Please let us see how many bosses are down.

90 Human Warlock
16930
03/19/2013 05:38 PMPosted by Sabod
What most people don’t realize is that if they get and complete an in-progress run, the next time they queue they will preferentially be placed into a fresh instance.


Can you comment on players getting in progress queues on council when they already have killed council that week?

This was happening a lot to a guild member later in the week who was queuing with a few other guild members who hadn't killed anything yet and just wasted his time, do I have to queue solo so I don't get queued into bosses I have already killed?


Late in the week means less people are queuing overall, if an in progress raid needs to be filled and you are the only ones on the list, guess what is going to happen. It will prefer to pull fresh people in, but there has to be fresh people to pull in in the queue.
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90 Human Warrior
11085
I love getting ported into LFR instances on last boss who can't be pulled due to him bugging out, only option is to drop group. Gets deserter buff. Then try to sit and do dailies. Can't do new SOLO scenario due to having debuff.
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90 Night Elf Druid
15130

The patch has only been out a couple days of course, but personally I think there are some people who don’t realize yet how an in-progress run, and that extra Valor, can directly translate to improved items through the new upgrade system. An in-progress run is very likely better bang for the buck to your character power due to item level upgrades than hitting cancel over and over to get a fresh run and then hoping for a boss drop.


Move people to the front of the queue would be more rewarding. How many hours should people have to wait in line to complete a single raid?
Edited by Suialthor on 3/19/2013 6:52 PM PDT
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90 Night Elf Hunter
10115
It's bullcrap that I wait 30+ minutes to join a queue and only get to do 1 boss. Then I have to queue again for 30+ more minutes to see the other two.


People like you are just out and out loathsome and contemptuous.

Look - BE HAPPY YOU EVEN HAVE LFR, you bunch of whining malcontents.

The rule about bosses is JUST FINE. If you do not like it - then DO NOT RUN LFR!!!!

Go back to the way it used to be, when you people could not even GET in a raid, or if you did it was when everything was already nerfed to 30%.
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90 Night Elf Hunter
10115
03/19/2013 07:00 PMPosted by Elbeghast
BE HAPPY YOU EVEN HAVE LFR


I would rather LFR not even exist than to place me in a partial run. I've already stopped running LFR because of it.


Good - then your problem has been solved. So, quit posting and run along now.
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90 Human Paladin
13215
It was created to further worsen the gameplay experience for those of us with gameplay time limitations by forcing us to queue multiple times to get a fresh run.

But in all seriousness, it was created because if your LFR group had people leave after a boss, 90% of the people who saw the queue pop up would decline an invite to non-fresh runs, resulting in people having to wait 15-20+ mins to get a raid group if someone left.
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11 Draenei Paladin
50
Go back to the way it used to be, when you people could not even GET in a raid, or if you did it was when everything was already nerfed to 30%.


I think LFR is nerfed by about 30% of normal mode raids.
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90 Human Paladin
10685
03/19/2013 07:00 PMPosted by Elbeghast
BE HAPPY YOU EVEN HAVE LFR


I would rather LFR not even exist than to place me in a partial run.

I've already stopped running LFR because of it. One less healer in the queue. I only wish more tanks and healers would boycott LFR.


Wow, you'd rather everyone else suffer because you don't like something? That's a bit sociopathic.
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85 Troll Druid
13125
In your quoted post, Rygarius, it states that players who have already completed that section of the LFR will be preferentially placed into a fresh run next time they queue up.

So why isn't that happening? My monk did 3 LFRs in a row last week, completed the first one, and never did get the first boss. The second and third runs were further along than the first run (the first started at Horridon, the second and third started at Council).

And because my monk was queuing with my wife, who was queuing as a healer (both of us did all three runs), the queue times were short.... but that just leads me to believe the system isn't working as you claim. If the system is ACTUALLY trying to place us preferentially in a fresh run, it wouldn't pop in less than a minute with an in-progress run. I'd gladly wait an extra 10 or 20 minutes for a fresh run, but we don't even get the option.

Either fix the system so that it actually does look for fresh runs, or let us see how many bosses are down before we join. Otherwise, it's just going to be a waste of time (since I"m not going to stick around an in-progress run when I've already completed that portion of the LFR.... I'll just drop, take the deserter debuff, and go do something else for 30 min. Of course, that means that there will be times, like last week, where I never do get the first boss down...)
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90 Human Paladin
13215
There is one mistake Blizzard made with this change -- they stated that it would reduce queue times, when it has done no such thing; what it has done is make it far faster if people quit after a boss to get going again :)

(48m queues as DPS.) My queue is way longer than it was in DS LFR which was usually sub 20mins.
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85 Troll Druid
13125
I'll also comment that the statement that the in-progress LFR is hardly better "bang for your buck" based on valor. You don't need LFR to valor cap, and the fact that a valor cap exists means that it doesn't really matter where you get it, so long as you get it by the end of the week. I suppose if you're only doing LFR, then yeah, in-progress runs are useful, but between dailies, heroics, challenge modes, and regular raids, there's no shortage of valor to be had.

(And when I drop out of an in-progress run to go do dailies instead, I'm getting valor still... plus more gold and other things that will actually be useful to me, as opposed to the bosses I've already killed that are now useless as a result.)
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90 Tauren Warrior
0
It needs to not put you into a boss run if you've already done it unless you've already done all available.

Last week I qued up 4 times and each time zoned in on council. So much for putting me in the priority que for bosses I haven't done.
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90 Pandaren Shaman
16840
Personally, I can understand why they took away the ability to see which bosses a raid has cleared.

That said, it has yet to stop me from leaving a group and just eating the debuff if they've downed a boss I was waiting for. There are so many dailies to do, that I can easily soak up 30 minutes without a problem.


Well the problem is waiting in queue twice, so the fundamental issue isn't joining a raid with bosses down, it's having to wait twice if that happens to you. And most times, the second wait is longer.

I didn't down the first boss in ToT LFR this week because I gave up waiting for a new raid after 30 minutes or so.
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90 Human Paladin
10685
There is one mistake Blizzard made with this change -- they stated that it would reduce queue times, when it has done no such thing; what it has done is make it far faster if people quit after a boss to get going again :)

(48m queues as DPS.) My queue is way longer than it was in DS LFR which was usually sub 20mins.


Sorry, but you don't have enough information to make that judgement.

You're comparing a game with multiple LFR queues to a game with a single LFR queue. Unless the player count has multiplied at the same rate as the queues, then queue time must go up even if improvements are made. It can't possibly be less than the DS queue.

LFR queues are too long, but unless players all decide to queue for the same dungeon, we just have to suck it up. It's not something Blizzard can fix, although efforts to force players to accept the first possible run have to improve queue time (by pulling those people out of the queue and into a raid).

I hate getting an in-progress run, but I think it's better for everyone to just do it than quit and re-queue. As so many people keep saying, this is an MMO, and your actions impact others.

I'd like to see a change that players take some sort of ongoing penalty for repeated deserter buffs. Above some limit they do less damage in raids and dungeons, perhaps. Maybe it could be the ratio of completed runs to deserted runs - above 20 runs you need to maintain a ratio of 5 to 1, say.
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90 Dwarf Paladin
10355
Punishment won't fix deserters, incentive will. What incentive is there to complete your already done LFR? 45 valor and like 20g?

I can do a heroic, as a dps, have one third of the wait time, complete it in one third of the time, get justice points at the same time and get that reward.
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77 Blood Elf Paladin
10460
Worse, when you've got a new character going through an LFR -- and can't move onto the next LFR until all bosses are clear -- you sometimes have to queue for the same damn one over and over and over again until you happen across a fresh one. I ran into this problem last week on my Death Knight, and finally gave up on doing LFR altogether.


I want to highlight this.

Your first time ever should really give you a fresh run from the beginning, both so you can get the story in sequence and so you can get the achievement you need to progress to the next raid.
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90 Undead Mage
13940
The display for how many bosses were remaining had been removed from Raid Finder in Patch 5.1.

Bashiok explains the reasoning behind the change in this thread below.
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/7200302669?page=2#26

Right, so with 5.1 the game no longer tells you how many bosses are left for the group you’re being matched with for Raid Finder (LFR).

To explain why we made the change, let’s go back to the problem everyone was experiencing before. Let’s say a fresh LFR group is put together, they get two bosses down, and then wipe a few times on the third and lose 10 people who think they’re too cool for wiping. Now the group is down to 15, waiting for 10 new people, the queue eventually pops for those 10, and most of them see 2/6 and hit cancel. The raid still isn't full, the matchmaker has to go looking again for more people, and meanwhile as time ticks on people from the original run are getting more frustrated. Maybe a few of them leave, and then there’s even more spots to fill. Plenty of times everyone just gives up and the entire run falls apart, all those people are back in the queue, and they’ll be-damned if they join an in-progress run to fall apart again!

These kinds of things happen all of the time, and in the vast majority of situations it’s simply because people don’t like the idea of joining an in-progress run, even if it would have succeeded.

You may think we’re trying to be underhanded, but the reality is we’re trying to help people be more efficient with their play time. What most people don’t realize is that if they get and complete an in-progress run, the next time they queue they will preferentially be placed into a fresh instance. What everyone should be doing, to be the most efficient, is joining and sticking with their runs to completion. If they join an in-progress group they can catch up on those other couple bosses they missed immediately after, and if they have the time, they’d be wise to down the ones they've already killed again for extra Valor.

The patch has only been out a couple days of course, but personally I think there are some people who don’t realize yet how an in-progress run, and that extra Valor, can directly translate to improved items through the new upgrade system. An in-progress run is very likely better bang for the buck to your character power due to item level upgrades than hitting cancel over and over to get a fresh run and then hoping for a boss drop.

There are of course other issues that cause LFR groups to fall apart, like boss difficulty, and those are the kinds of things we’re looking at bigger solutions for. Losing a couple people doesn’t need to mean the whole run is doomed.


Even with that explenation its iritating as hell to que as dps, wait anywhere from 20 minutes to an hour+ (I waited on monday for an hour and 20 minutes) and find out you're on the last boss.

Sure I can reque and I will get priority for a fresh clear, but that will be another 20 minutes to an hour+ wait time for that fresh clear, and the fresh clear isn't even actually garunteed, just more likely.

As heals with a near instant que it isn't such a big deal, or even as tank with a really short que, but as DPS with ques that can sometimes be downright outrageous it's just a slap in the face to be brought in on the last boss.
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55 Orc Warrior
13775
The display for how many bosses were remaining had been removed from Raid Finder in Patch 5.1.

Bashiok explains the reasoning behind the change in this thread below.
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/7200302669?page=2#26

Right, so with 5.1 the game no longer tells you how many bosses are left for the group you’re being matched with for Raid Finder (LFR).

To explain why we made the change, let’s go back to the problem everyone was experiencing before. Let’s say a fresh LFR group is put together, they get two bosses down, and then wipe a few times on the third and lose 10 people who think they’re too cool for wiping. Now the group is down to 15, waiting for 10 new people, the queue eventually pops for those 10, and most of them see 2/6 and hit cancel. The raid still isn't full, the matchmaker has to go looking again for more people, and meanwhile as time ticks on people from the original run are getting more frustrated. Maybe a few of them leave, and then there’s even more spots to fill. Plenty of times everyone just gives up and the entire run falls apart, all those people are back in the queue, and they’ll be-damned if they join an in-progress run to fall apart again!

These kinds of things happen all of the time, and in the vast majority of situations it’s simply because people don’t like the idea of joining an in-progress run, even if it would have succeeded.

You may think we’re trying to be underhanded, but the reality is we’re trying to help people be more efficient with their play time. What most people don’t realize is that if they get and complete an in-progress run, the next time they queue they will preferentially be placed into a fresh instance. What everyone should be doing, to be the most efficient, is joining and sticking with their runs to completion. If they join an in-progress group they can catch up on those other couple bosses they missed immediately after, and if they have the time, they’d be wise to down the ones they've already killed again for extra Valor.

The patch has only been out a couple days of course, but personally I think there are some people who don’t realize yet how an in-progress run, and that extra Valor, can directly translate to improved items through the new upgrade system. An in-progress run is very likely better bang for the buck to your character power due to item level upgrades than hitting cancel over and over to get a fresh run and then hoping for a boss drop.

There are of course other issues that cause LFR groups to fall apart, like boss difficulty, and those are the kinds of things we’re looking at bigger solutions for. Losing a couple people doesn’t need to mean the whole run is doomed.


with the new determination buff this seems unnecessary now
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90 Human Paladin
13215
Sorry, but you don't have enough information to make that judgement. You're comparing a game with multiple LFR queues to a game with a single LFR queue. Unless the player count has multiplied at the same rate as the queues, then queue time must go up even if improvements are made. It can't possibly be less than the DS queue.


The fact that your experience does not match mine in no way makes my experience any less valid or truthful than your own.

In my experience, my queue times are longer than they were previously.

What you experience has no relevance to my own observations.
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