Pandaren are annoying.

90 Troll Hunter
12970
03/21/2013 01:47 AMPosted by Suraia
it wasn't used against the Alliance pre-wrath because it was in development. Again, what kind of brain damaged idiot would think the Forsaken wouldn't use it against the Alliance?

I suppose I would, if the two factions aren't at war.

03/21/2013 01:47 AMPosted by Suraia
because they don't do the same kind of damage. Blight renders an area uninhabitable. Mana bombs don't.

Look at Theramore and tell me it isn't uninhabitable.

But it wasn't used against those entities, it was used against the Alliance, so why mention it as if it happened? It was being designed as a shock and awe super weapon to use against the Alliance from the start. It just happened to be useful against everything. The developers going rogue changes nothing, Sylvanas got her plague and the research on how to continue making it was not lost or destroyed, which is why those weak scum haul around plague wagons everywhere they set up a base camp.

The developers going rogue changes everything because if they didn't it wouldn't have been used against the Alliance. It would have been used against the Scourge.

Mogu were not put down by the Shado-pan, Mogu were defeated by the combined efforts of all the races on Pandaria as well as the Celestial benefactors, 12000 years ago. Grummles stopped delivering food and supplies and started running communications for the rebellion, Hozen began ravaging Mogu bases, Jinyu used their talents to get the elements on their side and the Celestials gave the rebels powerful boons to strike against the Mogu. *After* Lei Shen died. I'm not saying they aren't good at what they do, but what they do is limited to conflicts that as we've shown already, a mere group of adventurers can handle...

I'm not even saying they could have defeated the Mogu.

I'm saying that a larger version of the Shado-Pan, comprised of all races, and using the same Rogue based fighting tactics, could defeat a Legion invasion. This debate started when I said Azeroth would be better off if the world thought like the Pandaren do, and if we had this hypothetical Shado-Pan-Azeroth group, they could defeat the Legion.
Reply Quote
90 Human Rogue
7765
But before Wrathgate, there was no proof that the Blight would be used against the Alliance. Hell, there was hardly any proof it even existed, since all we had to go on was some low level quests.


Howling Fjord, Vengeance Landing - Mission? Take these new plague bombs we have developed and hit an Alliance reinforcement fleet that is about to deliver aid to the small outpost just outside of our base of operations.

Was the RAS still Forsaken loyal at the time? Yep, do we even have any evidence that these RAS members are part of the rogue RAS? Nope. Just undead, with a plague weapon, using it against the Alliance.

But I would find it amusing to watch a Monk try to escape from a demon by throwing dirt in its eye.

/Uses Dirt Throw
*The giant mass of animated felfire and hardened rock known as an Infernal does not have the cognitive ability to comprehend as to why anyone would throw dirt at it and expect results and merely continues to march and burn away all life in the area.*

You also don't want to acknowledge that you admitted that the Shado-Pan would need a much larger force to handle these issues on their own. When they do not believe that there is a need to have a larger force because they do not have world ending threats like the Legion or the Troll empires kicking on their door. Well they have trolls NOW but its not like the locals could do jack about it without our help.

If every race on Azeroth had the Pandaren ideals, then there would not be a NEED for large armies as most problems could be solved through diplomacy. But then eventually the Legion WOULD find your planet, never was it stated that the planets inhabitants were the reason that the Legion would find a world in fact, Sargeras first encountered the Demons as they hunted down worlds on their own to corrupt their inhabitants to the point of insanity. There was no indication that the locals ever sought out the demons and were simply victims.

And so when the demons of the legion come knocking, everyone would die because they would be insufficiently prepared to handle the threat, even if the Legion didn't start with subterfuge (which I doubt because they have the Nathrezim on thier side).

The reason everyone in this game doesn't die is because we have our massive armies ready to stomp on everything.

And Blizzard must be retconning the s$#t out of the Horde because according to the BG text from Vanilla, the Warsong outriders never stopped invading Ashenvale after Grommash Hellscream began it before the Battle for Hyjal. So there would be NO reason for the Elves to trade with, and later embargo, the Horde in the first place.

And a massive retcon would sadly be believable because of how Metzen wants the Horde to be portrayed in a more positive light. (See original Doomhammer vs. Lothar compared to the honorable duel and the Origins of the Dark Horde)
Reply Quote
90 Blood Elf Warlock
5970
I'm not even saying they could have defeated the Mogu.

I'm saying that a larger version of the Shado-Pan, comprised of all races, and using the same Rogue based fighting tactics, could defeat a Legion invasion. This debate started when I said Azeroth would be better off if the world thought like the Pandaren do, and if we had this hypothetical Shado-Pan-Azeroth group, they could defeat the Legion.


A larger version of the Shado-Pan would end if failure against the legion no matter what, and here are two reasons why.

Reason #1
- The Shado-Pan are pretty much specialized hit and run/stealth specialists, which you yourself stated earlier. The whole purpose of hit and run and/or stealth tactics is to hit the enemy fast and hard when they're not expecting it and then to make a hasty escape.

Strengths
- You can starve the enemy of supplies and resources
- You avoid major losses of life
- You can start a fight on your own conditions
- You can demoralize your enemy and make them fear you

Weaknesses
- You do not have the ability to stand toe to toe with the enemy
- You can be countered very easily if the enemy employes a scorched earth strategy
- Your hit and run tactics become near ineffective when fighting a never ending army
- In order to keep your hit and run tactics effective you need to move lightly, that
means no heavy support and no chance to catch your breath. You're always on
the move.

Reason #2
- The legion is a never ending war machine, and their soul reason to live is to purge the universe. They have an endless supply of demons with hundreds if not thousands of different specialties. These demons are the most powerful from their respective homeworlds and have experienced battles on millions of different planets. Also, the scourge was created and is controlled by the burning legion (Ignore the whole lich king fiasco for the time being). Not to mention the legion also had the power to take control of and taint the Ered'ruin, which were specialized magic 'police' that were created by the titans.

Strengths
- Never ending supply of specialized infantry. When demons die they return to the
twisting nether where they regenerate and eventually make their ways back to the front
lines.
- The legion has many different races which specialize in different aspects such as the:
+ Eredar, masters of the arcane
+ Nathrezim, masters of portals and gateways
+ Annihilan, hulking demons fueled by rage who are veritably engines of utter
destruction
- A single demons of the legion posses the strength of many men (Dependent on
demonic race)
- When the legion sets up base camps they destroy everything around them. This can be
seen in game in many places in Outland (Nagrand is a good example). Basically they
employ the Scorched Earth strategy at all times.
- The scourge. If having a never ending supply of demons at their command wasn't
enough, they now have all of your dead to fuel their war maching even further. You
think hit and run tactics are demoralizing? Try watching your best friend die, then being
forced to kill him yourself.

Weaknesses
- The entirety of the Legions forces are commanded by high ranking demons
- Troop movement is slower with large forces

After doing some research you would find that shado-pan strategies, mindset, and proficiency would in no way be able to match the legion in any way.
Edited by Salorial on 3/21/2013 4:25 PM PDT
Reply Quote
90 Human Warrior
13500
And if the Night Elves thought like Pandaren, the Legion wouldn't have came here in the first place.


I think it's a little much to imply that the Mantid/Yaungol/Sha/Saurok are even equal to the Legion on their own.

What's more, the Shado-Pan only recently had to fight all these threats on their own, and they were found wanting.

The Shado-Pan only had to fight small skirmishes here and there except for the (yearly?) Mantid Culling where they'd throw themselves at the wall in an attempt to kill out the weak so only the strong would return.

Pandaren lived in peace until recently. The Shado-Pan is not an army.
Edited by Mordstreich on 3/21/2013 5:10 PM PDT
Reply Quote
90 Human Death Knight
13050
I'm saying that a larger version of the Shado-Pan, comprised of all races, and using the same Rogue based fighting tactics, could defeat a Legion invasion. This debate started when I said Azeroth would be better off if the world thought like the Pandaren do, and if we had this hypothetical Shado-Pan-Azeroth group, they could defeat the Legion.


Are you implying that we should all become Demon Hunters? Because I think that's exactly what you're subtly implying, mister.
Reply Quote

Please report any Code of Conduct violations, including:

Threats of violence. We take these seriously and will alert the proper authorities.

Posts containing personal information about other players. This includes physical addresses, e-mail addresses, phone numbers, and inappropriate photos and/or videos.

Harassing or discriminatory language. This will not be tolerated.

Forums Code of Conduct

Report Post # written by

Reason
Explain (256 characters max)
Submit Cancel

Reported!

[Close]