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Anyone who's played wow long enough has experienced one if not many guild break up experiences. Prestigious guilds often dissolve, for good or for bad its always upsetting to watch the process unfold in front of you and worse yet if you're involved.
If you've been on Eitrigg long enough you'll no doubt know the name ANZACS. But few know the history of the guild. For years ANZACS has been a linchpin in Eitrigg's community. The guild was founded in October 2006 by Tui and by the time i started playing in 2008 ANZACS had already become a household name. In a time where Raiding on Eitrigg thrived ANZACS and its members could proudly call themselves a top 5 raiding guild.
While managing hundreds of members and organizing a multitude of events Tui and her officers made the guild into a community in its own right and gave both the casual and hardcore members a banner they could be proud to wave while progressing through multiple expansions and content. Though great as ANZACS had become, no guild, no community for that matter are immune to the clash of personalities that come with any collection of people under one banner.
One could argue that the guilds success was its own downfall. Success draws talent and often talent breeds ego. Particular members of the guilds main progression group lacked confidence in Tuis abilities as a raider. Thinking themselves elite and too good for her, they proceeded to alienate and mock her until she, without the support from those she called her friends and officers, lost confidence in herself. Feeling alone, unconfident and betrayed, Tui promoted Gnipon to gm and left the guild in May 2012.
In the months that followed the community of ANZACS began to fade. More focus was put into its 10 man raid team and less into the members of the guild, people left and recruitment stopped. The raid team remained and progressed but eventually the prestige of ANZACS became merely a shade of what it once was and the only active members were the ANZACS raid team. Now even that has inevitably dissolved due to the atmosphere born of elitist players.
Now that the dust has settled the majority of ANZACS players, both elitist and not, have left the guild. Gnipon, as GM of ANZACS tattered remnants, has outright refused to reinstate Tui to her proper title as owner of ANZACS. Instead he dumps the guild onto an officer and makes plans to leave the server.
As a player of Eitrigg im sad to watch such an event unfold. But as a friend of Tui im outraged at these developments. Anyone who has played WoW long enough has experienced similar situations. Its sad to see our favorite guilds end, whether it be slowly or abruptly we all mourn the passing of our realms top guilds. Even a casual player who is just used to seeing ANZACS members run around and hear about them in trade chat is impacted. I write this article as a tribute to ANZACS, from October 06 to May 2012. A tribute to one of Eitrigg's finest.
I don't have anything against tui but let me get this straight she quit the guild over what I believe was criticism over the way she played her class or what not (don't have exact details) she then takes 150k+(not sure on amount) gold from the gbank that she herself had not earned for the guild and in fact was a gift from one of our previous raiders she then for some odd reason paid for a guild name changed gave us the name !@#$ I have forum screenshots for that and finally gquits, Again no love lost towards you guys but people do deserve the truth even if feelings get hurt, I don't think she deserves the guild and Cekaz should be the rightful owner as he has helped and been with anzacs through all the bull %^-* he has provided much of his time to us and taken any criticism thrown his way so no the guild will not go to tui seeing as how cekaz is staying on eitrigg and possibly forming a group of his own
fml my grammar
Constructive criticism is one thing, but all out hazing and total alienation from people u call friends is another. I did my best to keep my post neutral and stick to facts. Fact is you dont put 6 years of your life into building something just for a group of people make u feel like u dont deserve any of it. Prolonged exposure to peoples blatant disrepect for u is enough to make anyone wanna leave. I cant imagine the strength it took to not just kick the offenders and replace them rather than leaving behind 6 years of your life because its whats best for the guild.
Brother you don't know a !@#$%^- thing and I helped build that guild just as much as Tui did so I really don't want to read your bull*!@# secondhand story analysis of how the guild was ran for the past 6 years because you were not there. She quit over criticism of her gameplay as she wanted to continue doing heroics raids while not trying to improve herself when called out on her mistakes (logs have proved this). I also won't mention the various raid teams in the guild that were broken up due to her stubbornness since late 2007 on, oops, but I just did.
I won't mention guild names but three raiding guilds that appeared since 2007+ were a result of the ongoing background bull$%^-. She wanted to keep progressing but in each of those situations, the groups kept getting better and her mistakes (and to be fair, some of our other terrible players at the time) kept hold those teams back and thus they would leave after awhile, because people cannot take constructive criticism of their gameplay and were not good enough for the content at the time. I mean, god*!@#ing damn, we did Karazhan for over a year and that was where the first raid team breakup occurred because the other team was too damn good. Its pretty amusing and sad when I look back at it.
I turned a blind eye towards it for far too long and finally got tired of it when she tried breaking up the last raid team due to her incompetence as a raider last year. Like Shock said above, she pulled off some extremely childish acts as a result before she left and she expected me to hand over the guild back to her just like that as if everything in the world is right? LOL Screw that noise. She'll never ever step foot back into that guild again and I'll be leaving my paladin in it just to make sure.
The reason the current guild broke up is because we just couldn't keep fielding decent players for the content we're on and everyone got sick of it for various reasons. We play a game to succeed and improve ourselves and as a team, not to wallow in a shallow kiddie pool of mediocrity. If reveling is that state of being is fine for you, then by all means have at it. A lot of us have better things to do with our time and money.
You forget the fact that gnip, cekaz and a few others also put there life on building that guild and I was not there during the so called hazing or have ever experienced it raiding with anzacs, also from my experience with anzacs I have always seen either Rawful(old member) Gnip, Vrash, Cekaz and dare I say it cause it will make me the devil Ayssa contribute for the guild instead of taking for there own profit (Speaking from personal experience from things I saw early cata), and all this information you are feeding forums is based off either Tui or people who were not happy in this guild cause either A) Our guild chat is not for those with no humor B)Had to replace them in order to progress(After giving them multiple attempts) C) Were not happy with anything Ayssa did
Honestly tho instead of hearing what you have to say I would like to see Tui defend these accusations cause if I am wrong I will apologize but until she says otherwise I don't fully know the truth behind this entire BS trying to give us a bad name like we intentionally ran anzacs to the ground we gave our 100% to try to make it live up to the name but being a late night guild on eitrigg is complete !@#$ and we will not apologize for failing at that
Thank you Ispep for being my champion, it is much appreciated :). I am not one for dirty laundry in public however it is probably time that the record was set straight.
Firstly, ANZACS was my guild - from the time I started it in 2006 until I left it in 2012. For those of you saying it belonged to everyone, I will say you are not correct.
Nobody who was in the guild in the last year was in the guild when I started it, not one person. So none of you can say you put as much into that guild as I did. The longest serving member was Gnip, who joined sometime in 2007 I think, and I have fielded many complaints from people who wanted to know why he was 2nd highest rank when he never did anything. I always replied that Gnip was in that position because I trusted him, because he was a good player who could be relied upon to turn up for every raid, who kept us informed of a lot of upcoming wow changes and he knew the fights. As is often the case in all walks of life, those who are not responsible for making decisions are always convinced they would do it better, and when I got tired of that bull!@#$ I gave him the guild so he could prove he was better at it. I understand that he continued to do nothing, and you can now see the result of that.
I took 150k gold from the guild when I left as I felt that was a fair amount to cover my contribution and intellectual property. People are buying unknown lvl 25 guilds for that amount, let alone one with a such a good reputation (and achievements). It must be mentioned that if I had kicked everyone out they wouldn't have got anything, let alone the 300k gold that was still in the gbank plus all the valuable mats and gear we had stocked.
For those that are unaware of what ANZACS means - it stands for Australian and New Zealand Army Corps - and I chose that name as it would be instantly recognisable to any Australians and New Zealanders playing, who would know that it was a late night guild. When I left, there was an objectionable Australian in the guild who was rude and disrespecful to me without knowing anything at all about me or the guild, and the rest were mostly Americans. Therefore I changed the guild name to <Aus n US> which happily had the anagram of A N U S. The main point of this was to give them a free guild name change (as Blizzard would change it free of charge) so they could reinvent themselves as a new guild and go forward from there. Despite my encouragement they retained my old guild name. It may have been childish but it was the only thing that made me smile during a very upsetting time, especially since it remained as their guild name on the forums for a few days after it had been changed back.
By leaving them with the guild I gave them every opportunity to succeed. They had an established raid team, an established guild and all they needed to do was embrace the new content. They mocked and criticised my decisions on keeping trouble makers out of the guild, but everything I did was for the sustainability of my guild. My aim was never to be best on the server - what does that even mean? Why would you put up with total asshats in order to have slightly better gear than others for a few months? My aim was to see the end game raid content in a respectable timeframe with a good team of people. Having rude and disrespectful people in the raid team who sneered and put down others is not my idea of a fun time - and that's what this is about right? It's a game.
I am amused by the responses that said Tui is crap and it's all her fault but we only failed because it's difficult to run a late night raiding guild. Irony much? Their lack of acknowledgement of my contribution to ANZACS, and their failure to return it to me just shows how dishonourable they are, in my opinion.
All I gotta say is that I wasn't there, and the reasons of ANZACs fall are just as stupid, if not more stupid, than for the reasons that Tui quit. i mean, I don't think we as a guild can blame anyone but ourselves.. just leave Tui out of this for the sake of the present and not the past.
this isn't a boat that needs to go down with its captain.. that happened a long time ago, and we're lucky we even swam to shore in the first place. Just leave it, accept ispep's generous post and don't bring up flame that started/ended so long ago.
Respect to both Tui and ispep for keeping TDK a sane place and no visible breakdowns in the future. i hope you guys keep growing.
Currently still a proud member of ANZACS and happy to have Cekaz leading with Gnip around to make sure we always have good "management" :). Thank you guys for all you have done this past year and will continue to do going forward!!! <3
^^that's the spirit.
EDIT: No disrespect to Ayssa or Gnip.. you guys both did a damn fine job. If it wasn't for you two, I would have never raided really, and I'd probably still be on Eitrigg trying for Glad.. lol. But, yeah.. I have no business here other than that I'm sad to see it end. Much love and peace!
Edited by Psyran on 2/25/2013 9:27 PM PST
Eh, thanks for the kind words but its a result of my mismanagement that brought about current events and I will readily own up to those mistakes.
My main mistake was staying on this crappy backwater server for four years too long. Should have left in 2009 like I was going to. Would have saved me a literal !@#$ ton of headaches and time.
"My aim was never to be best on the server - what does that even mean? Why would you put up with total asshats in order to have slightly better gear than others for a few months? My aim was to see the end game raid content in a respectable timeframe with a good team of people. Having rude and disrespectful people in the raid team who sneered and put down others is not my idea of a fun time - and that's what this is about right? It's a game." from Tui's post.
That is how i feel as well. I always felt ANZACS was Tui's not Gnip or anyone else. but that is just my opinion or point of view. I liked Gnip when i raided but even before Tui left. It seemed like Gnip was trying to take control. I thought Gnip and some others were causing problems and in my opinion were trying to get Tui ousted.
To me, Tui really cared about ANZACS and how the guild ran and how the members felt about the guild and all that. I stayed in the guild for a little bit after Tui left and it seemed like Gnip honestly didn't really care about the guild other than the main raiders. I felt all he really cared about was raiding. It almost seemed like he was taking it too personally like it was his job but that is just my opinion. I enjoyed when i raided and all the other stuff I did in ANZACS when Tui was in charge. I felt like ANZACS took a turn for the worst after Tui left. I don't think it was Tui's fault though. I felt like after Tui left, all the guild ever cared about anymore was raiding and trying to be the top raiding guild on the server.
I believe that Tui has intellectual property on ANZACS. I felt that 150k would be worth what she put into the guild that she created. Gnip, Cekaz or even Rawful didn't even create the guild. I don't know what you guys think but I think if you put as much time and effort into a guild you built and ran just like Tui for that amount of time, you would take about that same amount of gold. Also Gnip if you say your main mistake was staying on this server, why do you still have toons on this server then? if you still keep toons on this server then you must not consider this a crappy backwater server. A guild shouldn't be keeping you on a server that you don't want to be on in the first place. its like you are contradicting yourself.
See this is the point in the conversation I just step out its pretty pointless cause I keep hearing the same !@#$ over and over in the end this thread is just a wall of text, The guild belongs to Cekaz if he wishes to hand it over its on him, TDK speaks so highly about tui and that is perfectly fine you all have the right to an opinion but my beef was never directly towards her she is a human being and has flaws just like any one of us, my beef was the way she handled these things she talks about being dishonorable when she herself set the perfect example with her actions towards her guild and all the non raiders that may have looked up to her in the guild with that I am out Peace out Eitrigg is was fun while it lasted and like I said no love lost if you wanna keep in touch THERAFLU#1875
Edited by Shockramen on 2/25/2013 10:08 PM PST
Can I start this out by stating that I am honestly, truthfully surprised at what has happened so far in this post.
Ispep, I have never spoken to you, but I held you in quite high esteem, as your previous comments and posts have seemed intelligent and insightful, a good deal more so than what you have presented here.
I feel that Tui, Gnip, Ciran, Iggy & Dreco have all given really honest, straight forward personal opinions that are both really interesting and incredibly thought provoking.
I feel that Shock though, has given the most accurate account of what has happened in the immediate history that I have been a part of. In order to be impartial, you need first hand information, combined with detailed experiences outside of the situation. Both things Shock has in abundance but none of the other posters in this thread so far have had.
At this point too, I feel I should mention that during my two and a bit years with Anzacs, no member (be they GM,officer, raider or casual) put as much effort into the guild in such a space of time as Ayssa did. The vast majority of the time we did not see eye to eye, but the guild owes their current ranking to the work he put in. The facts are the facts.
I would also like to add at this point that I bear no ill will to anyone here, as far as I am concerned the past is the past and if anyone at all in this thread had their car break down in front of me, I would be the first to leap out and lend a hand. I am done with raiding as of last week, I am moving on in life. I am a year away from completing a double degree in Marketing & Human Resources, with after graduate diplomas in both Commercial Law & Financial Accounting. I have put an offer on potentially the first house I have ever owned. I am moving in with my girlfriend. And in the background I am negotiating with several organisations on an internship/hire scenario.
The point I am seeking to make is that I have moved on, I actually don't care much about a lot of what happens. Although I am looking forward to many conversations in the future with people both represented here in this thread and who I have met along the way. I am choosing to make these comments below because when skim reading the posts, there is a bit of incorrect information being touted as fact. I dislike incorrect information being touted as fact. I believe in transparency and honesty at every level.
I will continue this then, quoting sections and responding to them in my usual manner. This will be to point out incorrect or heavily biased information & I shall attempt to rectify or present another opinion on the issue.
Edited by Vrashnar on 2/26/2013 12:22 AM PST
You left server once too, bro, so I really don't want to hear your crap about that as well.
Tui didn't care about the guild bro, she just cared about the prestige that come with being a guild leader without the hard work that goes along with it. Hard work that others and myself put into it moreso than she ever did. Once the various raid leaders took over she always took more of a backseat approach to many aspects of it.
Like all of the times we tried to discuss ways to improve the raiding situation over the years. Make her mad and she'll log off and sulk for 2+ days at a time like a child. I cannot believe I pandered to that crap for so long.
That's where I went wrong as well, I started getting lazy this past year and should have contributed more than that I did and ignored some guild responsibilities when I shouldn't have. I do regret my lack of action. Least I can admit where I went wrong unlike other people, though.
But to make a really long and drawn out pissing and circle-jerk session that this pathetic thread has become (and lets not lie, was the basis for its creation to begin with), none of this really matters anymore and she is never getting the guild back ever again.
Anyway, I'm going to go watch a movie and hopefully there will be some more entertainment waiting for me in this thread to read about when I get back.
Edited by Gnipon on 2/25/2013 10:39 PM PST
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