Patch 5.2 Official Trailer: The Thunder King

90 Undead Mage
12050
So! Here it is, finally out for the public to see, and not a teaser trailer this time!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Q51B6M70QBs

After seeing this, I'm not sure what to make of it right away. On one hand, the raid itself looks pretty decent. The architecture and atmosphere are cool and I'm excited to see what some of the fights are like. That being said, the trailer itself seems a bit... Underwhelming.

Don't get me wrong, I like to hear Lorewalker Cho rhyming to himself for two and a half minutes as much as the next guy. But the way this was presented didn't really make it seem like the Thunder King was really that intimidating or important, or at least not to me. Perhaps it was simply due to Cho being a pretty calm dude, but there wasn't any... urgency to this trailer. No overwhelming sense of, "Oh crap, this is -bad-. We better do something about this!" But that's just my two cents on the matter, and now I'm rambling.

So! Any thoughts on the trailer and the upcoming patch?
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89 Blood Elf Priest
4625
Nnnnnnggghh.

Lor'themar, lets do this!!!

Also, priest changes are overall pretty interesting.
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90 Pandaren Priest
14350
I guess it depends on if you expect Blizzard to make patch trailers with the people playing the game in mind, or to bring more people in.

If you think the trailer's meant to bring people in, then yeah it doesn't really show why Lei Shen is important. You could pick up on him being a bad guy because of slaves, but that might not be enough for you.

If you've played through the game to know that the Zandalari are bringing back old alliances with the mogu to gain enough power to retake Pandaria, it gives it a slightly different tone. The Kun-Lai quests, the Golden Lotus chain, and the 5.1 faction story show how important Lei Shen was to the mogu empire. And then there's whatever happens in the raids, which I'm sure more experienced people could bring up.

Lore points aside, I agree with some of the comments I've seen about the visuals. You can do more with lightning visually than fire, and that makes it look pretty cool.

I'm also a troll lore nut, so if this is the last big push for non-Darkspear trolls, I'm excited enough on principle :P
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90 Blood Elf Warrior
7430
Pretty!
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90 Tauren Hunter
14005
Pretty, but also very boring.
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Don't get me wrong, I like to hear Lorewalker Cho rhyming to himself for two and a half minutes as much as the next guy. But the way this was presented didn't really make it seem like the Thunder King was really that intimidating or important, or at least not to me. Perhaps it was simply due to Cho being a pretty calm dude, but there wasn't any... urgency to this trailer. No overwhelming sense of, "Oh crap, this is -bad-. We better do something about this!" But that's just my two cents on the matter, and now I'm rambling.


Like most dark legends an' lore, the stories don't near enough bring ta mind the true evil underneath...it's yer mind tha' makes it scary!
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90 Troll Hunter
13225
Very ominous and, in my opinion, interesting. Very cool.

In fact (And I doubt this was intentional), it reminds me of an ominous thunder storm coming in the distance.

I'mma end up loving this patch.
Edited by Pyronaptor on 2/27/2013 12:26 PM PST
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90 Troll Monk
14840
5.2 WHERe
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90 Night Elf Rogue
12875
I think the main problem is that they're playing up the wrong conflict.

Most people are interested primarily in how the Kirin Tor vs. Sunreavers will play out. The Zandalari are negligible; we already know how this will end. The mysteries of the Mogu are somewhat more interesting, but even then, they're just the latest in a long parade of would-be conquerors who are evil and wicked for no reason.

Lei Shen himself doesn't really have a personality. He's big, he likes weather-related effects, he's a jerk. Like most Mogu.

If Cataclysm proved one thing, it's that the urge to destroy/enslave Azeroth isn't all that intimidating anymore. The fourth wall was broken owing to the quality of Cataclysm's writing. We know this is a video game, so we know we'll win. Hence, there's no particular reason to build up what happens if we lose. All the threats of "if we don't stop him here, it means the end of Azeroth" ring hollow. It's not going to happen and we know it.

What should be built up, then, is what happens if we win. What happens when we kill Lei Shen? What does it mean for Pandaria aside from victory? Does it mean the Mantid run free with one less enemy stopping them? Does it mean the problems with the Horde and Alliance are exacerbated?

Lei Shen, as they've built him up, is trivial to this. We don't know anything about him except that he's just like every other Mogu out there.
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90 Orc Warrior
6980
The Trolls in this looked bad !@#. And that's about all that interested me in it =/, though I hope it's fun for you raiders.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
6685
This trailer made me wish Paladins could wield guns, I want to put a rifle in Jaina's face and be like "Bal'a dash! Witch!"
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90 Night Elf Rogue
12875

I'm also a troll lore nut, so if this is the last big push for non-Darkspear trolls, I'm excited enough on principle :P


It baffles me how so many people seem excited for the Zandalari. Every troll on Azeroth outside of the Darkspear are completely interchangeable for motive and method.

They had a fleeting opportunity here to make it more about reclaiming a homeland for the Zandalari and make it a desperate fight to the finish (and they still might play that up more), but at the moment, the Zandalari are about on terms with the Naga for rotating stock villains.

The aesthetic is kind of neat, sure. I was impressed with it when I ran Zul'Gurub back in classic. I was really impressed when I ran Zul'Aman and actually got to finish it in Burning Crusade. The charm was wearing off when I did Drak'tharon and Gundrak, but I thought it would be the last. By the time I had to re-run Zul'Aman and Zul'Gurub for six months, I was thoroughly annoyed with trolls and their harebrained schemes.

Further, I have no idea why the Darkspear aren't present at this battle. They're the ones being openly oppressed by Garrosh, who have the most reason to go seeking a weapon to use against him and who have the biggest beef with the Zandalari. I know Vol'jin's incapacitated, but surely, he could direct from the sidelines.
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89 Blood Elf Priest
4625
I am wondering if this is more of a buffer patch, for more to come really.
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90 Undead Mage
12050
. They're the ones being openly oppressed by Garrosh, who have the most reason to go seeking a weapon to use against him and who have the biggest beef with the Zandalari. I know Vol'jin's incapacitated, but surely, he could direct from the sidelines.


They're busy being put down by the Kor'kron and such. They've got their own problems to worry about.
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90 Night Elf Rogue
12875
02/27/2013 02:04 PMPosted by Taldin
. They're the ones being openly oppressed by Garrosh, who have the most reason to go seeking a weapon to use against him and who have the biggest beef with the Zandalari. I know Vol'jin's incapacitated, but surely, he could direct from the sidelines.


They're busy being put down by the Kor'kron and such. They've got their own problems to worry about.


Didn't we team up with Thrall to fix that?

And isn't finding leverage to be used against Hellscream one of their own problems?
Edited by Enekie on 2/27/2013 2:06 PM PST
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90 Pandaren Priest
14350
Well if you can name an organization (good or evil) in WoW who -didn't- have predictable, repeated motives behind their deeds, by all means. I'm just more attached to trolls since my main was one from BC to Cataclysm. And I like the troll aesthetic when they really get into it. Zul'Drak was visually awesome to me, as is Echo Isles 2.0.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
8980
02/27/2013 01:08 PMPosted by Enekie
Does it mean the Mantid run free with one less enemy stopping them? Does it mean the problems with the Horde and Alliance are exacerbated?


Be your own logic, it wouldn't matter, because this is a video game and we know it'll all be solved eventually because people need to be able to keep playing.

Once you disregard the wall in one aspect of immersion, you might as well just knock it all down.
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90 Night Elf Rogue
12875
02/27/2013 02:07 PMPosted by Neizhi
Well if you can name an organization (good or evil) in WoW who -didn't- have predictable, repeated motives behind their deeds, by all means. I'm just more attached to trolls since my main was one from BC to Cataclysm. And I like the troll aesthetic when they really get into it. Zul'Drak was visually awesome to me, as is Echo Isles 2.0.


You've a point there.

But the best villains at least had more varied motives than "destroy Azeroth/get power." And we usually only had to fight them once or twice.

The Scarlet Crusade was a group who genuinely thought they were the last people on earth. Everyone else had become corrupted or was undead. Their first goal was survival, their second was to reclaim their homeland. Their methods were extreme in the utmost, but they were somewhat logical.

The Defias was a group out for revenge. They had given their all to Stormwind and weren't paid back for their efforts. Their goal, then, was to make a political statement and to make the monarchy pay, one way or another (bringing them back in Cataclysm was a mistake, since their story was already done).

The trolls, though, have always been in pursuit of a vague, always nebulous goal of "power." The thing that makes them frustrating, though, is that themes of a decaying empire and the total annihilation of troll civilization and their struggle to come to grips with that are really cool. But they're almost entirely fan-born and speculative, since they always get glossed over in the game.

Above all, though: any villain suffers from repeat exposure, and the effect gets worse the more they are repeated. The Defias were a complex moral question the first time and a chore the second. The Scarlet Crusade were a dangerous lunatic sect the first time and a collection of fun mini-games the second. The Trolls were an ancient, continents-spanning empire the first time and now they are indistinguishable from any other mob.
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90 Night Elf Rogue
12875
02/27/2013 02:09 PMPosted by Veloran
Does it mean the Mantid run free with one less enemy stopping them? Does it mean the problems with the Horde and Alliance are exacerbated?


Be your own logic, it wouldn't matter, because this is a video game and we know it'll all be solved eventually because people need to be able to keep playing.

Once you disregard the wall in one aspect of immersion, you might as well just knock it all down.


As you'll no doubt note, you can regain the immersion and emotional investment by addressing different aspects of the conflict.

The trolls, as they stand, are largely pointless. They don't do anything except get killed.

But there was an interesting point at the end of the Thunder King questline in Kun Lai where the prophet said: "We need this land. The Cataclysm destroyed our homes."

That is how you regain immersion.

How do we feel about this? Mercy for refugees is a huge theme in both the Alliance and the Horde, should we feel right about denying the trolls a new homeland? Sure, they're attacking us, but couldn't we find a better way? What do we lose by killing them? The Horde displaced dozens of indigenous peoples to make a homeland for their refugees, doesn't this act make them hypocrites? The Alliance has more refugees than ever, doesn't this set a bad precedent?

That would be more interesting than "trolls are back, this time with dinosaurs, go kill them." That, unfortunately, is the angle being played up.
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