly get from critting) much weaker. Again, making crit undesirable and negating the first "buff".
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100 Blood Elf Mage
17990
02/15/2013 06:42 PMPosted by Tweakler
the ridiculous changes


This is your problem.

You are wrong, the changes are not "ridiculous"; they are actually very close to many changes that actual, non-baddie disc priests have been asking for since the MoP beta. It's possible the numbers might need to be adjusted, but these changes are not "ridiculous".

Edit: at least you didn't claim these changes are "ruining the uniqueness of disc" like last time: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/7592912305?page=1
Edited by Taymage on 2/15/2013 6:51 PM PST
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90 Human Priest
5860
02/15/2013 06:26 PMPosted by Evry
depending on C:M stats.

So if you have, say, 12 Mastery points (equates to 30% Mastery), the current value of a crit is 3.3 * X. The new value is 2.402 * X. So that's clearly a significant nerf to crit.

However, it's not a significant nerf overall. If you have, say, 15% Crit raidbuffed, then your average heal under the current system is:
0.85 * X + 0.15 * 3.3 * X = 1.345 * X

Your average heal under the new system is:
0.85 * 1.096 * X + 0.15 * 2.402 * X = 1.292 * X

So it's on the order of a 3-5% nerf to overall healing from normal healing spells

20-25% crit and 25-30% mastery would show a more significant nerf.
Consider X to be 30k with 20% crit and 30% mastery

expected is 43.7k under previous 5.2 system
40.7k under new.
7% nerf.

You're right that I overestimated the buff to PWS though.

... why did I bump this thread?
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90 Troll Priest
9550
02/15/2013 06:54 PMPosted by Evry
7% nerf.


I still may see it as a nerf, but it's also a stabilization, we need it. Below you can see a 2 healed Heroic Blade Lord encounter each classes numbers are representing the top in the world for rankings. ( I know WoL isn't insanely accurate interpretation, but it's a generalization. ) Even with this 7% nerf, we still are number 2 among all 5 healers. I know it's fight dependent, but putting it in simple people terms.

( 2 ) Priest
Top : 85923
- 7% = 79908

( 5 ) Shaman
Top : 69296

( 1 ) Holy Paladin
Top : 85274

( 3 ) Mistweaver
Top : 77323

( 4) Resto Druid
Top : 74326
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90 Blood Elf Priest
13110
02/15/2013 06:36 PMPosted by Evry
it's like there's already a thread for this. or something.


Stop talking sense.
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90 Human Priest
5860
02/15/2013 07:08 PMPosted by Lillèth
I still may see it as a nerf

that's a 7% nerf from the current ptr build. not live. much bigger nerf (to PoH, anyway) compared to current live.
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